# Impatient idiot kills 73 **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 4, 2006, 8:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979 "2006-02-04T08:51:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 8:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/1 "2006-02-04T08:51:23Z")
[http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/asiapcf/02/04/manila.stampede/index.html](http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/asiapcf/02/04/manila.stampede/index.html) > [@CNN](#): > > At 7 a.m., five hours before the show was to begin, people were being admitted to the stadium at such a slow pace that one member of the crowd apparently decided to hasten the process, he said. > > “Someone shouted and and screamed that there was a bomb,” Jaworski said. > > “It was just a prank by one of those irresponsible people who wanted to get in first.” Great going, douchebag. Only someone whose brain was completely eaten away by selfishness and greed could POSSIBLY concieve that yelling about a bomb in a huge crowd would be a good idea. I hope the authorities find you, but they probably won’t be able to. So I can only pray that you feel some kind of remorse, and that it haunts your every moment until the end of your days. (Hijack of own post: anyone else find it odd/funny that a Senator in the Phillipines is named “Jaworski”?) ---
**Author:** ![calm\_kiwi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9fc348/32.png) [@calm\_kiwi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/calm_kiwi)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 8:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/2 "2006-02-04T08:56:11Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > (Hijack of own post: anyone else find it odd/funny that a Senator in the Phillipines is named “Jaworski”?) No. I do find Governor Swartzenager odd though. Gosh who knew people immigrated and even kept their funny names. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/3 "2006-02-04T13:05:27Z")
The idiot who yelled bomb is most to blame, but the organizers also hold a share of that blame for the deaths that came about. > [@from the article linked in the OP](#): > > Gordon blamed poor organization of the event for the tragedy. > > “If you predict that there’s going to be a huge crowd, you should be ready with ambulances and communications,” AP quotes him as saying. > > “You should plan for the worst. We have a lot of people who wanted to help but could not get in immediately.” According to that qoute, there might not have been so many deaths if there had been preprations for emergency events and people on hand. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/4 "2006-02-04T16:07:21Z")
Question-since they don’t know who yelled “bomb!” how do they know it was to speed things up? Not that I’m saying that most likely wasn’t the case, just curious. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/5 "2006-02-04T16:25:20Z")
Actually, how does he know that someone yelled bomb at all? When there are crowds like this, panic can set it for really no reason whatsoever. The only person who provided that explanation was Jaworski, and I’m not convinced he was correct. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/6 "2006-02-04T17:15:59Z")
> [@Zabali\_Clawbane](#): > > The idiot who yelled bomb is most to blame, but the organizers also hold a share of that blame for the deaths that came about. > > According to that qoute, there might not have been so many deaths if there had been preprations for emergency events and people on hand. It’s the third world. They generally don’t have large reserves of health care just sitting around. If they funnel ambulances to one place, they are just taking them away from the other. One of the hard truths about life outside of the richest nations is that it’s pretty easy to get killed. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/7 "2006-02-04T17:20:54Z")
I’d think that the person who I quoted would be qualified to know whether or not it was workable/prudent to have people ready for an emergency, since he was “Philippine Red Cross Chairman Senator Richard Gordon”. ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/8 "2006-02-04T17:23:33Z")
> [@Zabali\_Clawbane](#): > > I’d think that the person who I quoted would be qualified to know whether or not it was workable/prudent to have people ready for an emergency, since he was “Philippine Red Cross Chairman Senator Richard Gordon”. FEMA Director Michael Brown. Position != qualification. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/9 "2006-02-04T17:31:35Z")
> [@Q.E.D.](#): > > FEMA Director Michael Brown. Position != qualification. :dubious: Ok, ya got me. I didn’t research his history, or how qualified he is for his job. However, this isn’t GQ. Not everyone in the Red Cross is an incompetent buffoon, and chances are that this fellow actually has a clue, so my point still is plausible. (Even if it isn’t proven or disproven. I don’t see you actually disproving it either. If you want to do so, go for it, have fun. Hope it brings you joy.) Sometimes, I’m actually correct, and often when I am I’m a lot more gracious about it than others. When I’m wrong, more often then not I admit to it. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/10 "2006-02-04T17:46:15Z")
> [@Q.E.D.](#): > > FEMA Director Michael Brown. Position != qualification. This is specious and cowardly. To use Michael Brown as an excuse to utterly flip the paradigm on its head–that from now on, anyone in a position of authority (or whatever) should be \*presumed \*to be unqualified until you have a copy of their resume in your hand–is beyond ridiculous. Sometimes you surprise me, QED. ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/11 "2006-02-04T17:48:58Z")
Don’t whine, it doesn’t become you. I’m not interested in proving or disproving the man’s qualifications; they’re irrelevant, anyway. My point was that one cannot make accurate judgements about a situation from a single, uncorroborated news report. Maybe they could have been better prepared, maybe they couldn’t. I don’t know, you don’t know, and unless he was actually present, I’d wager Mr. Gordon doesn’t really know, either. It’s easy to say “coulda shoulda woulda” after the fact. ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/12 "2006-02-04T17:53:27Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > To use Michael Brown as an excuse to utterly flip the paradigm on its head–that from now on, anyone in a position of authority (or whatever) should be \*presumed \*to be unqualified until you have a copy of their resume in your hand–is beyond ridiculous. This is not what I said. I only said that position is not the same as qualification, period; do you dispute this as a fact? I made no statement about what the presumption of qulification should be, it was merely a statement of fact. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/13 "2006-02-04T17:55:21Z")
> [@Q.E.D.](#): > > It’s easy to say “coulda shoulda woulda” after the fact. That I’ll grant you, and I am actually waiting to see more news on this. I won’t be surprised to find that it is backed up though, because medical help had to travel to the scene, then get through the panicing crowd. If there had even been some way to help control the crowd and calm the panic, maybe less people would have died. > [@Q.E.D.](#): > > Don’t whine, it doesn’t become you. I’ll take that with a grain of salt, and consider it nearly a compliment. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/14 "2006-02-04T17:56:17Z")
> [@Zabali\_Clawbane](#): > > I’d think that the person who I quoted would be qualified to know whether or not it was workable/prudent to have people ready for an emergency, since he was “Philippine Red Cross Chairman Senator Richard Gordon”. Well of course the RED CROSS is going to say you need more emergency preparation. Thats all they think about. My dentist just told me to never eat snack food- especially potato chips- again. In his mind this was a perfectly reasonable recommendation. Doesn’t mean it’s at all a practical thing to do. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/15 "2006-02-04T18:07:54Z")
> [@Dewey Finn](#): > > Actually, how does he know that someone yelled bomb at all? When there are crowds like this, panic can set it for really no reason whatsoever. The only person who provided that explanation was Jaworski, and I’m not convinced he was correct. The wire service reports today don’t mention a bomb threat, just a lot of people stampeding to get a limited number of tickets. ---
**Author:** ![CatsCradle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/cab0a1/32.png) [@CatsCradle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CatsCradle)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/16 "2006-02-04T18:09:44Z")
They’re now denying that it was a bomb; instead, it was kinda like the situation with the Henrico iBook stampede. Here’s the story from a Filipino paper: [http://news.inq7.net/nation/index.php?index=1&story\_id=65164](http://news.inq7.net/nation/index.php?index=1&story_id=65164) > [@](#): > > poverty and despair which they said were so prevalent among Filipinos that one of their main hopes for a better life was a TV show offering a quick windfall: It’s not P51 to the dollar, they said, but 70 lives to the peso. a bit melodramatic, but true, unfortunately. ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/17 "2006-02-04T18:11:19Z")
> [@Zabali\_Clawbane](#): > > That I’ll grant you, and I am actually waiting to see more news on this. I won’t be surprised to find that it is backed up though, because medical help had to travel to the scene, then get through the panicing crowd. Have you ever _seen_ a panicking crowd? I’m not convinced any reasonable amount of preparation would have allowed rescuers to get to the injured significantly faster. Most of the dead were believed to have died right at the scene, which sugfgests to me that their injuries were severe enough to have likely been untreatable, even if help had been immediately available. As you say, I’ll wait to see more information before forming a definite opinion. > [@Zabali\_Clawbane](#): > > I’ll take that with a grain of salt, and consider it nearly a compliment. It was. Nearly. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/18 "2006-02-04T18:13:37Z")
Actually **even sven** , it’s fairly well known worldwide that you should have some kind of emergency staff ready for large venues. Even [this](http://www.kdl.to/guides/event-safety-planning-guide.htm) somewhat outdated how to guide mentions at least having one person specifically as a “safety officer” there. Riots can happen anywhere there is a large group, and if you are planning an event that will have lots of peope you need to also work out a “what if” plan for that as well. (Especially if you realize there will be high emotions for some reason, like that raffle.) The reason I’m thinking such things might be possible in that country is, don’t they also hold soccer games/championships and such? Those are prone to rioting and I do believe I read about more safety precautions being taken for such events by organizers in a third world country before my comments here. (Don’t recall what country, but reasoned if one can do it, others can as well.) So, emergency preparedness isn’t a new idea, nor is it impossible. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/19 "2006-02-04T18:17:22Z")
> [@Q.E.D.](#): > > Have you ever _seen_ a panicking crowd? I’m not convinced any reasonable amount of preparation would have allowed rescuers to get to the injured significantly faster. Most of the dead were believed to have died right at the scene, which sugfgests to me that their injuries were severe enough to have likely been untreatable, even if help had been immediately available. As you say, I’ll wait to see more information before forming a definite opinion. That is my point, they have managed to forestall riots in recent times by preparing beforehand and better managing the crowd to “nip the situation in the bud” at world championship soccer matches. I don’t recall which nation really drew the world press with how succesful they were, but I remember seeing them lauded. (I filed it away as being a third world nation too, but that might be a brain fart.) If they could have calmed the crowd more quickly, there is a decent chance that \*less \* would have died. It would still have been horrid though. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979/20 "2006-02-04T18:21:38Z")
> [@Q.E.D.](#): > > This is not what I said. I only said that position is not the same as qualification, period; do you dispute this as a fact? I made no statement about what the presumption of qulification should be, it was merely a statement of fact. You used “Michael Brown” as some kind of trump card to dismiss the information provided by Philippine Red Cross Chairman Senator Richard Gordon, simply because he IS the Philippine Red Cross Chairman. This is lazy, and affects the credibility of anything else you have to contribute to this discussion. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impatient-idiot-kills-73/342979.md?page=2)