# I'm not renewing my subscription. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 6, 2006, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521 "2006-04-06T02:54:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/61 "2006-04-06T15:45:21Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Aw, stick around. I want to read your reaction when the Democrats retake Capitol Hill. You’re an amusing fellow. Absolutely, Moto. I agree with this one hunnerd percent. You’ve stuck it out long enough holding on the shit end of the stick. Hang around for a little longer and I’m certain the pendulum will swing the other way. The reason the lefties are so vocal is simply because they’ve got so much to be vocal about. By any honest measure, the Republican-controlled Congress and Executive legislation, policy and initiatives have been eminently blastable. Overall that is. On any single issue, certain aspects are debatable from both an ideological and an intellectual standpoint, of course. But the total sum of the Republican-controlled government to date work has been pretty crappy. That’s why the attacks from the lefties are non-stop; they’ve been provided with plenty of fodder. Another thing that can be honestly admitted, is that the lefties here do raise good points many times. Those can lead to an investigation of the facts, a lessening of one’s ideological insularity, and perhaps on occasion even a revision of one’s opinion. These are all good outcomes, even if the impetus for them might be uncomfortable from time to time. If after the mid-term elections, the Democrats take control of the Congress though, we can watch all thatr righteous indignation blow up in their faces. Probably. I sincerely hope it doesn’t and that the Democratic party sticks to the ideals they’ve so loudly claimed to own, but I ain’t hopeful politicians being politicians. You’ve stuck out the storm, stay for the afermath; it’s gonna be a wild ride. And just remember, whatever shit is said here, or goes on here, it has a vanishingly small effect after you’ve logged off. If you choose not to though, and I certainly can’t blame you if you don’t, be well my friend. ---
**Author:** ![Binarydrone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Binarydrone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Binarydrone)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/62 "2006-04-06T15:46:13Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > …Yes, **Hentor** is demonstrating yet again how a small number of assholes can drag a place down… Pot, kettle. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/63 "2006-04-06T15:52:55Z")
I for one don’t want Moto to go away. It would be so boring if everyone on the Dope had the same opinions and ideas. I argue with him too, but that doesn’t make me dislike HIM. Moto, if yer still around, just take a break. Go fishing. Then come back. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/64 "2006-04-06T15:56:07Z")
Well said, **Uncle Beer** and I agree. Does anyone else find it ironic that even in this thread the side swiping still goes on? It seems that moral superiority is a last redoubt for the conservatives posting here. Is it irresistable–the urge to get a dig in? So much for the dismay at both sides talking past each other. Are things that bitter? Maybe among the pols, but here? I hope not. It’s not for me, anyway. I may loathe a poster’s position on X issue, but be in accord with them in another forum or even another Pit thread. I am not unique in this in the least-so why the vitriol in this thread? Are people pissy just because? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![AtomicDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@AtomicDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AtomicDog)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/65 "2006-04-06T15:59:02Z")
Doorknob, hit, split. Fill in the rest yourself. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/66 "2006-04-06T16:03:22Z")
> [@eleanorigby](#): > > Is it irresistable–the urge to get a dig in? So much for the dismay at both sides talking past each other. Are things that bitter? Maybe among the pols, but here? > > I hope not. It’s not for me, anyway. I may loathe a poster’s position on X issue, but be in accord with them in another forum or even another Pit thread. I am not unique in this in the least-so why the vitriol in this thread? Are people pissy just because? Oh, I don’t know about “just because”…but I do know I’m still plenty pissed with all the warmongering, cheerleading fucks that have led to the current disasters in Iraq and Afghanistan. For instance: [IRAQ DEATH TOLL IN THIRD YEAR OF OCCUPATION IS HIGHEST YET](http://www.iraqbodycount.net/press/pr13.php) ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/67 "2006-04-06T16:04:03Z")
> [@eleanorigby](#): > > I hope not. It’s not for me, anyway. I may loathe a poster’s position on X issue, but be in accord with them in another forum or even another Pit thread. I am not unique in this in the least-so why the vitriol in this thread? Are people pissy just because? > > 😕 For me, it has absolutely nothing to do w/ **Moto’s** POV, his posting history or anything else. I don’t care for these “I’m leaving” threads. in the “posters gone” thread, I’m reminded of any number of folks whom I miss, notably **jodi** , a staunch conservative, I admired and respected her. And continue to do so, since AFAIK, she never posted an “I’m leaving” thread (yea, she stopped posting while studying for the bar, but that was different). ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/68 "2006-04-06T16:09:54Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > I certainly feel that way when “debates” here are in reality two sides talking past each other, with neither side being convinced at any time to change their mind. Isn’t this typical of all discourse, though? True persuasion is rare, and takes a long time. And usually a person has to come around for themselves. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/69 "2006-04-06T16:12:30Z")
Good luck **Mr. Moto**. I think I agree with the gist of what you say in your OP. The Conservatives on the board are very Conservative and the Liberals are very Liberal. I am one of the moderates. I think there are more of us than you realize but most are smarter than me and stay out of the pit where both the Right and the Left will attack the middle in some threads. I am very anti-Bush/Cheney so I constantly get accused of being another lefty, unless I am posting very pro of the military in a thread and then I get called a conservative. I wish more moderates would speak up. There is not a lot of give and take it the pit threads, but isn’t that the nature of the pit? I think having multiple points of view on the board is important, I would like to see more people willing to occasionally concede points however. Jim ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/70 "2006-04-06T16:42:05Z")
I’ll always remember you for how you started a pit thread whining about how the use of the word retarded was deeply insulting to all people of lower than average intelligence… which might have been a fair point… if it hadn’t been started “totally coincidentally” right after I called some claim of yours retarded. It was a classic bit of the unintentionally ironic pissy crybabiness that I’ll always treasure. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/71 "2006-04-06T16:53:07Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > Oh, I don’t know about “just because”…but I do know I’m still plenty pissed with all the warmongering, cheerleading fucks that have led to the current disasters in Iraq and Afghanistan. You misunderstand me. I was referring to the constant snipes at those perceived as not conservative in this thread–so far, our intelligence and morals have been derided, as well as our ability to express complete thoughts. It’s petty and small minded and shabby, IMO. Not every adversary is an enemy, but maybe to the conservatives here it seems that way. I don’t know. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/72 "2006-04-06T16:58:50Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > How about instead of pissing on **Moto** swan song, you either pit me or just fucko off? Naw, a pathetic lying asshole like you doesn’t deserve a whole thread all to himself. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/73 "2006-04-06T17:03:32Z")
> [@eleanorigby](#): > > I was referring to the constant snipes at those perceived as not conservative in this thread–so far, our intelligence and morals have been derided, as well as our ability to express complete thoughts. It’s petty and small minded and shabby, IMO. as opposed to the thoughtful and considerate sniping that **some** conservatives here engage in? the reality is that **all** sides have their own assholes. By sheer numbers, (generally considered to be liberals) outnumber the (generally considered to be conservatives) so I will cede that it certainly can appear at times to have nothing but partisan sniping. but there’s no shortage of consderate, thoughtful posters of all persuasions here. your statement above seems to portray that **only** conservatives get that type of treatment. and it simply 'taint true at all. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/74 "2006-04-06T17:11:22Z")
I was (and did refer) referring only to this thread. I am aware that the door swings both ways. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/75 "2006-04-06T17:17:52Z")
> [@eleanorigby](#): > > I was (and did refer) referring only to this thread. I am aware that the door swings both ways. Just like in Ghostbusters! Seriously, though, don’t stay away too long, **Mr. Moto**. We need assholes like you on the right to keep us assholes here on the left honest. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/76 "2006-04-06T17:32:02Z")
Self Deprecation +10 “I’m not an attention whore, but…” -55 Pointing out there are idiots on a message board +.5 “I’m in the minority here” -10 Understanding that there are idiots on both sides of the political spectrum +15 Thinking it’s any different now from when he joined -15 Stating that it’s probably his lack of patience +20 Overall believability -30. I’ll have to get a calculator to add this all up… ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/77 "2006-04-06T18:06:08Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > Naw, a pathetic lying asshole like you doesn’t deserve a whole thread all to himself. Oh, you’re right, I only gave you two options. So feel free to follow this modified list of options: 1. Fucko off 2. Start a pit thread to share with everyone your evidence to support the charge that I am a liar (Believe me folks, that’ll be a hoot!) 3. Continue to be a clutch and hang around in this thread obsessing about me without even pretending to express an opinion about the actual OP. If you keep going with Option 3, however, people will expect us to be picking out china patterns soon. Not that you aren’t a wonderful person and all… ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/78 "2006-04-06T18:13:37Z")
Moto: why leave? If you think it’s a generally a good place but just don’t want to participate in the partisan sniping, just don’t participate! Ignore the political threads for a while. Answer questions you know in GQ and talk about movies you like in CS. Talk about your cats in MPSIMS, whatever. The annoyance you’re feeling is exactly why I avoid politics and religion as topics a great deal both here and in real life. If you feel like it later, you can always jump back in. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/79 "2006-04-06T18:21:24Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > Not that you aren’t a wonderful person and all… He is, you aren’t! End of story. Cheers, **Banquet Bear**! Please, have a bottle of DB Export Dry on me. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2006, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521/80 "2006-04-06T18:47:25Z")
Politics is a persuasive art. Long ago, I used to write op-eds and volunteer for campaigns. I even worked for a time for a PR firm that handled a lot of political clients. And when I came up with arguments for these various tasks, I tried at all times to come up with ones that most people would find persuasive, if not convincing. The folks I worked for (including myself) wouldn’t have stood for anything else. In here, though, the necessity to persuade isn’t really there. Most people are pretty convinced on both sides. And as politics in general has gotten nastier, persuasion gives way to mere point-scoring here. Much as I deplore this general trend, I especially deplore the ease with which I engaged in the same behavior. While I hardly think I’ve been the worst practitioner of this, I’ve still been pretty bad. I love politics, and I love arguing about politics. I love researching political issues and writing about them. I’d really like to get back to that, in some way. I don’t think I can do it here. This place feeds some of my worst instincts. I’ll freely admit that this is due in the greatest measure to some shortcomings on my own part. That is why I’m doing this without any bad feelings toward the board in general, and I do wish everyone else here well. I appreciate the advice to just devote my attention to other parts of the board. I don’t think that is workable. I have a job and a wife and three very small children. The time I can devote to things like this is pretty limited, and this board does take up a good bit of my limited leisure. And as I said, I do want to continue writing about and studying politics and current affairs. These matters continue to hold the greatest share of my interest. Of my five magazine subscriptions, three are devoted to these subjects. So, I’m going to continue to be a conservative, somewhat traditionalist, partisan Republican. I’m just going to try to be these things in a way that is more in keeping with my polite and reserved nature IRL. I’m also going to see if I can engage in activities that can persuade more people directly than I’ve been able to do here, through things like grassroots organizing. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-not-renewing-my-subscription/351521.md?page=5)