# In defence of Russia **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 6, 2022, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166 "2022-08-06T00:49:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/21 "2022-08-06T02:30:45Z")
More importantly, why did Russia invade Ukraine? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/22 "2022-08-06T02:31:15Z")
Because Putin felt like it. No other reason. ---
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/23 "2022-08-06T02:31:48Z")
I think I have mentioned a few pertinent reasons why. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/24 "2022-08-06T02:35:40Z")
He had to invade before they learned how to defend themselves. Seems like something a cheap thug would do. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/25 "2022-08-06T02:38:02Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Seems like something a cheap thug would do. Putin: I am not cheap! ---
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/26 "2022-08-06T02:38:11Z")
Notice that the U.N. wanted a no fly zone. Did the 110 Tomahawk missiles shoot down a lot of planes? As well as all the other ground attacks? The U.N. wanted a ceasefire. It happened. After the country was destroyed. It is still a mess. So the hopes that Libya had of a more united and self determined Africa ended. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/27 "2022-08-06T02:41:39Z")
Do you think the fact that Ukraine was learning how defend itself was justification for Putin’s invasion? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/28 "2022-08-06T02:43:27Z")
‘Look over there!’ The fact is, NATO is not a threat to Russia, unless Russia attacks a NATO nation. And if Russia defeats Ukraine, then it will have to defeat Poland (and NATO). And then it needs to defeat all other nations that are members of NATO. Then it will have to defeat Western Europe because they oppose the New Soviet Union. And the they will have to defeat North America, Central America, and South America because they object to the Russian fascist regime. And then they will have to defeat China, because China is a rival. Putin wants nothing short of world domination. He has zero justification for it, other that paranoia and because he wants to. NATO is not, and never has been, a threat to Russia as long as they are not attacked. ---
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/29 "2022-08-06T02:43:42Z")
Actually I think the Ukrainians are doing an amazing job in this war. They are a very good fighting force and proving it. I think they might do even better if there was not some political pressure from a variety of places overriding what the military would prefer to do. They have a few terrible constraints, that the Russians do not face. Yet still put up a great fight. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/30 "2022-08-06T02:45:54Z")
Soooo…If the rest of the world would quit “interfering” they would be doing just dandy? Holy Russian Suck-Up, Batman! ---
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/31 "2022-08-06T02:48:50Z")
It does not have to attack or defeat particular other nations. Putin has said he is not nearly as concerned about Sweden and Finland joining NATO. It isn’t only that a particular nation joins. It is a more complex geopolitical question. Also in this case one of a large Russian population being in an area, that is under social, political and military attack. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/32 "2022-08-06T02:51:37Z")
Do you think Putin would be seen in a better light if he would stop having his political rivals jailed and/or assassinated? ---
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/33 "2022-08-06T02:55:16Z")
Not sure what you mean. As in a lot of wars, the more strictly logical military decisions can be warped by political motives. Hey, lets do this, because it will look good for us politicians. When the actual military strategists don’t want to do that. I am not sure, but I think the southern counteroffensive is suffering due to it being pressed by politics instead of good military strategy. There is an article in Financial Times that is commenting on this, with actual Ukrain government and military input. But it os behind a paywall, so I have only got portions of it second hand. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/34 "2022-08-06T02:55:18Z")
> [@Kedikat](#): > > Putin has said he is not nearly as concerned about Sweden and Finland joining NATO. Bovine feces. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/35 "2022-08-06T02:56:56Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Thank you. You realize he was trying but failing to clearly quote Broomstick’s posts, right? All of his first few posts were quoting her, followed by his responses. It’s just difficult to read which is which unless you have the other thread open to see which is which. The correct parsing of that exchange for example would be: > [@Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 1)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6986): > > Ukraine was ZERO threat to the Russia Federation. Aside from being smaller, poorer, and having a smaller military, it had surrendered its nuclear capability in return for a promise for its borders to be respected. > > NATO is not a threat to Russia (except in the mind of some Russians who, regrettably, seem to be in charge there). Don’t want NATO to fight you? Don’t attack a NATO member. The only thing NATO was a threat to here was Russia ambition to conquer a weaker neighbor. > > Russia started this war, full stop. It is entirely the fault of Russia, no one else. > [@Kedikat](#): > > I agree, Ukraine itself was not a threat. But its military was being trained to NATO integration standards. It desired to be in NATO. If in NATO there would be NATO bases in it. That is a threat to Russia. Also, one does not have to attack NATO to be attacked by NATO. NATO has conducted military operations against those who have not attacked NATO members. ---
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/36 "2022-08-06T02:59:42Z")
As would leaders of other countries. I have concerns about my own and other governments actions regarding political foes, journalists, and ever more often, just citizens voicing their opinions and opposition. Governments of all stripes. I do not at all suppose Russia is Lily white. It has got a lot better. Lags some, leads some. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/37 "2022-08-06T03:02:09Z")
> [@Kedikat](#): > > So the hopes that Libya had of a more united and self determined Africa ended. So, in addition to being a Putin apologist you’re also a Gaddafi fanboi? ---
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/38 "2022-08-06T03:02:11Z")
Thanks. I will try and make that clearer going forward. But now we are in it here, so… ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/39 "2022-08-06T03:02:27Z")
I don’t recall there being a large contingent from Ukraine saying, “Please stop aiding us! We would be doing so much better without your help!”, so unless you’ve got some direct quotes from people in power over there saying something equivalent to that, > [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Bovine feces. What he said. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2022, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/40 "2022-08-06T03:03:02Z")
Not that much of a jump, is it? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166.md?page=3)