# In Memory of Daryl **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 22, 2003, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846 "2003-02-22T22:49:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/261 "2003-02-25T15:13:21Z")
> [@](#): > > **vanilla** said… > Ah yes, the old fundie Husband\_boss thing. > When I was married I did obey my huband in all things, including breaking the law and immorality. > Never again. > Marriage is SUPPOSED to be an equal partnership, and i doubt I will marry any mna who thinks it isn’t,even if he Isn’t a chrsitian.! Good for you, vanilla. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![vanilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f19dbf/32.png) [@vanilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vanilla)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/262 "2003-02-25T15:20:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Guinastasia \* > \*\* God is people. \*\* :eek: God is Soylent green??? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/263 "2003-02-25T15:48:54Z")
Well, he did say, “Take this and Eat-this is My Body” 😛 ---
**Author:** ![tiny\_ham](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@tiny\_ham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiny_ham)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/264 "2003-02-25T15:56:40Z")
By the way, my husband and I are not fundamentalists. Just today, if you want an example, he said “perhaps we shouldn’t buy a condo yet” and I said, “Well, we have the money and I did a little number crunching and we can afford it, so I think we should…let’s at least start looking” and guess what he said, “OK!” We are equals in all things, but like he said, it’s a tie breaker. Every decision he makes or I make takes the partner’s desires and questions and wishes into consideration before proceeding. If you’re trying to get me to say he beats me with a strap when I drop a towel, I’m not going to. I love him, he loves me, and my marriage is something that a great deal of our friends envy. And no, I don’t feel demeaned in any way. Frankly, it’s nice to have someone who will stand up in the middle of a six hour discussion and say “let’s just go to Charleston for spring break and that’s it”, rather than rehashing everything for three weeks. It worked for my parents, worked for his parents, and their parents before them. I have no complaints whatsoever about my marriage, nor do I feel oppressed or repressed or restricted in any way. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/265 "2003-02-25T16:16:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Joe\_Cool \* > And even if it’s true, bad judgment is something everybody is guilty of. Lots of people overreact to stimuli, and later on calm down and come to their senses. “Yup, I blew up that building, and 75 people died, but I realized later I’d overreacted. Now I’ve calmed down and come to my senses.” My point isn’t to compare what the parents did with blowing up buildings (make sure you don’t overlook this), but to emphasize the reality that, when we overreact, there are still places we won’t go under any circumstances. (For instance, when some jerk cuts me off in traffic, I’m not going to sideswipe him a mile down the road.) So somewhere in us, there are standards even for what is an ‘acceptable’ loss of temper/overreaction. Over time, we each choose what these standards are for ourselves. They reflect our values. It’s hard for me to see a parent disowning a kid even in a moment of stress unless, in the parent’s moral universe, disowning him for choosing different beliefs or standards of conduct was indeed acceptable. > [@](#): > > They may have been shitty parents. They may have been assholes. But it’s not the same thing as causing a death. OK, contributing to. I won’t niggle words. > [@](#): > > He was the one who chose suicide. Nobody is simply driven to do anything. It’s always a choice, and no matter what circumstances led you to where you are, your next step is always up to you. If you choose for your next step to end your life, then it’s all you. There, we’d disagree. But I’ve discussed my experience, and the reason for my attitudes, at more length in the [How Does “Suicide” Work???](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=164314&highlight=suicide) thread. > [@](#): > > And IMO short of an actual killing, anybody who would tell a grieving family that it’s their fault their son is dead is fucking scum. Period. I don’t think it should be done in the manner that some people here are suggesting. But should no one tell them “repent and be saved”? Under what circumstances should no one tell them that they have _need_ of repentance? ---
**Author:** ![Mars\_Horizon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mars_horizon/32/2804_2.png) [@Mars\_Horizon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mars_Horizon)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/266 "2003-02-25T16:20:32Z")
You know, I just read through this thread, and wow I’ve got to ask **Joe & Jersey** - isn’t there another cross country move you guys could make? This place was much quieter and kinder without you stirring up your usual fundamentalist bullshit. It was so nice without you here. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/267 "2003-02-25T16:24:38Z")
Hey **jarbaby** , I’ve stayed out of the tangent that you and **Diogenes** have been locked into, but I understand what you’re saying and it makes sense to me as a reasonable way to do things in a marriage. **Diogenes** , I think you’re trying to make **jar** ’s marriage into something it isn’t. [sub]Mind you, I’ve never met **jarbaby** or **jarhubby** IRL, but she has written extensively here about her life, and (to beat a long-dead horse) I take her at her word.[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/268 "2003-02-25T16:26:23Z")
> [@](#): > > _jarbabyj_ > If you’re trying to get me to say he beats me with a strap when I drop a towel, I’m not going to. I love him, he loves me, and my marriage is something that a great deal of our friends envy. I’m not trying to get you to say anything. I just want to know, hypothetically, what the guy is supposed to do if his wife rejects his “tiebreaker.” It’s obvious that I’m never going to get an answer to this. If I tried that crap on my wife she’d laugh in my face. What am I supposed to do at that point? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/269 "2003-02-25T16:31:35Z")
> [@](#): > > **RTFirefly said:** > Diogenes, I think you’re trying to make jar’s marriage into something it isn’t I’m not trying to make it into anything, and I’m really not even talking about **jar’s** marriage, specifically, just any of these “man is the head of the household” deals. This topic has come up before in other threads, specifically in regard to Promise Keepers, and nobody will ever tell me what happens if the woman won’t “submit.” ---
**Author:** ![tiny\_ham](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@tiny\_ham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiny_ham)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/270 "2003-02-25T16:35:49Z")
If I’ve agreed to submit ahead of time, why wouldn’t I submit? if there’s something I feel strongly about, I tell him. I don’t just refuse to do things because “I am woman, hear me roar.” ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/271 "2003-02-25T16:38:34Z")
My guess is she’d be threatened with divorce and offered a chance to “rethink” her response. ---
**Author:** ![tiny\_ham](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@tiny\_ham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiny_ham)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/272 "2003-02-25T16:40:57Z")
Yeah. You’ve got my marriage alllllll figured out. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/273 "2003-02-25T16:46:42Z")
But, back to the original OP. I’m not about to say I agree with the harsh, heartless stance JC has taken regarding suicide and the psychological manipulation that is heaped on gay kids in America. But I do think that the parents, in following their christian doctrine, probably had no idea the kid would take his own life. They probably thought (erroneously) that a little fear of god and religious isolation would force him to make a different choice. They’re probably devastated at what happened, and that it happened because they put their faith in an unloving god. I mean, this MUST be apparent to them, even if it is a case of too little too late. And in that sense, I could not use the word “fault” in this discussion. I would say they “contributed” to his suicide. And I believe these words are very different. Fault somehow implies intent, and I don’t think their intent was for their son to commit suicide. ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Cool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecb155/32.png) [@Joe\_Cool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Cool)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/274 "2003-02-25T16:46:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mars Horizon \* > \*\*You know, I just read through this thread, and wow I’ve got to ask > > **Joe & Jersey** - isn’t there another cross country move you guys could make? This place was much quieter and kinder without you stirring up your usual fundamentalist bullshit. It was so nice without you here. \*\* Oh, you’re tearin’ me apart. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/275 "2003-02-25T16:49:18Z")
Jarbaby, no offense to you or your marriage was intended here, but you haven’t answered the question, so I’m forced to guess. I personally don’t care what you do in your marriage, but if this is a rule, one would naturally figure that there’s a consequence to breaking that rule. I’d just like to know what it is. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/276 "2003-02-25T17:03:07Z")
I’ve started another thread about this in GD. Maybe I’ll get an answer there but I doubt it. I’ll probably just get more of the same defensive, evasive stuff I always get. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/277 "2003-02-25T17:04:11Z")
Obviously, her husband takes her feeling into consideration-and uses them to make a decision. She AGREES to the final decision, and it doesn’t sound like it’s something she absolutely cannot accept-more like, they can’t come to an agreement, and they both aren’t sure, so he says, “okay, this is it.” Guys, why don’t you start another thread about this, okay? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/278 "2003-02-25T17:12:13Z")
> [@](#): > > She AGREES to the final decision, and it doesn’t sound like it’s something she absolutely cannot accept-more like, they can’t come to an agreement, and they both aren’t sure, so he says, “okay, this is it.” This is NOT an answer to my questiojn. What if she DOESN"T agree to those terms? What if she flat out defies him? What then? Why are these people so fucking EVASIVE about this question? Gah! I’ll take this to my GD thread now. I’m done hijacking this one. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/279 "2003-02-25T17:48:30Z")
Because, **Diogenes** , it’s one of those things where what it sounds like is not what it is. I’ve tried to make that clearer in [your new thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=165545), and I hope **jarbaby** and others will join you and me there. ---
**Author:** ![Joe\_Cool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecb155/32.png) [@Joe\_Cool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joe_Cool)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2003, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846/280 "2003-02-25T19:26:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mars Horizon \* > \*\*You know, I just read through this thread, and wow I’ve got to ask > > **Joe & Jersey** - isn’t there another cross country move you guys could make? This place was much quieter and kinder without you stirring up your usual fundamentalist bullshit. It was so nice without you here. \*\* Actually, I like it here. I found that everyone I met, so far, is a Christian, and I have met a lot of people. 🙂 At ‘Calvary’ alone, they have over 2000 children a week in their schools. I noticed that even on my way here, the more south and southwest I went, the more “God” oriented everything was/is. I cannot tell you how many humongous crosses I saw, and how many “Jesus is the way” signs. It was great. So, thanks for the uninvite, Mars, but I think we’ll stay. Besides, this is where Joe\_Cool was raised, and his family has been here for about 350 years. One of the early spanish explorers was a Mr. Cool. Andres being the first name. So if you don’t like us being here and it bothers you, you can leave. See you around. 🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-memory-of-daryl/156846.md?page=15)