# I'm pitting the woman at a town hall who yelled "Heil Hitler" at a Jew. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 18, 2009, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900 "2009-08-18T23:55:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/201 "2009-08-20T17:52:24Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Can I get either **Scylla** or **Bricker** to answer my question about whether Sarah Palin is representative of the fringe or the mainstream? Palin is Lieberman. By that I mean that Lieberman found himself out of step with most Democrats on the issue of war, so much so that shortly after being selected as the VP candidate for the presidential race, he lost a party primary in his own state! So, too, with Palin. Despite the fact that she was the VP candidate, prior to her selection she had no national profile or reputation as a conservative opinion-setter. So while there’s no bright-line demarcation between fringe and mainstream, I’d say she’s on the fringe edge of mainstream or the mainstream edge of fringe: close to the line, in other words, and in either case not someone who is responsible for policy formation or development. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/202 "2009-08-20T18:01:58Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Yes, if one, single gun toter is black, that means none of the others are racist. Great logic. … Remember, Obama’s a Halfrican American so Whites and Blacks can hate him for his race. Limbaugh logic! CMC fnord! BTW RE your ETA ya might have some [catching-up](http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/08/ernest_hancock_viper_militia_gun_obama_event.php?ref=fpa) to do. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/203 "2009-08-20T18:22:40Z")
Jesus Marimba, that guys does for ugly what Stonehenge does for rocks! ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/204 "2009-08-20T19:27:54Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Well, they’re not alone. > > [Here is a YouTube’d](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYKQJ4-N7LI) clip from MSNBC. At about 40 seconds in, they show a man, edited to show only his body from the shoulders down, carrying a rifle at one of the events we’ve discussed. The commentator says, “There are questions about whether this has racial overtones. I mean here you have a man of color in the presidency and white people showing up with guns …” > > Well, that’s reasonable. > > Except if you look at these [pictures.](http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/PHXBeat/60504) > > Now, extra credit for students of logic: does my observation constitute a _tu quoque_? Why or why not? Ah, I must look like Keith Olbermann to you. While the physical similarities are striking, I can assure you, I am not him. I have no interest in defending MSNBC, although I will a little anyway. Actually, I’m not defending them so much as I’m going to briefly smack talk all 24-hour news networks. The whole 24-hour non-news news-feed is ridiculous, and breaking stories seem to all be emanating from random Twitter accounts more frequently than from primary sources. Remember the guy who recently faked a famous obit quote (I forget for who) and posted it on WikiPedia, then everyone reported on it as though it were true? No one bothered to look into because we need to broadcast the latest information now! Facts forthcoming (maybe). CNN has this I-Report business where literally any schlub with a camera phone can report (without pay, of course) for CNN about any silly thing that goes on at their local Dairy Queen. It’s ridiculous, they all take scraps from YouTube videos and run wild with third-hand gossip. Some, of course, more than others. But Fox, oh Fox. Even at the height of Code Pink power-stalking W, I don’t think I ever heard, say, Monica Novotny ask a question like, “Why does President Bush hate freedom so much, and hope to suppress the voice of everyday Americans?” If I ever did, I would have spit out my bourbon. I’ve never seen Alex Witt turn anyone’s mic off because she found her guest’s statements to be disagreeable. Hell, I’ve never even seen Olbermann do that. Though to be honest, I don’t think I’ve ever seen him bring on anyone who disagrees with him. His guests seem to always place their heads squarely up his self-satisfied asshole. Brief tangent: Remember when Cronkite died? We had a bunch of reporters sitting around the table saying things like, “Boy those were the days when reporters actually fact-checked and were unbiased. You know, were actually good at their jobs.” And then we all thought to ourselves, “It’s a pity you’re in a position where there’s absolutely nothing you can do about it!” ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/205 "2009-08-20T19:29:51Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > So while there’s no bright-line demarcation between fringe and mainstream, I’d say she’s on the fringe edge of mainstream or the mainstream edge of fringe: close to the line, in other words, and in either case not someone who is responsible for policy formation or development. That’s half an answer, at least. The party’s VP nominee is almost on the fringe. But not so far out that her “Obama would have killed my baby” comments disqualify her from a claim to the mainstream, in your view. Now how about some prominent examples of who you consider to be mainstream Republicans, and their views of health care reform? They are, of course, in such stark contrast, and their numbers are by definition so vastly greater, that it shouldn’t be a problem for you at all. Right? ---
**Author:** ![Rhythmdvl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/206 "2009-08-20T19:49:13Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Palin is Lieberman. > > By that I mean that Lieberman found himself out of step with most Democrats on the issue of war, so much so that shortly after being selected as the VP candidate for the presidential race, he lost a party primary in his own state! > > So, too, with Palin. Despite the fact that she was the VP candidate, prior to her selection she had no national profile or reputation as a conservative opinion-setter. So while there’s no bright-line demarcation between fringe and mainstream, I’d say she’s on the fringe edge of mainstream or the mainstream edge of fringe: close to the line, in other words, and in either case not someone who is responsible for policy formation or development. Palin is the political manifestation of the talk radio/Fox news Zeitgeist. She wholly captures the essence of their rhetoric, analytic consistency, and logical gymnastics. This does not denigrate any conservative opinion or belief; she and George Will may be in complete agreement over something, and I share some of her ostensible foundational positions. But she is the choice of the Rush generation. Given their appeal and growth, she is not fringe. Coulter is not fringe, she is a best selling author (to her base). Hannity is not fringe. None of them are. They have, through the power of mass media, expanded their voice and influence throughout the party. She is a product of their communicative culture. On a side thought, I wonder if Bachmann feels about Palin as Hilary did (supposedly) about Barak. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@Captain\_Carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Carrot)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/207 "2009-08-20T21:46:34Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Palin is Lieberman. > > By that I mean that Lieberman found himself out of step with most Democrats on the issue of war, so much so that shortly after being selected as the VP candidate for the presidential race, he lost a party primary in his own state! And by ‘shortly’, you mean ‘six years’? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/208 "2009-08-20T21:49:17Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > But Fox, oh Fox. Even at the height of Code Pink power-stalking W, I don’t think I ever heard, say, Monica Novotny ask a question like, “Why does President Bush hate freedom so much, and hope to suppress the voice of everyday Americans?” If I ever did, I would have spit out my bourbon. I’ve never seen Alex Witt turn anyone’s mic off because she found her guest’s statements to be disagreeable. _cough_ Rachel Maddow _cough_ _cough_ ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/209 "2009-08-20T21:50:19Z")
> [@Captain\_Carrot](#): > > And by ‘shortly’, you mean ‘six years’? The very next time he had to run, which was in fact six years. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@Captain\_Carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Carrot)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/210 "2009-08-20T21:54:34Z")
That’s not what ‘shortly’ means. Sorry. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/211 "2009-08-20T22:08:17Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > _cough_ Rachel Maddow _cough_ _cough_ She’s far more fair and respectful of her guests than K.O., so **CITE?** ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/212 "2009-08-20T22:26:09Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > Nitpick: Israelites were ancient people (or if you want, a lineage that’s been carried down), Israelis are the modern people from the state of Israel. > [@wierdaaron](#): > > I had a feeling that would be the case, but I thought perhaps Israeli is only an adjective and Israelite is a noun. Strange, perhaps, that they don’t want to be associated with ancient Israel, since.. they are.. same place. The “t” and “e” at the end got eroded off over the millennia. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![wierdaaron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/eada6e/32.png) [@wierdaaron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wierdaaron)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/213 "2009-08-20T22:29:23Z")
> [@ArchiveGuy](#): > > She’s far more fair and respectful of her guests than K.O., so **CITE?** She’s like a harmless little kitten. A snarky, good-spirited kitten. She lets Pat Buchanan say white people are better because the founding fathers were all white, and only makes fun of him for it afterwords. The thought of her yelling at someone or cutting their mic makes me giggle. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/214 "2009-08-20T22:36:47Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > _cough_ Rachel Maddow _cough_ _cough_ So, have you ever watched Maddow? Because you seem to be insinuating facts not in evidence. Sort of how you slipped in a stupid lie about Plame in the Novak thread. I think you might just be a dishonest turd. Say it ain’t so! Of course I could be wrong. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/215 "2009-08-20T22:57:09Z")
You would be wrong. Friend **Bricker** plays by lawyers rules, which means that you must carefully parse the words for umbras and penumbras. He won’t outright lie, but if you aren’t on your toes, he’ll slip an innuendo, an inference and a suggestion past your mental goalie and SCORE! Then you get in your highest dudgeon, storm back in to confront the miscreant, and no, no, if you examine those words very precisely, this one doesn’t _quite_ mean that, and that one doesn’t _quite_ mean this… Now, if you phrase your question with _exact_ precision, and pursue it with Perry Mason tenacity, he’ll break down on the witness stand and, yes, it was him, in the library, with the candlestick. So, not a lie, perzackly. He’s one of a number of posters here whom I suspect were educated by Jesuits. PS: Did you know that, by my count, there are about a _dozen_ self-confessed lawyers on the Boards! ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/216 "2009-08-20T23:16:24Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > PS: Did you know that, by my count, there are about a _dozen_ self-confessed lawyers on the Boards! Where are all the liberal ambulance chasing lawyers I keep hearing about, and why aren’t they showing up here? It seems like all we have are the conservative corporate types. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/217 "2009-08-20T23:22:57Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > He’s one of a number of posters here whom I suspect were educated by Jesuits. One point for you. Yes, I was! ---
**Author:** ![wierdaaron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/eada6e/32.png) [@wierdaaron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wierdaaron)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/218 "2009-08-20T23:39:27Z")
Since this thread is pretty much free reign for any Pit topic that doesn’t fit anywhere else and isn’t significant enough to get its own thread: Anyone notice that Alerta mysteriously stopped posting the very second SmashTheState was banned? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/219 "2009-08-20T23:43:42Z")
> [@ArchiveGuy](#): > > She’s far more fair and respectful of her guests than K.O., so **CITE?** > [@Lobohan](#): > > So, have you ever watched Maddow? Because you seem to be insinuating facts not in evidence. I’ve listened to her show on Air America, but never watched her. Here’s the specific incident I was thinking of, which on further thought probably doesn’t quite fit what we’re talking about here. Maddow crowed about John McCain’s supposedly saying “I don’t have the guts to bring up William Ayers [in the debate].” She went on about how McCain was admitting he didn’t have the guts to bring the subject up… but in fact, McCain never said that. McCain actually said that OBAMA had said, “McCain doesn’t have the guts…” In other words, Maddow intentionally misquoted McCain’s words and then used the misquote to ridicule McCain. I’ll allow that, while this isn’t exactly honorable, it’s not in the same league as the other examples. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2009, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900/220 "2009-08-20T23:44:45Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > Where are all the liberal ambulance chasing lawyers I keep hearing about, and why aren’t they showing up here? It seems like all we have are the conservative corporate types. You know I was a public defender, right? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-pitting-the-woman-at-a-town-hall-who-yelled-heil-hitler-at-a-jew/506900.md?page=12)