# In defence of Russia **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 6, 2022, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166 "2022-08-06T00:49:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 29
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2022, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/561 "2022-11-06T21:59:12Z")
> [@Kedikat](#): > > Something the commanders should have known about. They may have known about it, but they don’t have the artillery ammunition to do anything about it. Likely they were told they had to attack by powers above, and had little choice. They had to make do with what they had. Alternatively, they didn’t know, because their intelligence gathering and information handling is shit. ---
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2022, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/562 "2022-11-06T22:25:38Z")
It appears they should have had supply. A good road to the area. So as you suggest, a shortage of supply maybe. Another black eye to command decisions. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2022, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/563 "2022-11-06T22:56:11Z")
> [@Kedikat](#): > > Another black eye to command decisions. If by “command decisions” you mean “decisions of Putin to proceed with this war”, then I would agree with you. It’s decisions at the very top that are at fault; the commanders in the field are being scapegoated quite regularly, and blamed for the decisions coming from Putin. > [Without enough 122-millimeter shells](https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2022/11/05/buy-artillery-or-buy-coffins-the-russian-marine-corps-dire-choice-as-its-troops-die-in-record-numbers/?sh=2662518480b4) of its own, the 155th Guards Naval Infantry Brigade can’t suppress Ukraine’s big guns. Its troopers are defenseless. “Either the country will mass-produce 122-millimeter shells, or it will mass-produce coffins,” a Russian officer [told one blogger](https://t.me/A_S_Sukonkin/2848) in reference to the Pavlivka fight. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2022, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/564 "2022-11-07T01:18:42Z")
Russian get ass kicked in at Hostomel Kiev Chernihiv Sumy Kharkov saying they conquer Mariupol many many times before actually do crossing Severodonetsk River entering Severodonetsk city Lysychansk spend months bashing head at Bakhmut for no apparent reason. Glorious Russian army on attack so can’t excuse with thin lines. Commanders should have known plan stupid if they competent. No see pattern here. Why lose? ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2022, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/565 "2022-11-07T01:46:20Z")
Interesting sidenote: Putin brought back awarding the “Guards” title from the Great Patriotic War, the 155th Naval Infantry Brigade and the 126th Coastal Defense Brigade were awarded the Guards title [back in March](https://www.indiatoday.in/world/russia-ukraine-war/story/guards-title-for-russia-two-naval-brigades-for-protecting-fatherland-1930555-2022-03-28). The other thing they share in common is being ground to dust, but hey, at least the survivors get to have the Guards prefix added to their unit titles. [Russian 155th Guards Naval Infantry Brigade Members Issue Plea to Governor, Primosrky Krai](https://theatlasnews.co/conflict/2022/11/06/russian-155th-guards-naval-infantry-brigade-members-issue-plea-to-governor-primosrky-krai/) > Pro-Russian Telegram users have been circulating a letter, reportedly written by members of the 155th Guards Naval Infantry Brigade, to the Governor of Primorsky Krai, Russia. The letter is an impassioned plea to the Governor, where the unit is based, to investigate Russian military leaders who have sacrificed more than 300 soldiers and half of their equipment in the past four days near Vuhledar, Donetsk Oblast. [126th Coastal Defence Brigade](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/126th_Coastal_Defence_Brigade) > After the beginning of the successful Ukrainian [Kherson offensive](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kherson_offensive) in September 2022, [Telegram](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telegram_(software)) reports appeared saying that the brigade had suffered very heavy losses.[[15]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/126th_Coastal_Defence_Brigade#cite_note-15) Specifically, on October 5, 2022, messages appeared saying that “126 is no more… the remnants of the brigade are attached to our [76 GAAD] operational subordination.”[[16]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/126th_Coastal_Defence_Brigade#cite_note-16) > > On October 15, 2022, the [Institute for the Study of War](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institute_for_the_Study_of_War) wrote in their “Russian Offensive Campaign Assessment”: > > > "A video posted to social media on October 13 shows servicemen of the 126th Coastal Defence Brigade of the Black Sea Fleet in an unspecified location in Kherson Oblast complaining that they have been fighting in the area since the beginning of the war without breaks or troop rotation. The servicemen asserted that they are being “crushed” by Ukrainian forces and emphasized that they have one BTR (armored personnel carrier) for 80 people, which is greatly restricting their maneuverability. After the video circulated, a Wagner Group-affiliated Telegram channel announced on October 14 that Wagner Group leadership decided to transfer four off-road vehicles to the 126th Coastal Defence Battalion [_sic_: Brigade] in support of their efforts to hold the frontline in Kherson Oblast. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2022, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/566 "2022-11-07T01:54:38Z")
Next for Putin: dressing soldiers in old-time Cossack uniforms to strike fear into the hearts of the Ukraine military. A few of these fine fellows will rout the opposition. [![](https://i.pinimg.com/736x/e3/12/ef/e312efa74d0165e437db6d61dfeeb2e7.jpg) ](https://i.pinimg.com/736x/e3/12/ef/e312efa74d0165e437db6d61dfeeb2e7.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2022, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/567 "2022-11-07T02:00:11Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > They may have known about it, but they don’t have the artillery ammunition to do anything about it. Likely they were told they had to attack by powers above, and had little choice. They had to make do with what they had. > > Alternatively, they didn’t know, because their intelligence gathering and information handling is shit. Another possibility, and probably the likeliest one, is they knew, more or less had something to do something about it with, and just didn’t competently execute. Combined arms operations are really hard to coordinate. It’s why we spend years training our officers and soldiers. If you have inept officers, they could have battlemechs and X-wing fighters and they’ll still lose. ---
**Author:** ![HelenGawn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a88e4f/32.png) [@HelenGawn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HelenGawn)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2022, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/568 "2022-11-07T02:08:02Z")
My bet is that the potential cannon fodder will frag their commanders and surrender. Ukrainian POW camps are preferable to the Russian army. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2022, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/569 "2022-11-07T18:55:50Z")
Logistically, I doubt they can supply the powder and shot those troops will need. You really want Russia to lose, don’t you? ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2022, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/570 "2022-11-07T21:28:49Z")
Weren’t the Cossacks originally from Ukraine? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2022, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/571 "2022-11-07T21:43:52Z")
No, [Texas](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cossacks_Motorcycle_Club). ---
**Author:** ![HelenGawn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a88e4f/32.png) [@HelenGawn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HelenGawn)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2022, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/572 "2022-11-07T22:10:38Z")
You’re thinking of the Aggies. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2022, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/573 "2022-11-07T22:24:57Z")
Yeah, the Aggies are from Crimea. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2022, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/574 "2022-11-08T03:32:40Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Weren’t the Cossacks originally from Ukraine? [The Reply of the Zaporozhian Cossacks](https://www.dailyartmagazine.com/zaporozhian-cossacks-reply/) is of course the more elaborate literary/legendary ancestor to “Russian warship: go fuck yourselves.” And to every trollish comment the Ukrainians have posted every time the Russians get kicked. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2022, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/575 "2022-11-09T00:40:11Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > The Russian Ambassador to the UN has [informed the security council](https://finance.yahoo.com/news/combat-mosquitoes-dirty-bomb-russian-151700522.html), apparently with a straight face, that one of Russia’s concerns is US/Ukraine work on drones to release mosquitoes infected with virulent diseases. Combat mosquitoes? > > As usual, the Russians are making stuff up. Everyone knows the Royal Air Force was the principle user of combat mosquitoes: You laugh your capitalist pig-swine joke then, but now is proven true! Ukraine Minister of Defense announce plan in tweet! > ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2022, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/576 "2022-11-09T15:30:10Z")
Russia is feeling the sting of their soldiers dying in large numbers. In defense of Russia, as the title reads, they are finally owning up to the fact they their soldiers are dying, in large numbers. > **[Russia’s heavy casualties in Ukraine spark outcry and rare official response](https://www.spokesman.com/stories/2022/nov/07/russias-heavy-casualties-in-ukraine-spark-outcry-a/)** > > It was the first time since the start of Russia’s invasion that the ministry has officially responded to reports of mass casualties and criticism of commanders on Telegram. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2022, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/577 "2022-11-09T18:37:16Z")
The story refers to a “Pro-Kremlin Telegram channel “War on Fakes”. How ironic. ---
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2022, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/578 "2022-11-10T00:49:52Z")
Wow. Withdrawal from Kherson. I thought they were going to stay with a strengthened defensive line. It seems there may be some agreements with Ukraine about the withdrawal? Odd decisions. Russians blew all the bridges across a river that bisects the Kherson area on the right bank. Eliminating possibilities of their own forces using them as retreat routes. Making it easier for Ukraine forces to note where maybe each half of the Russian forces may need to go. Very curious to see how this retreat goes. If it is very clean. I think that may show there were some negotiations done prior to it. I suspect there may be a cease fire as to attacking Ukraine power grid and other infrastructure, if indeed there was a deal cut. It would be a sensible bargaining chip. Four right votes in the poll. I did not vote, but I was wrong none the less. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2022, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/579 "2022-11-10T01:28:09Z")
> [@Kedikat](#): > > It seems there may be some agreements with Ukraine about the withdrawal? Why do you think this? ---
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2022, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166/580 "2022-11-10T01:44:22Z")
So now what? The river is a great force multiplier for defence. For quite some time the Russian forces on the right bank where not all defence oriented. A lot of lighter more mobile offensive forces. They have been recently evacuated. It may be that Russia has decided to lower the manpower and materiel costs to defend the line. Retreat across the river and have it act as a defence force multiplier. Move the offensive forces to the Donetsk lines. Put more recently mobilized forces along the river for defence. Move the more experienced ones to Donetsk lines as well. Ukraine forces can also shift. Getting this territory back is a great win. The river acts just as well for them to keep defence firm with less cost. Offence is much tougher. But can be left till a later date. Ukraine will now have to shift forces to the Donetsk line as well. This action may bode well for Odessa and Ukraine having Black Sea borders in the future with little or no battle for it. Whatever territory one has at the start of any negotiations is usually kept. The Dnieper river can be a natural border. Would have been nice if none of Kherson Oblast had been taken. But maybe more can be negotiated back or won back. Retreat of so much Russian force will lead to it being applied elsewhere. It is a big imperative for Donetsk city to be free from attack. And half of Donetsk Oblast is still under Ukraine control. If those forces are freed to move. I think the Donetsk is going to get very hot. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166.md?page=28) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-russia/969166.md?page=30)