# In defense of "Baby, It's Cold Outside" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 19, 2016, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155 "2016-12-19T17:36:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2018, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/121 "2018-12-10T21:02:45Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > No, the whole point of context is that it doesn’t change and thus allows you a view into what something is actually about by looking at the surrounding circumstances. > > You have two groups of people (“Date rape!” “War on Christmas!”) trying desperately to make a major thing out of a rather minor thing and picking it apart for any “evidence” to fit their agenda even if those things don’t actually hold up to examination. One side greatly outnumbers(and outshouts) the other, and when met with little to no resistance shouts all the louder. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2018, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/122 "2018-12-10T22:16:52Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > Some radio stations decided that this song from a fucked up time in America is no longer relevant to their listeners and decided not to play it any more. Other people are outraged by that fact, why I’m not sure. [Censorship](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ur7pHRRKhV4)? ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2018, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/123 "2018-12-10T22:20:33Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > I’ve read hundreds of classic mysteries from the 30s and 40s, and everybody drinks all the time in them. Men and women. Wives drink the same thing as their husbands (if not, that’s a sign of a no-good marriage). In these books are countless references to drinks being extraordinarily, oddly, mysteriously, gaspingly, eye-poppingly potent. Those are always throwaway lines for humor and I can’t give you an example (I’ll bet there’s one in the Jake Justus mysteries by Craig Rice because any of her (yes, her) books has more drinking than all the Thin Man movies combined. During the last couple of years i’ve re-watched the Thin Man movies, and the one thing that really stood out to me (when it’s a familiar movie I notice the details a lot more) was the size of the glasses. There’s one scene where Nick is sitting at the bar with six or seven cocktails lined up in front of him. The glasses are _tiny_. The equivalent amount of alcohol today would maybe stretch to two glasses. Now, I check it out when watching movies of that vintage, and it’s the same thing. Compared to today, the drink portions were very small. One or two gulps (five sips?) max. ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2018, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/124 "2018-12-10T22:27:23Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > This song is from an era when it was harder for women in America to own their sexuality, it’s still too hard for a lot of people. The song is a play on the kind of dance people had to go to in order to have sex. This song is from a time when women who enjoyed sex were sluts, when Jews couldn’t join country clubs and when black people couldn’t sit where they wanted on a bus. America was a fucked up place and because it was so fucked up, men used the fact that women couldn’t expressly state their sexual desires to take advantage of them and then later claim that “she wanted it.” The woman in the song may want to stay over, but it’s much better to live in a time when adults can just fuck when they want to fuck. > > Some radio stations decided that this song from a fucked up time in America is no longer relevant to their listeners and decided not to play it any more. Other people are outraged by that fact, why I’m not sure. I completely agree with your first paragraph. There were repercussions way beyond just having busy bodies up in your business back then. Birth control (pre-pill) was pretty fraught and negative effects were all on the woman. Your second paragraph? Eh. I don’t care if people still play it or not. It’s a fairly silly little nothing of a song. I like a lot of Frank Loesser’s songs, but this one is not one of his best. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2018, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/125 "2018-12-10T22:31:02Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > One side greatly outnumbers(and outshouts) the other, and when met with little to no resistance shouts all the louder. That doesn’t make this a hill to fight over. “Happy Holidays”, sure, acknowledge various cultures. Not putting up religious displays on public land, sure. Trying to make this song into a paean for date rape or lack of agency? Nope. One side might be louder but both sides are stupid. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/126 "2018-12-11T12:11:30Z")
> [@carrps](#): > > I completely agree with your first paragraph. There were repercussions way beyond just having busy bodies up in your business back then. Birth control (pre-pill) was pretty fraught and negative effects were all on the woman. > > Your second paragraph? Eh. I don’t care if people still play it or not. It’s a fairly silly little nothing of a song. I like a lot of Frank Loesser’s songs, but this one is not one of his best. Good to know. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/127 "2018-12-11T12:58:34Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > [Censorship](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ur7pHRRKhV4)? Of course, we all understand that a few radio stations deciding not air a song is not censorship. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/128 "2018-12-11T15:35:10Z")
Private companies, of course, _can_ do whatever they want. But _should_ they? Should public readings of Huck Finn be allowed? ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/129 "2018-12-11T16:06:34Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > Private companies, of course, _can_ do whatever they want. But _should_ they? Should public readings of Huck Finn be allowed? By whom? ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/130 "2018-12-11T16:41:44Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Radio stations decide whether or not to play “Baby, It’s Cold Outside”: [https://www.cnn.com/2018/12/07/entertainment/radio-baby-its-cold-outside/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2018/12/07/entertainment/radio-baby-its-cold-outside/index.html) Interesting story. That programming director sounds like kind of a cool guy. I thought the point about hip hop was well stated. It’s not even comparable, how much worse the gender politics is in many rap songs. > [@carrps](#): > > During the last couple of years i’ve re-watched the Thin Man movies, and the one thing that really stood out to me (when it’s a familiar movie I notice the details a lot more) was the size of the glasses. > > There’s one scene where Nick is sitting at the bar with six or seven cocktails lined up in front of him. The glasses are _tiny_. The equivalent amount of alcohol today would maybe stretch to two glasses. Now, I check it out when watching movies of that vintage, and it’s the same thing. Compared to today, the drink portions were very small. One or two gulps (five sips?) max. Huh, interesting. Do you think those drinks were maybe stronger? ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/131 "2018-12-11T16:52:39Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > 2 whole stations? Wow! > There are 11, 341 commercial radio station is the U.S., which means we are talking about 0.017% percent of the radio stations that have stopped(or temporarily stopped) playing this one song. Of course I haven’t filtered out news stations and the like…but if you could, through various filters, get the number of effected stations up to a whopping 0.1% I would be surprised. When you throw in the number of stations that have added the song or played it more often just to make headlines, then I daresay this has actually turned from an incredibly minuscule problem to to an actual plus as far as that song is concerned. Then filter out stations that would never play it anyways. In Canada a bunch of big names have pulled it from their Christmas stations/playlists. > [@](#): > > On Tuesday, a handful of all-Christmas music stations owned by Canadian broadcasters, including Corus Entertainment, Bell Media, Rogers and CBC Radio, said the 1940s song will not be played during its holiday programming. > **[Christmas classic ‘Baby It’s Cold Outside’ pulled from Canadian radio stations...](https://globalnews.ca/news/4731417/baby-its-cold-outside-radio-canada/)** > > A handful of all-Christmas music stations owned by Canadian broadcasters said the 1940s song will not be played during its holiday programming. Those are all big players in the Canadian market. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/132 "2018-12-11T16:56:13Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Then filter out stations that would never play it anyways. In Canada a bunch of big names have pulled it from their Christmas stations/playlists. > > [Christmas classic ‘Baby It’s Cold Outside’ pulled from Canadian radio stations - National | Globalnews.ca](https://globalnews.ca/news/4731417/baby-its-cold-outside-radio-canada/) > > Those are all big players in the Canadian market. How do I filter out Canadian stations from the list of commercial U.S. stations I mentioned? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/133 "2018-12-11T17:03:11Z")
You don’t. I’m merely pointing out that it’s happening at more than the 2 stations you’re scoffing at. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/134 "2018-12-11T17:06:41Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > You don’t. I’m merely pointing out that it’s happening at more than the 2 stations you’re scoffing at. I specifically mentioned U.S. stations, which was reinforced by the statistics concerning U.S. stations that I posted. Once again, please tell me how I filter out Canadian stations from a list of _U.S._ stations. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/135 "2018-12-11T17:23:32Z")
It sucks because there is no other way to hear a song than on broadcasts over the airwaves. It’s not like you could download and play it, or go to some magical Pandora’s Box of music and request it. Anyone not currently humming, singing or playing the song right this minute is engaged in censorship of the worst kind. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/136 "2018-12-11T17:24:59Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Once again, please tell me how I filter out Canadian stations from a list of _U.S._ stations. If the call letters start with C, they’re Canadian. K or W, American. Don’t mention it. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/137 "2018-12-11T17:27:47Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > If the call letters start with C, they’re Canadian. K or W, American. > > Don’t mention it. I check my list of U.S. Stations, and apparently all the ones starting with the letter “C” have already been filtered out, and therefore have no bearing at all with that list. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/138 "2018-12-11T17:35:23Z")
Chillax dude. Sorry if it was confusing but I was making two different points. A bunch of Canadian stations are dropping the song. Also, you can’t just filter out news and sports stations because alt rock and hip hop stations were also never going to play the song. A number of stations go all-Christmas this time of year; how many of them have dropped the song would be a good number to know. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/139 "2018-12-11T17:39:23Z")
The phrase “what’s in this drink?” at the time was more or less code for, “Holy shit! Did I just say that out loud?” ---
**Author:** ![sciurophobic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cab0a1/32.png) [@sciurophobic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sciurophobic)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2018, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155/140 "2018-12-11T17:48:17Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > They better go after _Jingle Bells_ next–after all, how are one-horse open sleighs relevant to modern listeners? _Jingle Bells_ promotes animal cruelty, the way the riders make that poor horse dash through the snow while they laugh and sing. (I just made that up, nobody tell PETA) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-defense-of-baby-its-cold-outside/775155.md?page=8)