# I'm short, fat, old, and ugly. The bouncer at the newest club doesn't admit me. Legal? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 18, 2012, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474 "2012-06-18T01:57:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2012, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474/41 "2012-06-18T20:48:40Z")
> [@BlinkingDuck](#): > > This isn’t an issue that raises my blood pressure one bit but I’ve wondered that myself. Here is a business that charges one sex more than another. > > Switch this around and say there is a business that charges women more than men - say a movie theater. Would people get upset? If so, then ladies night should be treated the same. I don’t see how this is relevant. If a movie theater charges women less, then they shouldn’t be forced to change their pricing strategy-other theaters would do the equitable pricing thing and this one would soon go out of business. That’s what economics/'the invisible hand" stuff is all about. A self regulating market. The clubs are offering something different-not alcohol-they are offering a cool place with a chance of getting laid, which is precipitated by drunk chicks. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2012, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474/42 "2012-06-18T20:56:13Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > I don’t see how this is relevant. If a movie theater charges women less, then they shouldn’t be forced to change their pricing strategy-other theaters would do the equitable pricing thing and this one would soon go out of business. That’s what economics/'the invisible hand" stuff is all about. A self regulating market… What if they gave a discount to white people? Do you have any understanding about the intent of anti-discrimination laws? Or is the market the solution to all problems? ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2012, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474/43 "2012-06-19T00:17:56Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > From an old Mad Magazine parody > > Sung to the tune of Girl from Ipanema If I recall correctly, that was “Short and fat and BALD and ugly…” ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2012, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474/44 "2012-06-19T00:26:18Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > I’m short, fat, old, and ugly. The bouncer at the newest club doesn’t admit me. Legal? The bouncer obviously does not recognize you as Truman Capote and loses his job at 54. ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2012, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474/45 "2012-06-19T02:23:35Z")
> [@BlinkingDuck](#): > > This isn’t an issue that raises my blood pressure one bit but I’ve wondered that myself. Here is a business that charges one sex more than another. > > Switch this around and say there is a business that charges women more than men - say a movie theater. Would people get upset? If so, then ladies night should be treated the same. You don’t need to hypothesize, there is such a business already: hair salons. I got my hair cut the other day, and the salon quite openly charged women more than men. The listed prices were for haircut and blowdry/style, “express” haircut (no dry/style), men’s haircut, and children’s haircut. As a woman, my cheapest option is the express cut, which was still $4-5 more than the men’s haircut. And I wasn’t there on “men’s day” where men got a discount, those are the prices every day of the year. I have heard complaints about such practices and I believe there have even been some lawsuits, but it’s generally not considered a big deal. In other words, charging women more than men for haircuts seems to be treated exactly the same as charging men more than women for drinks on “ladies night”. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2012, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474/46 "2012-06-19T02:29:32Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > In other words, charging women more than men for haircuts seems to be treated exactly the same as charging men more than women for drinks on “ladies night”. Not really. There is, generally speaking, more time/effort involved with a woman’s haircut than for a man’s. The drinks are the same for both sexes; one sex simply gets charged less. ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2012, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474/47 "2012-06-19T02:48:31Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Not really. There is, generally speaking, more time/effort involved with a woman’s haircut than for a man’s. The drinks are the same for both sexes; one sex simply gets charged less. So you think it’s _less_ discriminatory that this salon (part of a nationwide chain) doesn’t even offer the same variety of services to women that they do to men? The blowdry/style and “express” haircuts weren’t labeled as being for women only, so men who choose to pay more could presumably do so. But the “men’s haircut” was explicitly listed that way on their price sheet. The salon could call it the “super express” or something else that’s non-gender specific, but they don’t. I’m not particularly upset about this; as I said, it’s not something I consider a big deal. But my point is that there is in fact at least one sort of business that openly charges men less, not just once a week but every day, and this is treated with basically the same (low) level of public concern as ladies’ nights at bars. ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2012, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474/48 "2012-06-19T04:35:58Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > A related issue. How about the ladies night where women drink free? How do they legally get around that? Ceremonial sexism. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Toxgoddess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Toxgoddess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toxgoddess)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2012, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474/49 "2012-06-21T01:05:14Z")
> [@jtgain](#): > > Until amended, the 1964 Civil Rights Act doesn’t recognize short, fat, old, or ugly as protected classes for admission to places of public accommodation. If you don’t get admitted because of your race or religion, then we can talk.. And if it did, legally establishing that you are "ugly"could be a bit tricky. Sure, we all think we know it when we see it, but there would have to be some objective legal standard. Nose a certain size, a certain number of zits per inch, mistaken for an orangutan in a double-blind study, something. ---
**Author:** ![curious11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ac91a4/32.png) [@curious11](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curious11)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2012, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474/50 "2012-06-21T04:15:45Z")
I’d never go to a club that would have me as a member, Groucho ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2012, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474/51 "2012-06-21T04:32:53Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > If a movie theater charges women less, then they shouldn’t be forced to change their pricing strategy-other theaters would do the equitable pricing thing and this one would soon go out of business. I reckon that theater would do pretty well. Lots of women would want to go there, and some would bring regular-price men with them. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-short-fat-old-and-ugly-the-bouncer-at-the-newest-club-doesnt-admit-me-legal/625474.md?page=2)