# I'm selling temporal tickets for gladiator matches in the Colloseum. Who wants some? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [February 28, 2012, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211 "2012-02-28T01:57:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2012, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/21 "2012-02-28T21:19:30Z")
> [@colonial](#): > > No act could exceed the vileness of taking pleasure at mass murder > as a spectator sport. Even if you had _really_ good seats? ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2012, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/22 "2012-02-28T21:21:09Z")
I don’t think it is immoral. If anything, I could make an argument that time-machine bloodsport is more moral than modern day ‘bloodsport’ equivalents. The immoral part of participating in current day bloodsports is that participation creates demand which encourages more violence. But time-machine bloodsport as described has no interaction with the past and creates no additional demand. In fact, one could argue that the time machine eliminates current demand for bloodsport by satisfying it with PAST bloodsport. That said. I’m not all that interested. In my head, I imagine scantily clad muscular men, but the reality is probably much less visually appealing. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2012, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/23 "2012-02-28T21:23:40Z")
The gladiatorial matches _could_ be deadly, but they usually weren’t (if nothing else, gladiators were a very valuable and expensive investment). And for that matter, modern boxing or car racing, or even football, is occasionally deadly, too. Yes, the ancient games were _more_ deadly than modern ones, but it’s a difference of degree only. That said, I’m not all that interested in sports in general, nor in fighting sports in particular. I would see it as a tremendous opportunity for research, but I also recognize that I’m far from qualified for this sort of research. So I guess I’d go with the same option as **Balance**. ---
**Author:** ![Ms\_Boods](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5e9695/32.png) [@Ms\_Boods](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ms_Boods)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2012, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/24 "2012-02-28T23:12:30Z")
Not only would I attend the games happily and watch the action in the arena (although I’d bring my own snacks, and save the otters noses and wolves’ nipple chips for the poshie soft aristos – better yet, toss’em in, too), but if I could go to the races, I’d want a seat as near to the view where the chariots turn the corner at the spina – that’s where all the wrecks were. If you were really lucky, you might see a chariot burst into flames (wooden axles – that’s why they had guys throwing buckets of water on the chariots as they zoomed by.) Would I stay to watch the Christians get torn up? Dunno – that was usually at lunchtime along with the other criminals, and as far as Christians’ rather vulgarly allowing themselves to be dispatched (if they’d wanted to commit suicide so badly, there were trees and cliffs all over the empire, or at least my pal Tertullian tells me), so I might miss that if I went out to get something to eat. In fact, a lot of the true gladiator enthusiasts, who’d discuss the day’s events in close detail as one might look over a modern racing form, left at lunch because watching the criminals be forced to fight was like the difference between a major league baseball game and a T-ball match. ---
**Author:** ![Rachellelogram](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rachellelogram/32/8689_2.png) [@Rachellelogram](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachellelogram)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/25 "2012-02-29T01:29:33Z")
> [@colonial](#): > > No act could exceed the vileness of taking pleasure at mass murder > as a spectator sport. NO act? So according to you, splitting my children open with an axe or actively killing Jews during the Holocaust would be less morally reprehensible than observing gladiator games that I have no effect on or ability to alter. Good to know. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/26 "2012-02-29T04:32:31Z")
A little over the top, eh? Not all the gladiators were slaves, or were there involuntarily. Some of 'em chose that career, and did quite well at it. I can think of lots of worse things! Like…gladiatorial games set to 70’s disco music! ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/27 "2012-02-29T04:55:06Z")
I’d be tempted by the gladiators (and\* really\* want to know if they flooded the Colosseum to recreate naval battles) but would actually prefer the chariot races. Let’s hope the Temporal Tourism folks eventually diversify. How about the [Circus Maximus](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circus_Maximus#Imperial_era)? Or the Hippodrome in Constantinople; Byzantium has a lot to offer the discerning time traveller… ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/28 "2012-02-29T16:23:21Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > The immoral part [snip] is that participation creates demand which encourages more violence. That’s highly debatable. That’s _one_ immoral part. The personal glorification in the violence is a completely _separate_ part. ---
**Author:** ![Noelq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/noelq/32/16438_2.png) [@Noelq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Noelq)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/29 "2012-02-29T18:28:08Z")
Do you have a package deal? I’d love to be in with each group, seeing how each sociological strata reacts to the fights, and interacts with each other. I’m a people watcher, and I’d love to see an entirely foreign atmosphere with no chance of reprocussions. I’d be your best serial customer! ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/30 "2012-02-29T18:44:46Z")
> [@colonial](#): > > No act could exceed the vileness of taking pleasure at mass murder > as a spectator sport. > > Gladiatorial blood games were an example of human mental pathology > at its rock-bottom worst, no better than Auschwitz and Gulag. Fascinating. I am not saying there isn’t some truth to this - that moral/emotional choice is at the heart of the OP. But Humanity’s capacity for / fascination with violence is not a simple thing; just asserting that it is “vile” and tossing it off the to side doesn’t cover all the subtleties. From a Historical standpoint, I would absolutely be interested to go, especially if I can’t change the past so bear no moral burden to try to change events - it would be merely an educational choice for me. Could I actually watch the violence? Not sure - not really my thing. Would I be horrified at the display of man’s inhumanity to man? I suspect I would - but isn’t that part of the education? Put it a different way: what if the OP’s trip WAS to Auschwitz? I.e., inhumane treatment of humanity, but no entertainment value. But a chance to observe the “banality of evil” directly and bear direct witness, keep it fresh in our minds and increase our chances to learn from it? Would you go back for that?.. ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/31 "2012-02-29T21:16:39Z")
I’m a Roman historian. $2k would be a small price to pay for an event that would give me enough information to write a few books. Can I bring pen & paper? A little digital recorder? ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2012, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/32 "2012-02-29T23:34:12Z")
> [@colonial](#): > > No act could exceed the vileness of taking pleasure at mass murder > as a spectator sport. > > Gladiatorial blood games were an example of human mental pathology > at its rock-bottom worst, no better than Auschwitz and Gulag. Blood sport isn’t really my thing, but I have to wonder about this. For as long as we’ve been paying attention to ourselves, a significant portion of humanity–from any culture you like–has been at least OK with killin for its own sake. Sometimes we do active wars, sometimes we dehumanize a readily identifiable population and kill 'em just because there are no consequences. Homicide is so common, and so often sanctioned by societies, that I have to wonder if it’s really pathological. Mobs are certainly capable of getting up to some nastiness that the individual members would probably shy away from. Is it really “sick”, as in deviant? Or is it just a part of human nature that runs against a logical, unnatural code? Perhaps bloodlust is natural, and it’s the aversion to it that is the pathology. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/33 "2012-03-01T02:06:40Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > . . . Perhaps bloodlust is natural, and it’s the aversion to it that is the pathology. Well, not all adaptions to natural behaviors are pathological… Brushing our teeth is completely unnatural…and isn’t it nice actually to have teeth into your old age? Civilization itself is unnatural…but debating philosophy on the internet is a whole lot more fun than hunting and gathering. (I mean, would you rather pick my nits or pick my nits?) ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/34 "2012-03-01T03:24:02Z")
It’s an appalingly immoral thing, but I teach history and I love Ancient Rome: I cannot not go. I’d be needing lots of therapy. I can console myself knowing that it already happened. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/35 "2012-03-01T12:42:41Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > Well, not all adaptions to natural behaviors are pathological… Brushing our teeth is completely unnatural…and isn’t it nice actually to have teeth into your old age? I must ponder this for a while. ---
**Author:** ![Agent\_Foxtrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc29f/32.png) [@Agent\_Foxtrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agent_Foxtrot)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/36 "2012-03-01T14:10:07Z")
_Ave Imperator, morituri te salutant!_ If I give you $2,500 cold cash right this minute, can I sit with the Senators _and_ take home a souvenir gladius? ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/37 "2012-03-01T14:20:18Z")
Much as would be interested to see firsthand any aspect of ancient Roman life, watching people kill each other (for real) is not for me. So no. Which may be a distinction without a difference, I guess, since, like most Americans, I’ve seen thousands, if not tens of thousands, of people die horribly on TV and at the movies. ---
**Author:** ![interface2x](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c0e974/32.png) [@interface2x](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/interface2x)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/38 "2012-03-01T14:53:14Z")
> [@Ms\_Boods](#): > > Would I stay to watch the Christians get torn up? Dunno – that was usually at lunchtime along with the other criminals, and as far as Christians’ rather vulgarly allowing themselves to be dispatched (if they’d wanted to commit suicide so badly, there were trees and cliffs all over the empire, or at least my pal Tertullian tells me), so I might miss that if I went out to get something to eat. No worries, we [don’t have any solid evidence that that even happened in the Colosseum](http://rambambashi.wordpress.com/2009/12/24/common-errors-27-christians-in-the-colosseum/). A lot of common criminals definitely met their end at the hands of gladiators or the claws and teeth of various animals. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/39 "2012-03-01T15:17:22Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > Well, not all adaptions to natural behaviors are pathological… Brushing our teeth is completely unnatural So’s our sugar-rich diet, so that’s one ‘unnatural’ behaviour cancelling out another. Though I agree with the general thrust of your comment. ---
**Author:** ![Ms\_Boods](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5e9695/32.png) [@Ms\_Boods](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ms_Boods)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211/40 "2012-03-01T20:10:30Z")
> [@interface2x](#): > > No worries, we [don’t have any solid evidence that that even happened in the Colosseum](http://rambambashi.wordpress.com/2009/12/24/common-errors-27-christians-in-the-colosseum/). A lot of common criminals definitely met their end at the hands of gladiators or the claws and teeth of various animals. :smack: Sorry, I was remarking on the executions in general – I did honestly know that there were no Christians executed in the Coliseum. (I would hope I know this, as we do an entire semester class on Greek and Roman sport, and spend several lectures just on the gladiators alone!) But thank you for the reassurance. 🙂 Whoever upthread wants good seats and a souvenir gladius, I have two – a wooden one, and a nice repro of a proper metal one (takes a blade and everything! It was a wonderful Christmas present – no one’d given me a weapon in ages!) I’m not allowed to bring the metal one to school anymore, though. Also, it doesn’t make that shiiinnnnngg noise that you hear in movies when they pull it out of its sheath or when you stick it in someone no matter how hard you try. ☹ I have a toy wooden one that I call my cat-whacking stick because it’s just perfect for a session of cat-whacking (or is that just me and my strange cat?) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-selling-temporal-tickets-for-gladiator-matches-in-the-colloseum-who-wants-some/614211.md?page=3)