Nope. You were the one that claimed all the violence and murder coming from the right is a direct response to the violence and murder from the left. Yet only one side is actively killing the other, and it started long before any of the current groups were even a gleam in a right-fetishist’s eye.
You made the claim, don’t back out now. Own it! Show those filthy liberals how truth, justice, and the American Way will win the day!
…you didn’t fucking correct me. It wasn’t until 1965, the Voters Right Act and the introduction of federal oversight that black people truly got the right to vote. You concede that much in your initial response to me. Even today people are actively trying to disenfranchise the black vote. So don’t pretend that the “correction” you made changes my point. They were bought to your country in chains. They are still fighting voter ID legislation and gerrymandering. Black people had nothing to do with drafting of the 1st Amendment.
And you want to lecture me on the history of abuse and oppression? Are you being fucking serious? I don’t need a reminder. My family lived through it. Some died because of it. The United States is not the only nation with a history of abuse and oppression. But it is the only country that is called the United States of Fucking America: and this thread is about the US of A, Black Lives Matters, and the first amendment. So if you want to discuss what happened to my ancestors then start that thread and I’ll join you. But as you’ve just confirmed: you don’t really give a shit: so I don’t expect that to happen.
Stop acting so stupidly and dishonestly. Where have I ever made that claim you claim I made?
Do people really need to type out 20 paragraphs of disclaimers and qualifying remarks before making a statement? :rolleyes:
Seriously. Not every particular event is linked directly to the entire history of the world. You can have a particular act linked to a particular set of other acts without needing to start from the Big Bang.
Who cares if black people had anything to do with the 1st amendment? Neither did the Chinese or Japanese or any other random group or nationality. While here in the USA, however, it should apply equally to all.
…you are entirely correct. It isn’t just about black people. Which is why I mentioned Indigenous Americans. Women. You are correct to bring up the Chinese and the Japanese. It was white men who drafted the constitution: who drafted the 1st amendment. But that happened centuries ago. Its a different world now. America is a great big “melting pot.” Technology has changed. How we communicate has changed. Who has the power to make their voice heard in your society has changed. Its the perfect time to have a discussion about the first amendment and the impact that it has on all elements of your society.
… except she did kind of correct you. If you want to be taken seriously a discussion, you should avoid saying things that are false. If you meant that blacks only de facto had the right to vote as of the Voting Rights Act, that’s what you should have said.
Frankly, you come across as someone whose opinions about the US don’t necessarily jibe with their knowledge of the facts on the ground here.
And even that (the last bit) is debatable. Almost all of the accusations about millions dying because of changes made to deal with environmental concerns by the right (in the USA) are poppycock.
If the issue is about other environmental regulations killing people, those are also not as clear as some sources report it.
…when you say things like “kind of correct me” you are weaseling out of the fact that she kind of really didn’t. This is exactly the kind of thing I’m talking about. It makes you comfortable to think that black people had the “de facto” right to vote for the majority of the existence of the United States of America. The reality? Not so important for you.
The validity of an idea doesn’t depend on the color, ethnicity, religion, gender, political party, etc. of the person expressing it.
Yes there is and who cares what the body count of Antifa is? They engage in violence to shut down people’s fundamental rights. I don’t feel bad when they get violence in return. It’s like those people who were offended that that one girl got punched in the beak at one of these Antifa instigated melees. Why were people offended when she got consequenced?
If you form a mob and attack people over their political point of view why the outrage when violence gets met with violence? Again, do we really want to go the route of who can bring the most violent mob is the only group to have rights?
Antifa hasn’t run anyone down with a car. Antifa hasn’t opened fire on people that disagree with them. Strangely enough, Antifa wasn’t even THERE on those occasions.
You’re blaming left wing violence while the right wing is actively trying to kill people. THERE’S NO COMPETITION FOR WHICH SIDE IS MOST VIOLENT. But hey, let’s compare bike locks to cars and wine bottles to bullets. Both sides are the same, and Heather Heyer had it coming. You still try to argue that the left has started it, when every historical record clearly shows right wing violence is the most dangerous domestic threat in the US.
Well if that’s what you meant, then that’s what you should have said. Don’t blame me because you didn’t make it clear what you were talking about.
MY reply was not to minimize what has happened to people in this country, nor what has happened in others. I got the impression from you that you believed the US was unique in its history of oppression from this particular remark:
And:
If I was wrong, I apologize.
Do I think BLM and/or others should “shut up”? Fuck, no. But I do not believe others should be told to shut up either. Support for freedom of speech is not a support for hate and I’m sick of people implying that it is. If anything, freedom of speech has been used to FIGHT oppression.
I don’t think political violence from either side is a good thing at this point of time in the USA. All I’m saying is if people engage in political violence don’t be surprised when people get hurt.
Yeah, look at what happened to those poor slaver confederates when Sherman marched over them. They were blameless and pure for sure! I’m sure that the followers of those that want to protect their peculiar institution’s heritage are peaceniks and are not tossing gasoline into the fire. [/sarcasm]
So the problem is people seeking to engage political violence were met with political violence? I’m not seeing the problem when a mob that looks for a fight gets a fight.
I already cited that people like the fascists did plan to seek violence, do you have a cite that Heather Heyer was doing the same? Or you just do not care that protesters of the bigots had their free speech rights denied by the use of direct violence?