# In defense of "Baby, It's Cold Outside" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 19, 2016, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155 "2016-12-19T17:36:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2016, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/61 "2016-12-27T16:31:50Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Same sex, not so much. But a lot of folks don’t realize that in the movie Neptune’s Daughter, where the song originated, it was done with role reversal. > > [Here are the two versions.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MFJ7ie_yGU) The song didn’t originate there. It was around for years before the movie. Frank Loesser wrote it so his then-wife, who was a barely competent singer, could have something to sing with him at parties that wasn’t too vocally demanding for her. It was a gift from him to her. I recall reading somewhere that while the song had been recorded before Neptune’s Daughter, it really ticked her off when he sold the rights to the song for the film. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2016, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/62 "2016-12-27T16:41:56Z")
ETA; I got a detail wrong. He wrote it for his wife around 1944, he sold it in 1948-ish, so it hadn’t been around for “years”. Nor (as far as I can tell) was it recorded other than a recording that pre-compact discs was rare, of Losser and his wife performing it\*. So…oops. It pretty much _was_ unveiled to the public in Neptune’s Daughter. My bad. 🙂 As an aside, looking at the lyrics, the two parts are written as “Wolf” and “Mouse” not “Man” and “Woman” or “Guy” and “Doll”. Somehow, that makes the song more charming to me. \*[Frank Loesser - Baby It's Cold Outside - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0pfvZo2gmm8) ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2016, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/63 "2016-12-27T18:09:07Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > ETA; I got a detail wrong. He wrote it for his wife around 1944, he sold it in 1948-ish, so it hadn’t been around for “years”. That qualifies as “years” in my book! Funny that he wrote it to be not too vocally challenging, and to my way of thinking that style is the way the song \*should \*sound…but all these diva singers just can’t stand to rein themselves in that much, so they punch it up into some big number to where it loses its conversational rhythm. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2016, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/64 "2016-12-27T22:42:40Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > That qualifies as “years” in my book! > > Funny that he wrote it to be not too vocally challenging, and to my way of thinking that style is the way the song \*should \*sound…but all these diva singers just can’t stand to rein themselves in that much, so they punch it up into some big number to where it loses its conversational rhythm. I agree, and in the “rare” version I linked to with his wife, you can see her expression in her voice when she does the “Say, what’s in this drink?” line. She’s clearly looking at him with a half-smile. She’s not concerned that she’s been roofied, she thinks he used too much (or the wrong type of) booze and the ‘recipe’ is off. It’s obviously banter, not worried. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2016, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/65 "2016-12-28T07:10:05Z")
There is one point that I feel naggingly compelled to make in fairness, even though it runs a bit counter to the argument I made in my OP. It’s that deal about “what’s in this drink?” being a common joke in that era, implying that the drink wasn’t even very strong. It’s \*very \*thinly sourced. The Vox article states it as outright fact, as does Wikipedia; however, their citations are both to the same anonymous blog post, which states it \*without \*any kind of citation. I find it kind of weird that Wikipedia forbids original research, yet allows this kind of citation. I guess I know what to do if I want to insert my own experience into a Wikipedia article: just create a WordPress account, blog about whatever it is, and then cite that in my Wiki edit. This is not to say that I consider the blogger’s claim false. It seems entirely plausible. But when I’ve read blogs or message board discussions that run down the origin, etymology, or changing meanings of words or phrases, they tend to provide sources (and these kinds of word sleuths try to out-compete each other with the earliest printed citation). This seems so slipshod by comparison. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2016, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/66 "2016-12-28T07:30:20Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > I agree, and in the “rare” version I linked to with his wife, you can see her expression in her voice when she does the “Say, what’s in this drink?” line. She’s clearly looking at him with a half-smile. She’s not concerned that she’s been roofied, she thinks he used too much (or the wrong type of) booze and the ‘recipe’ is off. It’s obviously banter, not worried. I think everyone is overthinking this line. She’s presenting it as yet another excuse she can use if she decides to stay. It’s implying that the drink rather than herself is the reason she just had to stay with him that night. She’s doing what he’s been doing by giving herself a reason to stay. ---
**Author:** ![Emergency911](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/43a26b/32.png) [@Emergency911](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emergency911)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2016, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/67 "2016-12-28T15:41:47Z")
> [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](#): > > I like that song, and the more the PC Patrol howls, the more I like it. > > That said, I’d love to hear a role-reversal version, with some aging cougar trying to convince a young stud to stay the night with her. Just last week I heard a Jimmy Buffet version with Nadirah Shakoor where the roles are reversed. It put a smile on my face. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w05SYKsJ3mw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w05SYKsJ3mw) ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2016, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/68 "2016-12-28T16:55:25Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > There is one point that I feel naggingly compelled to make in fairness, even though it runs a bit counter to the argument I made in my OP. It’s that deal about “what’s in this drink?” being a common joke in that era, implying that the drink wasn’t even very strong. It’s \*very \*thinly sourced. The Vox article states it as outright fact, as does Wikipedia; however, their citations are both to the same anonymous blog post, which states it \*without \*any kind of citation. > > I find it kind of weird that Wikipedia forbids original research, yet allows this kind of citation. I guess I know what to do if I want to insert my own experience into a Wikipedia article: just create a WordPress account, blog about whatever it is, and then cite that in my Wiki edit. > > This is not to say that I consider the blogger’s claim false. It seems entirely plausible. But when I’ve read blogs or message board discussions that run down the origin, etymology, or changing meanings of words or phrases, they tend to provide sources (and these kinds of word sleuths try to out-compete each other with the earliest printed citation). This seems so slipshod by comparison. I’ve read hundreds of classic mysteries from the 30s and 40s, and everybody drinks all the time in them. Men and women. Wives drink the same thing as their husbands (if not, that’s a sign of a no-good marriage). In these books are countless references to drinks being extraordinarily, oddly, mysteriously, gaspingly, eye-poppingly potent. Those are always throwaway lines for humor and I can’t give you an example (I’ll bet there’s one in the Jake Justus mysteries by Craig Rice because any of her (yes, her) books has more drinking than all the Thin Man movies combined.) Remember, this was after Prohibition, so nobody drank bathtub gin. Legal liquors all were about the same proof. The only way a drink could be more potent was to make it a double. Nobody ever refers to one of these extra-potent libations as extra-large, though. If they want a double, they have no problem ordering a double … or a triple. Or a whole evening’s worth of drinks in multiple bars and homes. They drank a _lot_. They’re always running out of liquor and everybody always starts with an ample supply of bottles. So I don’t find a comment about “what’s in this drink?” to be anything more than cliched banter. A good host made drinks strong without the specific intention of getting his guests too plastered to resist sex. A good guest noticed that the drinks weren’t thin and miserly. Everybody remembered Greta Garbo’s first lines in a talkie: “Give me a whisky. Ginger ale on the side. And don’t be stingy, baby.” ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2016, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/69 "2016-12-28T20:35:13Z")
Yeah, as I say I find it plausible. It’s just kind of hinky for these articles to use actual footnotes (giving it the appearance of being strongly sourced) which then just lead to this anonymous blog post with no citations. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2016, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/70 "2016-12-29T14:25:50Z")
Can’t link on my tablet, but my new favorite version is by Pearl Bailey and Hot Lips Paige. Look for it on Youtube; you won’t be disappointed. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 8:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/71 "2016-12-30T08:37:12Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Can’t link on my tablet, but my new favorite version is by Pearl Bailey and Hot Lips Paige. Look for it on Youtube; you won’t be disappointed. That’s a good one! There’s some apparent improv later in the song that I’m not so sure about (but then, I rarely enjoy any kind of improvisation unless it’s a jazz or jam-band instrumental). ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/72 "2017-12-26T04:51:03Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I can’t seem to find the “definitive” version I have in my head. It may be that I’ve just invented it, because although I don’t have the editing chops to actually make this mashup, I can definitely imagine a Frankenstein combo of other versions that would do nicely. > > As I see it, this is not just a song, it’s a _scene_ for two actors. Basically, like something out of a Broadway musical that is half-sung, half-spoken, intended to advance a couple’s relationship, not just serve as a crowd-pleasing song-and-dance number. But of all the versions I’ve sampled, I’ve yet to find one where both the male and female parts are performed that way. There’s always at least one of them who’s trying to show off their virtuoso pipes and sing, sing, SING. > > I like Sara Bareilles most of the time, but she is super guilty of this in her [duet with Seth McFarlane](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0m2QE9WDkc). He plays it almost perfectly for his part, but while he’s hamming it up Broadway style and engaging with the lyrics with a wink and a grin, she’s off in a recording booth singing it phonetically as though it’s in a language she doesn’t know. He should have invited Idina Menzel to be his singing partner. Broadway pro that she is, [she nails her side of the repartee](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bbuBubZ1yE), but this time it’s Michael Buble who just croons thoughtlessly. > > Some versions wouldn’t provide me anything to “mash”. Ceelo Green and Christiina Aguilera [meander melismatically](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypFVn_MLd4A) with no attempt at acting at all. [Rufus Wainright and Sharon Van Etten’s version](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7cTj_nLEim4) is horrendously slow and uninflected, like someone drastically dropped the speed on the record player. > > It’s not just newer versions: [Dean Martin goes the other way](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qFK5YFvTYE) into too uptempo and unvarying a swing, and having the female part be a chorus makes no sense. [Ella Fitzgerald is spot on,](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwIcK0vAiHI) but Louis Jordan messes it up. > > So I guess ultimately, it’d be Seth McFarlane with either Idina Menzel or reanimated/sampled Ella Fitzgerald. Let’s make this happen! I found a newer version this year that comes pretty close to my head canon! Check it out: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/LJEj2NnMFwg/maxresdefault.jpg "Baby It's Cold Outside (feat. Vicky Tafoya)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJEj2NnMFwg) ---
**Author:** ![Flare4roach](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7cd45c/32.png) [@Flare4roach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flare4roach)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/73 "2017-12-26T05:32:51Z")
I can’t hear that song anymore without thinking of Gilbert Gottfried doing his Tony Curtis imitation and Mario Cantone doing his post stroke Betty Davis on Gilbert’s podcast last year. OMG it made me laugh harder than I thought possible. Every time he’s on, Cantone fires on all cylinders on Gilbert’s show. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJkJnsnJ8pU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJkJnsnJ8pU) ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/74 "2017-12-26T09:25:17Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > I wonder whether some people’s opinion of the song might change if they heard a [gender-reversed version](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtoW4aV-CIcJFg) … . Like this one? [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/-EJ1SBAO1HU/hqdefault.jpg "A Muppets Christmas Song by Miss Piggy - "Baby It's Cold Outside" ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EJ1SBAO1HU) ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 9:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/75 "2017-12-26T09:52:29Z")
And she did it again much more recently with Michael Bublé: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/arUoUx-YMIY/hqdefault.jpg "Michael Buble with Miss Piggy - Baby It's Cold Outside") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arUoUx-YMIY) ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/76 "2017-12-26T12:05:43Z")
I love the song. It’s clear to me that A) the woman wants to stay, and B) she also wants the man to beg. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Mood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac91a4/32.png) [@Blue\_Mood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blue_Mood)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/77 "2017-12-26T21:26:07Z")
My favourite version (thanks largely to Chris Colfer’s interpretation and smooth voice) is from Glee: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gONSsidPtsE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gONSsidPtsE) ---
**Author:** ![Sigmagirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c89c15/32.png) [@Sigmagirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sigmagirl)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/78 "2017-12-26T21:59:43Z")
You’re all wrong. The gold standard is Blossom Dearie and Bob Dorough. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/79 "2017-12-26T22:16:00Z")
I really like Tom Jones and Cerys Matthews. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2018, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/80 "2018-11-28T03:34:34Z")
Bumped. The perfect greeting card for the season: [https://www.raygunsite.com/collections/top-collection/products/cold-outside-greeting-card](https://www.raygunsite.com/collections/top-collection/products/cold-outside-greeting-card) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155.md?page=5)