# In British slang, are people from India included in 'Pakis'? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 17, 2020, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355 "2020-08-17T23:57:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![StarvingButStrong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/starvingbutstrong/32/335_2.png) [@StarvingButStrong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StarvingButStrong)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/1 "2020-08-17T23:57:02Z")
I’m watching the new season of Endeavor, and in last night’s episode a political candidate was trying to whip up nationalistic fury against foreigners. Primarily he mentions “Asians”, with “Blacks” being very much an afterthought. But most of the vitriol was aimed at “Pakis,” with never a mention of “Indian” or (any other Indian-derived insult so far as I noticed.) So I was wondering, if Pakis was an insult that was seen to include Indians? Or were there relatively few immigrants from India vs. Pakistan, and that explains the lesser targetting? Which seems strange on the surface, considering the populations of the two nations, but maybe Indians are less likely to immigrate for some reason? Or is there some cultural difference that mattered from the British viewpoint, that made the presence of a Pakistani more ‘offensive’ than that of someone from India? Is being Muslim ‘worse’ than being Hindu? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2020, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/2 "2020-08-17T23:59:26Z")
Flagged for possible forum change. ---
**Author:** ![CardboardBoxx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardboardboxx/32/7079_2.png) [@CardboardBoxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CardboardBoxx)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/3 "2020-08-18T00:02:28Z")
Paki is a catch all term for all South Asian looking people. The mindless morons who use the word have no care about actual country of origin. Brown person from Indian subcontinent is “Paki” ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/4 "2020-08-18T00:55:04Z")
The actual reason has already been given, but note that a chunk of the 'paki’s who came to England as part of the ‘partition generation’ were actually ethnically ‘paki’, (Punjabi Muslim) displaced from the Hindu side of the new border, and the Hindu’s who came were actually from the Pakistan side of the new border … so they were all more or less Pakistani, one way or the other. ---
**Author:** ![StarvingButStrong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/starvingbutstrong/32/335_2.png) [@StarvingButStrong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StarvingButStrong)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/5 "2020-08-18T02:10:52Z")
> [@CardboardBoxx](#): > > Paki is a catch all term for all South Asian looking people. The mindless morons who use the word have no care about actual country of origin. Brown person from Indian subcontinent is “Paki” I thought that might be it, but it seemed a little weird that they’d chose the name of a much smaller area to use for the entire much larger one. Though, come to think of it, a lot of the world calls all Americans “yankees” though we natives have a different take on that. > [@Melbourne](#): > > The actual reason has already been given, but note that a chunk of the 'paki’s who came to England as part of the ‘partition generation’ were actually ethnically ‘paki’, (Punjabi Muslim) displaced from the Hindu side of the new border, and the Hindu’s who came were actually from the Pakistan side of the new border … so they were all more or less Pakistani, one way or the other. How interesting! ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/6 "2020-08-18T02:34:36Z")
> [@StarvingButStrong](#): > > Is being Muslim ‘worse’ than being Hindu? > [@CardboardBoxx](#): > > The mindless morons who use the word have no care about actual country of origin. And just to add that the generic ignorant racist term also predates any more recent specific antipathy toward Muslim people. > [@StarvingButStrong](#): > > it seemed a little weird that they’d chose the name of a much smaller area to use for the entire much larger one. The number of people of Pakistani ethnicity in the U.K. is about 80% the number of Indian ethnicity, i.e. a much larger proportion than the population of Pakistan vs India. Although I’m not sure exactly what these census ethnic categories correspond to given the point Melbourne made. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/7 "2020-08-18T02:37:39Z")
Wow I just saw that “three quarters” change to 80 percent right before my eyes. I guess you don’t have to refresh your browser on Discord to see an edit change. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/8 "2020-08-18T04:30:21Z")
> [@StarvingButStrong](#): > > I thought that might be it, but it seemed a little weird that they’d chose the name of a much smaller area to use for the entire much larger one. It’s not really any weirder than calling people with a very large range of skin tones “black”, is it? ---
**Author:** ![UDS1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e47774/32.png) [@UDS1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS1)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/9 "2020-08-18T04:55:33Z")
Worth pointing out that Endeavour is set in the 1960s, before a signficant migration to the UK of people of (mostly) Indian descent from East Africa to the UK. So, at the time, people from Pakistan or from communities associated with Pakistan may have made up a larger proportion of people of south Asian descent in the UK than they do today. The OED has cites for _Paki_ from 1964 as meaning “a person of Pakistani (also more generally, South Asian) birth or descent, _esp._ one living in Britain”. But the second cite is from a novel in which a character says “Ali’s a Paki—an’ you know how it goes. Paki’s pretty well look all the same to me”. At the time, most white Britons couldn’t easily distinguish between different south Asian communities by appearance, accent, etc. Anyone who, to the white British eye, _could_ be from Pakistan could be called a “Paki”. ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 8:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/10 "2020-08-18T08:42:31Z")
It is pretty much in the same league as the ‘N’ word. And yes it is used by racists to describe anyone with a brown skin. > Blockquote > Among many British Asians, the “P-word” is thought of as the pinnacle of language which restricted the lives of our parents and grandparents in the latter half of the 20th century. It was used to restrict housing and deny jobs. It inspired violence. In other words, it represents the struggle of an extreme past. I recently thought about its dated reputation while watching Gurinder Chadha’s 2019 film _Blinded By The Light_ : a true story about an aspiring British Pakistani writer discovering the music of Bruce Springsteen at sixth-form college in Luton in the 1980s. At one point, the viewer discovers that a plastic mat is placed beside the front door to protect the carpet from racists urinating through the family’s letterbox. The P-word is used by locals to abuse the main character and his family. > **[Britain, racism and the ‘P-word’: a GQ special report](https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/politics/article/britain-racism-paki-word)** > > In the days following the Brexit vote, Ciaran Thapar’s partner was called a “f\*\*king P\*ki” multiple times in the street. Four years on, has anything changed? He spoke to four British Asians in public life about virulent racism in the UK, and the... ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanubv.2/32/3260_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUBv.2)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/11 "2020-08-18T11:47:26Z")
I had never heard the term “paki” until my English (former) boyfriend used it to refer to the local convenience store, run by south Asian fellows(I don’t know their country of origin). He called it “the paki store”. I had no idea it was a slur until I learned it here. I thought it was the same as when he called our Welsh friend “taffy” and our Scottish friend “jock”. They all said it to one another’s face so I assumed it was more of a . . .nickname / term of endearment(?) 🤦‍♀️ ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/12 "2020-08-18T12:00:33Z")
‘Paki shop’ was a common term when I was growing up (in the 70s) - many corner convenience stores had been taken over by incoming Asians. Back then, it didn’t carry the menace it now does (unless you were on the receiving end, I imagine). But I wouldn’t ever class it as a term of endearment. These days it’s right up there with the N word. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/13 "2020-08-18T12:14:13Z")
I think the most recent time I’ve heard someone use the p-word (in Canada) was my landlord circa 1996. I doubt she even knew that Pakistan was a country. (She once asked me if Saskatchewan was in Alberta.) ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/14 "2020-08-18T12:15:40Z")
[Moderating] While this question was prompted by a work of fiction, it’s about real-world use of slang. That’s a topic that can fit in GQ. Moving. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/15 "2020-08-18T12:33:24Z")
I had a friend who was British-Indian. When he was talking about buying a new car, he said one of the considerations was that it couldn’t be too fancy. He settled on buying a Volkswagen, even though he could afford a BMW, because he said that random people on the street tended to yell “Paki!” at brown people in expensive cars. ---
**Author:** ![PlaceboTarget](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/placebotarget/32/1073_2.png) [@PlaceboTarget](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlaceboTarget)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/16 "2020-08-18T12:38:51Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > random people Not that random, I “should” say. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/17 "2020-08-18T12:46:26Z")
So you can spot them coming at you? ---
**Author:** ![PlaceboTarget](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/placebotarget/32/1073_2.png) [@PlaceboTarget](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlaceboTarget)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/18 "2020-08-18T12:48:12Z")
I do not object to your using the term. I only want to point out there is something consistent about these people. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/19 "2020-08-18T12:51:36Z")
I mean, I assume that they’re white. Is there anything else about them that gives them away? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2020, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355/20 "2020-08-18T15:10:11Z")
> [@CardboardBoxx](#): > > Paki is a catch all term for all South Asian looking people. The mindless morons who use the word have no care about actual country of origin. Brown person from Indian subcontinent is “Paki” Concur - the people who use this as a slur are not really interested in nuances. Interestingly, the word isn’t a slur in Pakistan at all, and is broadly equivalent to the usage of the term ‘Brit’ in Britain - this has tripped me up in the past. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-british-slang-are-people-from-india-included-in-pakis/918355.md?page=2)