# In Gymnastics, are there any significant milestones believed to be possible, but not yet achieved? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [July 30, 2012, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872 "2012-07-30T17:46:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/1 "2012-07-30T17:46:38Z")
Innovation in gymnastics seem to have been reasonably steady up until about 1990 - I found [this](http://www.gymn-forum.net/innovators.html) list of firsts for a variety of different moves. I realise that the increase in difficulty between successive versions of the same move is probably geometric, rather than linear, but in terms of what humans can theoretically achieve, have we reached the plateau? Is a quadruple twist (or whatever) just plain forever impossible? ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/2 "2012-07-30T18:22:26Z")
I don’t think anyone has done a Victorian Cross. ETA: It is a rings thing. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Universe\_Lashes\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8797f3/32.png) [@The\_Universe\_Lashes\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Universe_Lashes_Out)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/3 "2012-07-30T18:27:19Z")
Who’s to say what’s impossible? People thought that running a four-minute mile was impossible, and yet now many people can do it. ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/4 "2012-07-30T18:43:56Z")
> [@Ike\_Witt](#): > > I don’t think anyone has done a Victorian Cross. > > ETA: It is a rings thing. I Googled to find a description, and happened across a possible [account](http://www.stickitmedia.com/mens-gymnastics-your-strength-and-the-still-rings/) in 2008. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/5 "2012-07-30T19:16:55Z")
> [@The\_Universe\_Lashes\_Out](#): > > Who’s to say what’s impossible? People thought that running a four-minute mile was impossible, and yet now many people can do it. I’m not asking what’s impossible - I’m asking what’s believed to be possible, but not yet quite achieved. But regardless, some things are impossible. If a four minute mile was ever considered impossible, those people were wrong. Maybe a three minute mile is possible, but a three-second mile certainly _IS_ impossible. ---
**Author:** ![dataguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/eada6e/32.png) [@dataguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dataguy)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/6 "2012-07-30T19:28:51Z")
> [@Ike\_Witt](#): > > I don’t think anyone has done a Victorian Cross. > > ETA: It is a rings thing. So this is real thing, huh? I read a story called The Victorian in a magazine long ago. It was about a gymnast who accomplished this. I always wondered was it just made up. ---
**Author:** ![That\_Don\_Guy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/that_don_guy/32/538_2.png) [@That\_Don\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/That_Don_Guy)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2012, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/7 "2012-07-30T19:37:15Z")
My first thought was, a quadruple somersault dismount from the high bar. It wasn’t that long ago when people thought a quadruple somersault on a flying trapeze was equally “impossible.” ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2012, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/8 "2012-07-31T04:06:49Z")
On the floor, it’s theoretically possible but I haven’t seen or heard of anyone doing it yet: A Hello Boys, leading into Party Date, Crazy Date, Party Date, Flatbag routine. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2012, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/9 "2012-07-31T12:17:50Z")
> [@dataguy](#): > > So this is real thing, huh? I read a story called The Victorian in a magazine long ago. It was about a gymnast who accomplished this. I always wondered was it just made up. Yeah, I read that story as well (I think it was in Playboy). Looking at the link **Sicks Ate** provided in post 4, it sure looks like that guy did it, not how I would imagine it to look if it were perfect, but still an amazing feat. ---
**Author:** ![lisiate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f05b48/32.png) [@lisiate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisiate)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2012, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/10 "2012-07-31T21:47:58Z")
We know a [Korbut Flip](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZYPcdj_wn4&feature=youtu.be)is possible if you can stand on the high bar, but since they changed the rules to prohibit standing on the high bar the move has disappeared. Is it possible to launch backwards off the highbar without standing on it and do one? ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2012, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/11 "2012-07-31T23:12:34Z")
> [@lisiate](#): > > We know a [Korbut Flip](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZYPcdj_wn4&feature=youtu.be)is possible if you can stand on the high bar, but since they changed the rules to prohibit standing on the high bar the move has disappeared. Is it possible to launch backwards off the highbar without standing on it and do one? Thanks for the link. The way she uses her abdominal muscles is…wow. You couldn’t do that on the parallel bars, I don’t think, without falling on your ass. But it could be done on a balance beam… ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2012, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/12 "2012-08-01T01:23:18Z")
gol, i remember there was one woman who did a walkover across the balance beam, not along, across, on the 4" bit. that was just amazing, and i don’t remember anyone else doing that. ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2012, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/13 "2012-08-01T02:27:16Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Innovation in gymnastics seem to have been reasonably steady up until about 1990 - I found [this](http://www.gymn-forum.net/innovators.html) list of firsts for a variety of different moves. > > I realise that the increase in difficulty between successive versions of the same move is probably geometric, rather than linear, but in terms of what humans can theoretically achieve, have we reached the plateau? Is a quadruple twist (or whatever) just plain forever impossible? Have you ever seen an equivalent list for figure skating? ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2012, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-gymnastics-are-there-any-significant-milestones-believed-to-be-possible-but-not-yet-achieved/629872/14 "2012-08-01T03:27:29Z")
> [@Farmer\_Jane](#): > > Thanks for the link. The way she uses her abdominal muscles is…wow. You couldn’t do that on the parallel bars, I don’t think, without falling on your ass. But it could be done on a balance beam… I love old style uneven bars. The new style is uninspiring.