# Impeach Trump. Now.
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [February 20, 2017, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327 "2017-02-20T16:47:01Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/21 "2017-02-20T17:50:29Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#):
>
> Well, we _could_ just wait and see, and afterwards, wring our hands about our Constitutional system not leaving us any options.
>
> Seriously, we’ve never been in this sort of place before. Got any better answers? I remember her saying that back in 2006, but we’re not talking about retroactively impeaching Bush and Cheney. I wasn’t aware that she’d even been asked that question about Trump.
[Nancy Pelosi Slaps Down Trump Impeachment Talk](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/nancy-pelosi-trump-impeachment_us_5898a10ce4b040613137fe7e)
> [@Richard Parker](#):
>
> …I think the question is what the Dems should be demanding and what their rhetoric should be.
What do you think the answer to that question is?
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### Author:  [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/22 "2017-02-20T17:51:10Z")
> [@UltraVires](#):
>
> Assuming for purposes of argument that Trump himself told the Russians that once he takes office, the sanctions are gone, how is that an impeachable offense?
>
> Doesn’t any new President have the power to change foreign policy? And it cannot possibly be a quid pro quo as Trump was on record as being relatively supportive of Russia prior to any of the DNC email flap.
Because if Trump was negotiating deals with Russia as a private citizen, that’s a violation of the clear text of the Logan Act. Yes, nobody has been prosecuted for it, but US law states that private individuals – which Trump and everyone around him were back at all times prior to January 20th at noon – are prohibited from conducting unauthorized negotiations with other countries.
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### Author:  [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/23 "2017-02-20T17:51:37Z")
> [@UltraVires](#):
>
> Assuming for purposes of argument that Trump himself told the Russians that once he takes office, the sanctions are gone, how is that an impeachable offense?
An impeachable offense is whatever Congress wants it do be.
We should not condone President-elects interfering with foreign relations before they get elected in order to aid and comfort foreign governments subjected to sanctions for intervening in U.S. elections in order to elect such Presidents.
It’s sort of shocking that you’d disagree on grounds other than lack of evidence, honestly.
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### Author:  [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/24 "2017-02-20T17:51:40Z")
Just how hawkish is Pence, and how much would he stand up to Putin in Eastern Europe?
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### Author:  [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/25 "2017-02-20T17:52:53Z")
I believe there are currently as many as 4 separate ongoing intelligence community investigations into Trump’s dealings with Russia and various related aspects.
It takes time to build a solid case. Give them a chance to do so. I suspect Republicans will have no choice but to come along if the evidence is more than circumstantial.
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### Author:  [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/26 "2017-02-20T17:54:11Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#):
>
> What do you think the answer to that question is?
To highlight how serious and well-founded these concerns are, and to demand a real investigation.
I’m not convinced that it’s unreasonable to accomplish the first part by showing that these charges would and should be grounds for impeachment.
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### Author:  [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/27 "2017-02-20T17:56:22Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#):
>
> I’m not sure that implying that Republicans are putting their own partisan interests before the country’s, and then asking them for help in impeaching the leader of their party, is a path that’s likely to lead to success. Maybe next time try not to insult the people who’s help you’re asking for.
I’m sorry, I wasn’t aware that you were able to ensure that Ryan and McConnell would read my OP. If I’d known that, I’d have been more tactful with my wording. 😃
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### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/28 "2017-02-20T18:01:35Z")
> [@Richard\_Parker](#):
>
> To highlight how serious and well-founded these concerns are, and to demand a real investigation.
>
> I’m not convinced that it’s unreasonable to accomplish the first part by showing that these charges would and should be grounds for impeachment.
OK. But I do think that, per **septimus** ’ post above, if the Republicans really thought they had impeachable material to work with, they would at least try to get Trump to resign rather than drag him through an impeachment process. Now, Trump might be too stubborn to see the writing on the wall, but I would suspect that an actual impeachment (vs a resignation) is a low probability event. It accomplishes the same thing, unless one were to insist on the stain of impeachment.
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### Author:  [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/29 "2017-02-20T18:05:15Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#):
>
> OK. But I do think that, per **septimus** ’ post above, if the Republicans really thought they had impeachable material to work with, they would at least try to get Trump to resign rather than drag him through an impeachment process. Now, Trump might be too stubborn to see the writing on the wall, but I would suspect that an actual impeachment (vs a resignation) is a low probability event. It accomplished the same thing, unless one were to insist on the stain of impeachment.
I have no problem with resignation.
But I think that too is wildly optimistic, even in the world in which the evidence becomes far more clear. I don’t think the GOP majority would ever push for resignation. Full stop. At the very most, they would stop working with him in Congress and do what they could to ensure, through Pence and Priebus, that he is sidelined to the extent possible in any executive decision-making. They would happily risk the freedom of Estonia for an increased chance of a corporate tax cut.
So as a practical matter I think the question is what would drive people who voted for Hillary to turn out in 2018 and elect a Democratic House.
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### Author:  [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/30 "2017-02-20T18:06:49Z")
Will the Republican congressional leadership permit hearings?
Or will Democrats try to hold hearings of their own, and the Republicans will walk in to the room and turn the lights out? (Which has happened before.)
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### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/31 "2017-02-20T18:11:18Z")
How can the Democrats hold hearings?
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### Author:  [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/32 "2017-02-20T18:16:00Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#):
>
> I’m not sure that implying that Republicans are putting their own partisan interests before the country’s, and then asking them for help in impeaching the leader of their party, is a path that’s likely to lead to success. Maybe next time try not to insult the people who’s help you’re asking for.
Many of us have thought the Republican Congress (most of whom were lukewarm Trumpists before his surprise victory) have long-term plans to replace him with Pence if his antics become too embarrassing. Or his past catches up with him. I don’t care for Pence one bit but he’s less likely to nuke somebody for fun.
But the Republican PTB are taking their time. No point in angering the hard core Trumpists by premature action.
I take a bit of cheer from realizing a staunch right winger considers Trump the leader of his party. The longer people consider the Republicans The Party of Trump, the more damage he’ll do to the GOP.
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### Author:  [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/33 "2017-02-20T18:17:06Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#):
>
> OK. But I do think that, per **septimus** ’ post above, if the Republicans really thought they had impeachable material to work with, they would at least try to get Trump to resign rather than drag him through an impeachment process. Now, Trump might be too stubborn to see the writing on the wall, but I would suspect that an actual impeachment (vs a resignation) is a low probability event. It accomplishes the same thing, unless one were to insist on the stain of impeachment.
Thing is that IMHO Trump is the kind of guy that [will](http://money.cnn.com/2016/11/21/news/protecting-donald-trump/) [milk](https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/trump-familys-elaborate-lifestyle-a-logistical-nightmare--at-taxpayer-expense/2017/02/16/763cce8e-f2ce-11e6-a9b0-ecee7ce475fc_story.html) this until the bitter end (part of the insane costs to protect Trump and family -also when the sons travel to do businesses- are going back to Trump and Trump is gaining more with increased fees to his locations where he goes from people that want to get close to the president), I think he realizes that an impeachment will likely not end in jail time, only political death and the Republicans will go down with him.
And then he will make money playing himself in his “fall from grace” movie. Yeah, I’m very cynical.
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### Author:  [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/34 "2017-02-20T18:20:52Z")
For the GOP, the best outcome would be to make Trump get so fed-up and exhausted with the presidency that he quits. It might even be in their interest to schedule as many unwanted 5 AM briefings, calls in the night, unpleasant meetings as possible, etc. They would want to increase his stress as much as possible without making it seem like an intentional ploy.
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### Author:  [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/35 "2017-02-20T18:27:41Z")
> [@Velocity](#):
>
> For the GOP, the best outcome would be to make Trump get so fed-up and exhausted with the presidency that he quits. It might even be in their interest to schedule as many unwanted 5 AM briefings, calls in the night, unpleasant meetings as possible, etc. They would want to increase his stress as much as possible without making it seem like an intentional ploy.
The GOP wants to move their agenda through congress and have the president sign the bills into law. Pissing off the guy they want rubber-stamping their agenda is not in their best interest. They will continue to look the other way until it becomes politically damaging to them.
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### Author:  [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/36 "2017-02-20T18:50:16Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace;20013826The comments Trump made during the debate can easily dismissed as a tactless joke.[/QUOTE]
OK. Then “Whereas Trump is a tactless joke, 25th Amendment s. 4 him” rather than impeach him, or better yet, push for both and see which gets the job done first.
A continued pressure in the media and by people, groups and businesses putting pressure on their politicians will be necessary to remove Trump, and it will take time, so it is all the more reason to push now and to keep on pushing, just as was done to get Nixon to resign rather than face impeachment.
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### Author:  [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/37 "2017-02-20T18:50:33Z")
Politico just ran an [article](http://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/trump-impeachment-democrats-235184) about how Democratic party leaders are trying to tamp down the impeachment talk among the base, because it’s such a unifying fundraising tool for Republicans.
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### Author:  [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/38 "2017-02-20T18:51:42Z")
> [@running\_coach](#):
>
> The truth fucking hurts, doesn’t it?
Sticks and stones buddy.
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### Author:  [@KidCharlemagne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KidCharlemagne)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/39 "2017-02-20T18:52:29Z")
As much as I’d like to see it, there’s just no smoking gun for impeachment and therefore talking about it only gives the right talking points re the looney left. Unfortunately I’m not even holding my breath for a genuine investigation into his ties to Russia. We can only hope the deep state brings him down. Soft coups are so hot right now.
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### Author:  [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2017, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/impeach-trump-now/780327/40 "2017-02-20T19:37:48Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#):
>
> Impeach Trump. Now.
>
> Yes, I know: it’s a political impossibility. But dammit, that’s what Dems should demand of the GOP: put country and our alliances ahead of party, and impeach and remove Trump before he gives away a good chunk of Ukraine, or sends the EU on the road to breakup, or lets Putin grab a Baltic or three.
>
> Because by the time he actually does any of this,…
(post shortened)
The short answer, of course, is No.
A longer answer would be that having your feelings hurt by the fact that a Republican could beat Hillary the First, you now want the elected Republicans to do something about it. Key word being _elected_. The Democrats screwed themselves out of continuing to hold a majority position in the U.S. Congress. I guess Obama was right, elections do have consequences.
There is little, or no, evidence of an impeachable offense. Calling for impeachment appears to be nothing more than sour grapes.
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