# I'm no longer a Jew. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 14, 2010, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727 "2010-09-14T14:40:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/21 "2010-09-14T17:23:14Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > > [@Cartooniverse](#): > > > > [This Is Not How Jews Behave](http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hV-3mbsgikznLMNAy48FeFrXrmFAD9I6VNMG0). > > > > This is not what Jews do. We do not throw human beings away because their very presence will dilute the purity of the Jewishness of Israel. > > > > The video footage of the [Israeli Parliment politician](http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/world/2010/09/14/hancocks.me.children.in.limbo.cnn?hpt=C2) waving his arms and decrying the kids’ right to remain in the country where they were born is so eerily reminiscent of Leni Riefenstahl as to be, well, facist. The Jewishness of Israel ?? REALLY ??? > > > > Fuck you, you political fascist. Fuck you, you inhuman **and** inhumane bastard. You want to live in a state where you get to exclude anyone who is not just like you and yours? Cool- neonazis are everywhere in Europe and North America. Go, move your family, start a compound, raise a flag and be what you are. > > > > I was born an ethnic Jew and that is inescapable. My last name is a Tribal name. As far as how I identify myself? No. I am no longer a Jew. Jews do not do this to other human beings. > > > > That’s what Nazis do. > > > > :mad: > > > > Cartooniverse > > Are you going to renounce your American citizenship as well ? Why would he? America doesn’t do this. If you are born in the US, you are a US citizen, period. That’s guaranteed by the Consitution. We don’t deport native born children if we don’t like their race. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/22 "2010-09-14T17:35:23Z")
And he has no shame doing this during the Ten Days of Repentance (between Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur). I thought we were supposed to be especially good during this time, not to act like Nazis and Know-Nothings. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/23 "2010-09-14T17:39:00Z")
I don’t think it’s fair to characterize this as something being done by “Jews,” it’s being done by a partical faction in Israel. It’s basically the Israeli equivalent of American teabaggers. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/24 "2010-09-14T17:43:38Z")
I thought this was about a shiksa ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/25 "2010-09-14T17:44:44Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > > > Are you going to renounce your American citizenship as well ? > > Why would he? America doesn’t do this. If you are born in the US, you are a US citizen, period. That’s guaranteed by the Consitution. We don’t deport native born children if we don’t like their race. You do deport illegal aliens (of the Mexican race) regardless if their children are US citizens. You think their mothers will abandon them? The whole anchor baby scenario is bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/26 "2010-09-14T17:55:03Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > Why would he? America doesn’t do this. If you are born in the US, you are a US citizen, period. That’s guaranteed by the Consitution. We don’t deport native born children if we don’t like their race. > > You do deport illegal aliens (of the Mexican race) regardless if their children are US citizens. You think their mothers will abandon them? > > The whole anchor baby scenario is bullshit. That is a different scenario than what’s being described in the OP. We don’t do what’s being described in the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/27 "2010-09-14T18:31:35Z")
True. However, just because the U.S. does something a certain way, doesn’t make it a universal right. If you want to open a GD thread titled “Resolved: people have a universal right to automatic citizenship of their country birth”, go right ahead; otherwise, accept that immigration laws differ from country to country. At this point, I’m almost certain these kids won’t be deported, anyway. They’ll figure something out. Everybody will shout a lot, some sort of improvised legal and political solution will be found (to allow everyone to save face), and eventually, everything will work out. It’s how we do things around here. Incidentally: I have mixed feelings about the whole affair, fueled to a large degree by my loathing for certain groups and individuals on both sides of the argument. I’ve succeeded in avoiding arguing about it until now - no mean feat in Tel Aviv - so I’m not going to start now. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/28 "2010-09-14T18:34:08Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > That is a different scenario than what’s being described in the OP. We don’t do what’s being described in the OP. So, what \*do \*we do? Even if the child is a citizen, they can’t sponsor a parent until they’re 21. So ISTM the parents are getting deported anyway, and the kid will probably get taken with them. I fail to see how this is \*so \*much better, other than the kid having U.S. citizenship. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/29 "2010-09-14T18:40:52Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > Sorry, Israel, but you’re living in a global world here. Unless you’re planning on building a huge honking wall and cutting your whole country off from the rest of the world, Um, they are. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/30 "2010-09-14T18:44:51Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > That is a different scenario than what’s being described in the OP. We don’t do what’s being described in the OP. > > So, what \*do \*we do? Why do we have to do anything? > [@](#): > > Even if the child is a citizen, they can’t sponsor a parent until they’re 21. So ISTM the parents are getting deported anyway, and the kid will probably get taken with them. I fail to see how this is \*so \*much better, other than the kid having U.S. citizenship. I think this scenario rarely happens. We deport only a very small percentage of the total, and I think that those with natural born children are typically allowed to stay, but even if this were to happen, the kid still is not losing his citizenship. He can still come back (if he leaves with the parents at all, most likely he would stay with relatives/friends or become award of the state), and will always be a US citizen. We don’t revoke the citizenship itself. It’s the denial of citizenship on the basis of nothing but race (and the racial purity motivtion is explicit and avowed) that’s unethical. You are also overlooking the fact that the kid may NOT have a right to enter the country of his parents’ origin. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/31 "2010-09-14T18:47:03Z")
I’m rather afraid, **Cartooniverse** , that you’ll have to go further if you want to avoid identification with nasty people. Something along the lines of _I am no longer a human, I am a Marabou stork_ or _I am no longer a human, I am a Thomson’s gazelle_ might help to ease your troubled mind. Or it might not. (Who knows what some of those storks get up to)? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/32 "2010-09-14T18:47:46Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > True. However, just because the U.S. does something a certain way, doesn’t make it a universal right. I didn’t say it was a universal right, I was merely rebutting an assertion that America does the same thing. It was a factual correction, nothing more. I am certainly allowed my opinion on the ethics of it, though. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/33 "2010-09-14T18:48:48Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Why do we have to do anything? I’m not talking about what immigration policy in the U.S. \*should \*be. I’m talking about what it _is_. And it’s my understanding that the so-called “anchor babies” are a complete fucking red herring, because even if someone is living here without authorization and has a child, that child will have \*no bearing \*on whether or not they’re allowed to stay. > [@](#): > > I think this scenario rarely happens. We deport only a very small percentage of the total, and I think that those with natural born children are typically allowed to stay, but even if this were to happen, the kid still is not losing his citizenship. He can still come back (if he leaves with the parents at all, most likely he would stay with relatives/friends or become award of the state), and will always be a US citizen. We don’t revoke the citizenship itself. It’s the denial of citizenship on the basis of nothing but race (and the racial purity motivtion is explicit and avowed) that’s unethical. I still fail to see what’s so much better about “we’ll kick out your parents and probably you, too, but you can come back in 20 years” that you feel the need to get all puffed up about it. My point is, our immigration policy is better than Israel’s in that respect, but not that much better. The kids are still, _at best_, being separated from their parents, and in all likelihood being kicked out with them. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/34 "2010-09-14T18:54:32Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > Sorry, Israel, but you’re living in a global world here. Unless you’re planning on building a huge honking wall and cutting your whole country off from the rest of the world, people are going to come and go from your country, and that’s a _good_ thing. There are any number of groups that are always crying about losing their culture; I think that culture evolves and changes, and the good, strong parts will stay, and the rest will change into something else. I don’t think trying to force a culture to remain stagnant works very well. Tell that to [Saudi Arabia](http://www.justlanded.com/english/Saudi-Arabia/Saudi-Arabia-Guide/Visas-Permits/Citizenship) They seem to manage quite well. I expect the concept of guaranteed citizenship simply by birth to be absent in most of the middle east. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/35 "2010-09-14T18:55:39Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > Why do we have to do anything? > > I’m not talking about what immigration policy in the U.S. \*should \*be. I’m talking about what it _is_. And it’s my understanding that the so-called “anchor babies” are a complete fucking red herring, because even if someone is living here without authorization and has a child, that child will have \*no bearing \*on whether or not they’re allowed to stay. This is simply incorrect. The child is allowed to stay here, period. The child is a US citizen. > [@](#): > > I still fail to see what’s so much better about "we’ll kick out your parents and probably you, too There is no “probably you too.” We don’t kick out the children, period. I don’t think we typically even kick out the parents. You’re building a strawman. > [@](#): > > My point is, our immigration policy is better than Israel’s in that respect, but not that much better. The kids are still, _at best_, being separated from their parents, and in all likelihood being kicked out with them. Except that this is not something we typically do. The kids are also not immigrants, they are citizens, so immigration policy has nothing to do with their own status. Can you show me a single real world example of parents actua;;y being deported and taking their US born children with them? I doubt you can. Even if you could, it’s not a defense of anything in Israel, so what the hell is your point? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/36 "2010-09-14T18:57:22Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > > [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > > > Sorry, Israel, but you’re living in a global world here. Unless you’re planning on building a huge honking wall and cutting your whole country off from the rest of the world, people are going to come and go from your country, and that’s a _good_ thing. There are any number of groups that are always crying about losing their culture; I think that culture evolves and changes, and the good, strong parts will stay, and the rest will change into something else. I don’t think trying to force a culture to remain stagnant works very well. > > Tell that to [Saudi Arabia](http://www.justlanded.com/english/Saudi-Arabia/Saudi-Arabia-Guide/Visas-Permits/Citizenship) They seem to manage quite well. > > I expect the concept of guaranteed citizenship simply by birth to be absent in most of the middle east. So move to the Middle East, if that’s how you think things should be. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/37 "2010-09-14T19:11:53Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > > > I’m not talking about what immigration policy in the U.S. \*should \*be. I’m talking about what it _is_. And it’s my understanding that the so-called “anchor babies” are a complete fucking red herring, because even if someone is living here without authorization and has a child, that child will have \*no bearing \*on whether or not they’re allowed to stay. > > This is simply incorrect. The child is allowed to stay here, period. The child is a US citizen. Sorry, “they’re allowed” meant “the parents are allowed,” not the children. Undocumented parents with a U.S. citizen child are in exactly the same boat as undocumented parents with no child, or with a child who is also undocumented. > [@](#): > > There is no “probably you too.” We don’t kick out the children, period. I don’t think we typically even kick out the parents. You’re building a strawman. Sorry if your brain couldn’t handle the ambiguity of phrasing, there. My intention, as I thought was clear from everything else I was saying, was, “We’ll kick your parents out, which in effect means we’ll be kicking you out, too, since they’ll probably take you with, with the alternative being that you go into some sort of foster care, with relatives \*if \*you’re lucky.” > [@](#): > > Except that this is not something we typically do. The kids are also not immigrants, they are citizens, so immigration policy has nothing to do with their own status. Can you show me a single real world example of parents actua;;y being deported and taking their US born children with them? I doubt you can. I don’t even know why I’m bothering, because you have a chronic history on this board of ignoring any evidence that doesn’t fit the Dio Model of How the World Works. But here goes. I did [a Google search for _parents deported_](http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source=hp&q=parents+deported) and pulled a handful of the links off the first page of returns: [Children face difficult decision when immigrant parents deported](http://www.miracoalition.org/press/general-news/children-face-difficult-decision-when-immigrant-parents-deported) [100,000-plus Citizen Children Find Parents Deported](http://serrano.house.gov/NewsDetail.aspx?ID=553) [American Children, Deported Parents; Offspring Confront Painful Decision: U.S. Life or Family](http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-7443922.html) [Families face wrenching decisions when immigrant parents deported](http://www.tucsonsentinel.com/local/report/083010_divided_families) [Study: Kids hurt when legal immigrant parents deported](http://blogs.chron.com/immigration/archives/2010/04/study_kids_trau.html) **Go fight your ignorance.** Learn that having a child who is a citizen has absolutely \*no bearing \*on whether or not someone in this country without authorization is deported. Judges are \*not allowed \*to take family unity into account. That means that once the parents are being kicked out, the kids have to decide to go with or stay with people other than their parents. > [@](#): > > Even if you could, it’s not a defense of anything in Israel, so what the hell is your point? My point is you need to get off your high horse talking about how much “better” the U.S. is than Israel, since we don’t do anything like that here. Because we _do_, in fact, do something \*similar \*here–we just also give the kids citizenship, so we don’t \*actively \*deport them. But we don’t allow their parents to stay, which effectively kicks the kids out, anyway, or at least splits up their families. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/38 "2010-09-14T19:24:28Z")
No, we don’t do anything similar. At all. And the kids typically stay. I still don’t see how any of this is a defense of Israel. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/39 "2010-09-14T19:27:12Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > > > Are you going to renounce your American citizenship as well ? > > Why would he? America doesn’t do this. If you are born in the US, you are a US citizen, period. That’s guaranteed by the Consitution. We don’t deport native born children if we don’t like their race. Knock wood. **kaylasdad99** : ☹ that he feels he has to knock wood on that statement ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727/40 "2010-09-14T19:30:54Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > True. However, just because the U.S. does something a certain way, doesn’t make it a universal right. If you want to open a GD thread titled “Resolved: people have a universal right to automatic citizenship of their country birth”, go right ahead; \ No point. The question is not up for debate because the [del]proposition[/del] fact is not debatable. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-no-longer-a-jew/553727.md?page=3)