# In defence of wokeness **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 2, 2020, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065 "2020-10-02T20:39:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/202 "2020-10-09T17:54:02Z")
Not 100%. But good job trivializing the deaths of people at the hands of leftist regimes that totaled an order of magnitude more than in the holocaust. I doubt you’d be saying what a fun pop art Auschwitz and Dachau. Regardless, wokeness, the dishonest martyrdom of criminals, and the celebration of tyrants are all forms of expression free people are able to indulge in. The problem I have is the naked and undeniable hypocrisy which is exceedingly prevalent in the modern left and even in sites such as this. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/203 "2020-10-09T17:54:55Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Not 100%. But good job trivializing the deaths of people at the hands of leftist regimes that totaled an order of magnitude more than in the holocaust. I doubt you’d be saying what a fun pop art Auschwitz and Dachau. Oh look. You’re still imagining things, instead of facing reality. Tell you what, I’ll let imaginary me answer your absurdities from now on. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/204 "2020-10-09T18:01:03Z")
I have plenty of cites concerning Mao, Stalin, etc. These folks were real. As real as the statues and red hats that trigger 3/4 of the forum. The relevance to wokeness is that wokeness is one of the insidious purity tools used to enforce leftist ideological conformity. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/205 "2020-10-09T18:21:54Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > The relevance to wokeness is that wokeness is one of the insidious purity tools used to enforce leftist ideological conformity. Yes indeedy, in the modern left, scolding people and sometimes even calling their bosses, and in really severe cases _mocking them on Twitter_, is used for what you call “enforcing leftist ideological conformity.” In the modern right, calling in death threats to colleges, intimidating people at voting sites, and trying to kidnap and murder governors is used for what you _would_ call “enforcing rightwing ideological conformity,” if you were approaching this with anything resembling objectivity. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/206 "2020-10-09T19:18:48Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > These folks were real. And dead. We’re talking about the political terrorists active today, and your side seems to hold a monopoly. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/207 "2020-10-09T19:21:47Z")
The president just accused my governor of killing a baby. I wish I was infuriated. But I’m not. I’m terrified. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/208 "2020-10-09T19:23:16Z")
The difference is that the nuts on the right are actually arrested and prosecuted. While more numerous nuts on the left are rarely arrested much less prosecuted for actual terrorism and rioting. I suppose chanting moronic phrases while tossing Molotov cocktails is the magic talisman. Almost everyone agrees that far right extremism is dangerous and undesirable. The problem is that far too many naive and willfully blind folks are seduced by collectivism, so-called social justice, free goodies, and a consequence free life (unless you wear the wrong groupthink non-approved hat) that the far left uses and which wokeness is part of. That is why reminders of the dangers of Robespierre and the left wing tyrants of the 20th century are important. Even today, leftist regimes are responsible for tremendous misery. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/209 "2020-10-09T19:32:39Z")
How long would a Hitler avatar be tolerated if dead means it is all fun pop art? You’re a mod you can answer that accurately. Anyways, your statement is totally inaccurate. For one, as you know, my side is classical liberalism. Which ought not need any explanation. For two, currently in this country alone we have quite a few instances of local leadership and prosecutors that tolerate and implicitly encourage political violence in the leftist push for radical change using social justice as a pretext. If you extend reality to outside our country, which I do, I even own a globe, then you see that leftist regimes are responsible for vast amounts of atrocities. Of course, our brave and woke social justice warriors such as the NBA won’t allow Uighur Lives Matter. Or Free Venezuela. It’s weird that there is any defense for wokeness which is Orwellian in its denial of historical and scientific fact. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/210 "2020-10-09T19:53:27Z")
@octopus, we’re the ones standing up to Trump and Barr’s brutalization of peaceful protesters for political purposes. We’re the ones opposing the Proud Boys and other extremists with a record of deadly violence, at Charlottesville and elsewhere (like the plot against the governor of MI). That’s where the deadly political violence is today in America. These are facts. Whatever you’re worried about, it’s not about the actual facts of violence in America today. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/211 "2020-10-09T20:01:21Z")
The tens of millions of dollars worth of arson, vandalism, and looting damage is predominantly caused by chanting leftists. Obviously, those chants not only prevent prosecution they create a reality distortion field that Steve Jobs would have been envious of. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/212 "2020-10-09T20:11:31Z")
I agree with others, @octopus. As annoying as PC language policing can be (I think you’d have to have the patience of Job to never feel annoyed by it), it doesn’t compare to the fear of having your life taken from you, literally (in the form of violence) or metaphorically (denial of civil rights). Woke folk are fighting these things. They are protesting. They are signing petitions. They are voting and running for office. They are clapping back at people in power who say and do ignorant and hateful things. All of this is a good thing. Do I think it goes too far sometimes? Yes. But the spirit behind it needs to be encouraged. You can still be woke and be reasonable and sober. It’s cringey to hear someone brag about how woke they are. But the philosophy is sound. People _do_ need to wake up to the bullshit around them and not just be a passive spectator. I’d rather people get on my nerves with some mild cringiness occasionally, if that is the cost of a safer and fairer society for everyone. I don’t see the TOLERATE MY INTOLERANCE!! folks trying to improve society. They are sitting up here watching the world burn. Humans can and should do better. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/213 "2020-10-09T20:14:42Z")
Absolutely. I have no problem with liberty. I have a problem with dishonestly and hypocritically exploiting the language of liberty and justice to advance a dangerous and radical agenda. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/214 "2020-10-09T20:25:51Z")
I don’t see the danger and radicalness you see. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/215 "2020-10-09T20:29:07Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Absolutely. I have no problem with liberty. I have a problem with dishonestly and hypocritically exploiting the language of liberty and justice to advance a dangerous and radical agenda. Agendas of Hitler, Stalin, Mao and Jean Valjean? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/216 "2020-10-09T20:30:34Z")
Can you accurately define woman? Anyways, your expression of your viewpoint is fine. So are those of iiandyiiii and LHoD. Would it be so if the radical left gained power? I saw an interesting message with a cutesy pop art hammer and sickle tag. It read “liberals get the bullet too.” 100 million plus souls prematurely extinguished at the hands of the far left are evidence that that is not an idle threat. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/217 "2020-10-09T20:58:17Z")
If violence were really a big concern for you, one would think you’d be worried about the murder and brutality coming from the right – especially state-sponsored brutality coming from the right. That’s much, much worse than some property damage. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/218 "2020-10-09T21:52:13Z")
Those on the right who are violent are being arrested and prosecuted. Something the left refuses to do to radicals in their municipalities and states as long as those radicals chant messages of wokeness. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/219 "2020-10-09T22:21:19Z")
Trump, Barr, and co are being arrested and prosecuted? News to me. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065/220 "2020-10-09T23:08:10Z")
Rest assured, if and when they are, it will be a denounced as lefty-fascism and the end of freedom in America. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defence-of-wokeness/922065.md?page=10)