In many cases I don't really think you can entirely blame the parents for children's obesity

[Cat_Whisperer]

@doreen

<snip>Because I remember my childhood and until my friends and I had money of our own , popcorn , chips,cookies,cake and sweetened cereals were rare treats, not something for daily consumption.They were not just kept around the house to be eaten whenever we felt like it. Neither was soda. Some families ( not all ) permitted soda with dinner each night, but there wasn’t such a supply of soda kept in the house that you drank soda when you were thirsty. Tap water was what you drank when you were thirsty. For that matter , we usually couldn’t make a sandwich for a snack either (except PB&J) - cold cuts were bought in quantities sufficient for the number of lunches they were to make.

That’s how it was in my family, too (with four kids and limited income). Mom controlled the food; a complaint of being hungry before supper either got you an apple or you just headed on out to the garden to pick yourself a handful of peas or something. Soda and chips were a treat, shared out amongst the whole family, so each kid got a moderate amount, not a bag per kid.

As others have said, eating out was a rare treat, not two or three times per week. That’s a huge difference right there, I think - I know when I’m tracking my calories, when we eat out, it’s damned hard to stay within a daily budget compared to eating at home.

@Tethered_Kite

Assigning blame is a useless concept for solving problems. Defining responsibility is probably more apt.

In that case the child and the parents are responsible for resolving the issue.

Yup, and that’s on a sliding scale - at five, the parents are probably wholly responsible; at 15, much less so.

@even_sven

I’d be in the same boat. The family would probably have to eat Top Ramen to make up for whatever that food was for. Food didn’t appear in our cupboard by magic, and wasting it through mindless eating would be no different than wasting any other household commodity. I was quite aware that food came out of a limited household budget and once it’s gone, it’s gone.

That too. We couldn’t just eat everything in the house, because it was all for everyone, with limited money to buy more.

@jz78817

honestly, I think a lot of it is “hidden” calories, e.g. sugary drinks. <snip>

I think that’s a big part of it, too. I have two nephews, 13 and eight years old, and I have never, ever seen them drink a glass of water. It’s juice or strawberry milk or soda, always (and multiple glasses). The younger one is FAT, not just a little pudgy, and he has been for years.

I think the parents are responsible for a large part of it, and it comes down to discipline. My fat nephew gets whatever he wants to eat, because he screams bloody murder if he doesn’t get his way. I didn’t eat whatever I wanted when I was a kid, because I wasn’t in charge of the household - my parents set the rules, and that included eating.

[nearwildheaven]

@monstro

I do agree that once kids get to be a certain age, it’s hard for the parents to control their eating habits.

One of the downsides of living in the city is easy assess to corner stores. My mother forbade us to snack on the chips and stuff she’d buy for our lunches, so when we got to be teenagers, what did we do? We’d go across the street and buy Little Debbies, Cheetos, sodas, and everything else.

We didn’t get an allowance. We’d simply root in between couch cushions and coat pockets until we acquired the two dollars or so required to stuff our faces.

I blame my parents, kinda sorta. Perhaps if there had been snacks in the house, we wouldn’t have felt so compelled to go to the store. But I suspect the temptation of Little Debbie would have hard for us to turn down regardless what my parents had done.

Maybe if there’s a convenience store on every corner, but that’s not the case where I live. Maybe every mile or so, and not exactly convenient for young children to ride their bikes on those busy streets either.

[colander]

@nearwildheaven

Maybe if there’s a convenience store on every corner, but that’s not the case where I live.

Good for you?

[Troppus]

@colander

And your point is what now?

That this statement is completely untrue.

@colander

If you say so. However, staple food prices in present-day America are low enough that they simply no longer serve as a useful consumption limiter in most households.

[colander]

@Troppus

That this statement is completely untrue.

Well, actually, your cite says that 95% of American households face no food scarcity. So if by “completely untrue” you mean “absolutely correct, colander! Thanks for teaching me an interesting new fact!”, then I guess you’re right and you’re very welcome! Here’s another fact for you that you might enjoy learning: unlike food scarcity experienced by households in developing countries, food scarcity in households located in countries of abundance does unfortunately not lead to lower rates of obesity in those households!

[Troppus]

@colander

Well, actually, your cite says that 95% of American households face no food scarcity. So if by “completely untrue” you mean “absolutely correct, colander! Thanks for teaching me an interesting new fact!”, then I guess you’re right and you’re very welcome! Here’s another fact for you that you might enjoy learning: unlike food scarcity experienced by households in developing countries, food scarcity in households located in countries of abundance does unfortunately not lead to lower rates of obesity in those households!

You’re right there, but there’s no reason to spank others who have described living in houses with tight budgets with false claims. Food insecurity is one of the problems that leads folks to gorge when they have plenty. The “First of the Month” theme in 90’s rap songs might have been funny to people like you who insist that food is plentiful because it’s cheaper than ever before, but impoverished kids still experience the feast and famine of living on public assistance or SSI. They gorge when there is plenty of food in the house, and it sets up a habit and/or addiction linking food to security that many never bother to overcome. If food equals comfort, security, and a happier home environment, it’s pretty hard to shift back to thinking of food as mere sustenance even when you reach a stage in life where your pantry is full all month long.

Food insecurity is more common than you claim, and it’s one of many reasons why kids will eat everything in the house. Because for 3 weeks out of the month, there is very little to eat in the house.

[colander]

@Troppus

You’re right there, but there’s no reason to spank others who have described living in houses with tight budgets with false claims.

Whew! Good thing I didn’t do that!

Food insecurity is one of the problems that leads folks to gorge when they have plenty. The “First of the Month” theme in 90’s rap songs might have been funny to people like you who insist that food is plentiful because it’s cheaper than ever before, but impoverished kids still experience the feast and famine of living on public assistance or SSI.

Hey, Trop. Would it be at all possible for you to go for a couple posts where you don’t try to read bizarre, off-putting sentiments into my posts that have nothing to do with anything that I say? Because no offense, it is starting to get a little old. Thanks in advance.

[Troppus]

@colander

Whew! Good thing I didn’t do that!

Hey, Trop. Would it be at all possible for you to go for a couple posts where you don’t try to read bizarre, off-putting sentiments into my posts that have nothing to do with anything that I say? Because no offense, it is starting to get a little old. Thanks in advance.

Something’s getting old, that’s for sure. What does this say?

@colander

However, staple food prices in present-day America are low enough that they simply no longer serve as a useful consumption limiter in most households.

What does this say?

@Troppus

14.9 percent (17.9 million households) were food insecure.

Why do you hate stats, colander? It’s kind of becoming a theme with you.

[BigT]

@Troppus

Something’s getting old, that’s for sure. What does this say?

What does this say?
Why do you hate stats, colander? It’s kind of becoming a theme with you.

If you think that 14.9% disproves “most” then you need to go back and get those math lessons you should have learned in kindergarten.

And, seriously, people. Look at the research. There have been too many studies showing that calories are not the whole answer. Yet that’s the only answer parents are given. So how are they supposed to help?

And, no, healthy food isn’t the answer. I know from experience it doesn’t work. My mom kept all sugary and fatty foods out of the house during the time period when I gained the most weight. When you are hungry, you just eat a lot of other stuff.

And CBT doesn’t make your tummy stop hurting from wanting food. I’m not entirely sure why everyone acts like hunger isn’t a physical sensation. It’s the sensation of your tummy being empty.

[Troppus]

@BigT

If you think that 14.9% disproves “most” then you need to go back and get those math lessons you should have learned in kindergarten.

And, seriously, people. Look at the research. There have been too many studies showing that calories are not the whole answer. Yet that’s the only answer parents are given. So how are they supposed to help?

And, no, healthy food isn’t the answer. I know from experience it doesn’t work. My mom kept all sugary and fatty foods out of the house during the time period when I gained the most weight. When you are hungry, you just eat a lot of other stuff.

And CBT doesn’t make your tummy stop hurting from wanting food. I’m not entirely sure why everyone acts like hunger isn’t a physical sensation. It’s the sensation of your tummy being empty.

You going to show me where “most” was used?

Restricting calories and providing higher protein foods instead of high fat, high sugar foods is an effective method of controlling weight. And parents are aware that physical activity is helpful for maintaining a healthy weight, too. There’s no conspiracy against fat people designed to keep them from learning how to eat and exercise better. There is a legion of folks hopeful that science will provide an excuse (like “low metabolism”) for being overweight.

A more honest discussion would be one which discusses why obese people have such voracious appetites and what causes the addiction to overheating. But continuing to claim that reducing the amount you eat doesn’t result in weight loss is false. Continuing to claim obesity is hopeless and the obese are powerless to lose weight and practice better habits is false. Blaming the deliciousness of crappy, cheap food for our nation’s obesity problem is a cop-out. The cure for obesity may be incredibly unpleasant, but it’s simple.

[Nava]

@lavenderviolet

Until a child is old enough to go out on their own and buy food, then the parent does have control over the kid’s weight. It’s a lot harder to lose weight than it is to maintain your weight, and being teased for being the fat kid can really harm a child’s self image, so I think that parents do need to pay attention to their kid’s weight.

At that point, the parent should still be in control of the child’s budget.

[colander]

@Troppus

You going to show me where “most” was used?

I can show you where “most” was used.

@colander

If you say so. However, staple food prices in present-day America are low enough that they simply no longer serve as a useful consumption limiter in most households.

It is the second word from the last, if that helps. You’re welcome.

Restricting calories and providing higher protein foods instead of high fat, high sugar foods is an effective method of controlling weight.

And as people who have actually been confronted with this problem in the real world have been trying to explain to you, it is unfortunately not that easy to effectively enforce food intake restrictions on one member of a household without that method of restriction creating logistical problems for the other members of that household.

A more honest discussion would be one which discusses why obese people have such voracious appetites and what causes the addiction to overheating.

That would indeed be an interesting discussion to have. However, I fail to see how it is any more or less “honest” than the topic being discussed in this thread, which deals with effective management strategies for families dealing with youngsters thus afflicted.

But continuing to claim that reducing the amount you eat doesn’t result in weight loss is false. Continuing to claim obesity is hopeless and the obese are powerless to lose weight and practice better habits is false. Blaming the deliciousness of crappy, cheap food for our nation’s obesity problem is a cop-out. The cure for obesity may be incredibly unpleasant, but it’s simple.

Other people’s problems are always remarkably simple to solve, aren’t they?

[nearwildheaven]

@Troppus

You’re right there, but there’s no reason to spank others who have described living in houses with tight budgets with false claims. Food insecurity is one of the problems that leads folks to gorge when they have plenty. The “First of the Month” theme in 90’s rap songs might have been funny to people like you who insist that food is plentiful because it’s cheaper than ever before, but impoverished kids still experience the feast and famine of living on public assistance or SSI. They gorge when there is plenty of food in the house, and it sets up a habit and/or addiction linking food to security that many never bother to overcome. If food equals comfort, security, and a happier home environment, it’s pretty hard to shift back to thinking of food as mere sustenance even when you reach a stage in life where your pantry is full all month long.

Food insecurity is more common than you claim, and it’s one of many reasons why kids will eat everything in the house. Because for 3 weeks out of the month, there is very little to eat in the house.

There’s no food, but Mom always has hair weaves and sculptured nails.

:dubious:

How about families like the one I grew up in, where my mother would buy piles of snacks and junk food “for company” (which rarely, if ever, materialized) but it was my dad’s fault that we ate it?

:smack:

[colander]

@nearwildheaven

There’s no food, but Mom always has hair weaves and sculptured nails.

:dubious:

Why are you still here?

[stoplight]

There’s no food, but Mom always has hair weaves and sculptured nails.

certainly differing cultural attitudes exists concerning obesity, alcohol and drugs.

But continuing to claim that reducing the amount you eat doesn’t result in weight loss is false. Continuing to claim obesity is hopeless and the obese are powerless to lose weight and practice better habits is false. Blaming the deliciousness of crappy, cheap food for our nation’s obesity problem is a cop-out. The cure for obesity may be incredibly unpleasant, but it’s simple.

it is both unpleasant and difficult. All a heroin addict has to do is stop driving a needle in their arm, how simple is that?

[astro]

@stoplight

There’s no food, but Mom always has hair weaves and sculptured nails.

certainly differing cultural attitudes exists concerning obesity, alcohol and drugs.

But continuing to claim that reducing the amount you eat doesn’t result in weight loss is false. Continuing to claim obesity is hopeless and the obese are powerless to lose weight and practice better habits is false. Blaming the deliciousness of crappy, cheap food for our nation’s obesity problem is a cop-out. The cure for obesity may be incredibly unpleasant, but it’s simple.

it is both unpleasant and difficult. All a heroin addict has to do is stop driving a needle in their arm, how simple is that?

All they had to do to Kill Bin Laden was shoot him. Put a bullet in him. How simple was that? Why did it take so long? It was simple.

Obesity exists as the result of a complex matrix of behaviors and contexts. Losing weight is hard, keeping weight off permanently is extraordinarily hard. Saying that it’s all a thermodynamics and willpower issue is about as useful as the Bin Laden analogy.

[even_sven]

One thing that works very well is not getting overweight in the first place, and there are effective strategies for that.

[colander]

@even_sven

One thing that works very well is not getting overweight in the first place, and there are effective strategies for that.

Having a lot of money is a good way of not being poor. Hey, I just solved the world’s poverty crisis!

[Dangerosa]

I have a girlfriend with a tubby (not obese, but definately tubby) teen.

And he’s been tubby since six.

They are a “no snacks, no soda, no juice, organic, whole grain vegetarian shop at the co op household” with genetically high cholesterol so things like cheese are watched as well. And before you say “its his friends” - they are in a hippie neighborhood where most of his friends households have similar pantries.

The doctor has been assuming for years he’ll hit a growth spurt and stretch out. Hasn’t yet.

[stoplight]

@astro

All they had to do to Kill Bin Laden was shoot him. Put a bullet in him. How simple was that? Why did it take so long? It was simple.

Obesity exists as the result of a complex matrix of behaviors and contexts. Losing weight is hard, keeping weight off permanently is extraordinarily hard. Saying that it’s all a thermodynamics and willpower issue is about as useful as the Bin Laden analogy.

---

it is both unpleasant and difficult. All a heroin addict has to do is stop driving a needle in their arm, how simple is that?***

Astro I copied and pasted for your convenience my comment. Notice my first observation? perhaps you see the sarcasm attached to my second comment?