# In our country, we kill people like you. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 27, 2002, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178 "2002-11-27T19:21:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troy_mcclure_sf/32/4150_2.png) [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troy_McClure_SF)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/21 "2002-11-27T20:37:39Z")
> [@](#): > > He said he wanted to punch the bitch in the teeth. Aw, we wouldn’ta told! Well, I understand that he would want to get out of a place where this kind of shit could happen. But no way should Igno-bitch be able to get away with that. Can’t the co-op director (or whatever it is that co-ops have ;)) be brought into this? (Here’s hoping that the co-op director is not, in fact, Igno-bitch herself.) ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/22 "2002-11-27T21:13:44Z")
Ask the bitch why, if Somalia is so great, she doesn’t go back there. After all, she _did_ refer to it as “my country”, so I’m presuming she is not a citizen. She gets the benefits of being here, but doesn’t want to put up with the melting pot that is one of the things that has made this country what it is. ---
**Author:** ![Father\_of\_Loki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/13edae/32.png) [@Father\_of\_Loki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Father_of_Loki)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/23 "2002-11-27T21:23:57Z")
Maybe one day she will say it to the wrong person, and they will slap her upside the head. I wouldn’t leave if she is only stating her position, and not that of the general co-op. I’d see about maybe trying to get her out of there, though. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/24 "2002-11-27T22:12:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Father of Loki \* > Maybe one day she will say it to the wrong person, and they will slap her upside the head. If she’s lucky, that’s all they’d do. If I were gay and she’d said that to me, I’d be tempted to kick her butt up and down the hall three or four times. Hell, I’m \* not \* gay, and I’m \* still \* tempted to do it. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Father of Loki \* > I wouldn’t leave if she is only stating her position, and not that of the general co-op. I’d see about maybe trying to get her out of there, though. Normally, I’m inclined to tolerate an awful lot of obnoxiousness in the name of free speech. However, what she said was clearly harassment and might reasonably be considered a threat. I’d do all I legally could to get her butt thrown out of there, too. Are these condos and not apartments? If so, I’m pretty sure the owner’s association would have some provisions for dealing with residents harassing other residents. ---
**Author:** ![detop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bcef8e/32.png) [@detop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/detop)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/25 "2002-11-27T22:15:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Father of Loki \* > \*\*I wouldn’t leave if she is only stating her position, and not that of the general co-op. I’d see about maybe trying to get her out of there, though. \*\* Unfortunately, she would probably cry “racism” (since she’s frome Somalia, I’m assuming she’s Black). ---
**Author:** ![glarGH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/76d3ee/32.png) [@glarGH](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glarGH)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/26 "2002-11-27T22:24:03Z")
> [@](#): > > Unfortunately, she would probably cry “racism” (since she’s frome Somalia, I’m assuming she’s Black). Wouldn’t that be fuckin rich?? GOD DAMN ASSWART MOTHER OF SATANSHIT COCK FUUCKKKKKK!!! **Kn\*ckers** , you want some back up? I can bitchslap with the best of them. ---
**Author:** ![milroyj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@milroyj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/milroyj)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/27 "2002-11-27T22:33:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by detop \* > \*\*Unfortunately, she would probably cry “racism” (since she’s frome Somalia, I’m assuming she’s Black). \*\* Or she might cry “religious intolerance”, since she’s likely Muslim. Chalk one (more) up for the Religion of Peace! ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/28 "2002-11-27T22:39:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by milroyj \* > \*\*Or she might cry “religious intolerance”, since she’s likely Muslim. > > Chalk one (more) up for the Religion of Peace! \*\* What the fuck does Islam have to do with this situation? We’re dealing with an ignorant bigot, leave Islam out of it. ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/29 "2002-11-27T22:45:15Z")
She’s probably talking about the two Somali lesbians. (That sounds like the lead-in to a joke, “There were these two Somali lesbians…”) [http://www.afrol.com/News2001/som002\_lesbians\_sentenced.htm](http://www.afrol.com/News2001/som002_lesbians_sentenced.htm) [http://www.afrol.com/News2001/som003\_lesbians\_sentenced2.htm](http://www.afrol.com/News2001/som003_lesbians_sentenced2.htm) [http://www.afrol.com/News2001/som004\_lesbians\_sentenced3.htm](http://www.afrol.com/News2001/som004_lesbians_sentenced3.htm) And, if she is… [http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/1183937.stm](http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/1183937.stm) > [@](#): > > Friday, 23 February, 2001, 10:54 GMT > Somali ‘lesbian sentences’ denied > > Police in Puntland have denied a story widely reported in Somalia that two women were sentenced to death for being lesbians. > > According to Mogadishu newspapers, the women were reported to have been found guilty of “exercising unnatural behaviour” by having a lesbian relationship. > > But police in Boosaaso, where the sentence was reported to have been passed, say the case never came before the courts. > > The Qaran newspaper in Mogadishu has now printed an apology to their readers. > > It had been reported that hundreds had packed the court in the northern coastal town. > > But no official confirmation was ever received from the Puntland authorities. > > Puntland declared itself autonomous from Somalia in August 1998 and has since set up its own administrative infrastructure. ---
**Author:** ![airdisc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e19adc/32.png) [@airdisc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/airdisc)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/30 "2002-11-27T22:56:17Z")
So, because she’s a Somali, she’s automatically a black Muslim? Most of America is Christian and white, does that mean all Americans are white Christians? And World Eater is right, who cares what race or religion she is? ---
**Author:** ![milroyj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@milroyj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/milroyj)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/31 "2002-11-27T23:32:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by airdisc \* > \*\*So, because she’s a Somali, she’s automatically a black Muslim? Most of America is Christian and white, does that mean all Americans are white Christians? And World Eater is right, who cares what race or religion she is? \*\* Not automatically a black Muslim, but very most likely a black or Arab Muslim. [http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/so.html](http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/so.html) Ethnic groups: Somali 85%, Bantu and other non-Somali (including 30,000 Arabs) Religions: Sunni Muslim Based on her actions, she is an ignorant bigot, so where did her ignorant bigotry come from? There’s no evidence that her bigotry is based on race, so is it possible, just possible, that her bigotry is based on her religion? (Or to use the PC terms, the “warped” version of Islam as practiced by some people in some locations, but not true Islam, the Religion of Peace?) ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/32 "2002-11-27T23:37:16Z")
**milroyj:** _There’s no evidence that her bigotry is based on race, so is it possible, just possible, that her bigotry is based on her religion?_ Is the bigotry of homophobic fundamentalist Christians based on **their** religion? Or is that just the “warped” version of Christianity as practiced by some people in some locations, but not true Christianity, the Religion of Peace? ---
**Author:** ![Muad\_Dib](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/35a633/32.png) [@Muad\_Dib](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muad_Dib)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/33 "2002-11-27T23:54:04Z")
Call the police. What she did is a crime. ---
**Author:** ![Kitfox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f6c823/32.png) [@Kitfox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kitfox)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2002, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/34 "2002-11-27T23:58:02Z")
“In my country, we kill homosexuals” Comeback: “Yeah, in your country they also wipe their ass with their hands, aren’t you glad you live here now?” Comeback: “Hope you are better at it then killing Rangers, or are you going bring 125 friends…” Comeback: “How did you live so long…” Comeback: “Oh really, I here I thought you guys just starved children” Comeback: “In my country, we kill people often for no reason at all…” Comeback: "Really? I didn’t know that. See, in my country, we could give a rats ass about your country. " Comeback: “Wow! Good thing I don’t live there! Whew, thanks for the warning, Lady!” ---
**Author:** ![milroyj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@milroyj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/milroyj)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2002, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/35 "2002-11-28T00:21:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kimstu \* > \*\ ***milroyj:** _There’s no evidence that her bigotry is based on race, so is it possible, just possible, that her bigotry is based on her religion?_ > > Is the bigotry of homophobic fundamentalist Christians based on **their** religion? Or is that just the “warped” version of Christianity as practiced by some people in some locations, but not true Christianity, the Religion of Peace? \*\* No. Yes. How many homophobic fundamentalist Christians (HFCs) kill people for being gay? How many HFC leaders issue religious commands to kill authors or journalists whose views they disagree with? How many HFCs riot in the streets, both targeting other people’s religious buildings, as well as mere passersby? Including putting a tire around their neck, pouring on the gasoline, and lighting the match? How many HFCs hijack airplanes? How many HFCs hijack airplanes and drive them into skyrises? How many HFCs commit suicide bombings on buses, cafes, malls, and religious observances? How many HFCs break into homes in the middle of the night to shoot children in their beds? BTW, I have no use for HFCs, but they are not doing anything of the sort, yet Islamist radicals ARE. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2002, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/36 "2002-11-28T01:05:08Z")
**milroyj** replied to me: \*“Is the bigotry of homophobic fundamentalist Christians based on their religion? Or is that just the ‘warped’ version of Christianity as practiced by some people in some locations, but not true Christianity, the Religion of Peace?” No. Yes.\* Well, if Christians are allowed to claim that the homophobia of fundamentalist Christians is not really Christianity’s fault and doesn’t represent “true” Christianity, seems to me Muslims can equally well claim that the homophobia of fundamentalist Muslims is not really Islam’s fault and doesn’t represent “true” Islam. _How many homophobic fundamentalist Christians (HFCs) kill people for being gay?_ That’s exactly what the [Christian Reconstructionists](http://www.publiceye.org/magazine/v08n1/chrisre1.html) think we should do. They feel God requires them to establish a Christian theocracy in the US, in which civil law would reflect Biblical law. Capital punishment would apply, in part, to “apostasy (abandonment of the faith), heresy, blasphemy, witchcraft, astrology, adultery, ‘sodomy or homosexuality,’ incest, striking a parent, incorrigible juvenile delinquency, and, in the case of women, ‘unchastity before marriage.’” These aren’t just a few isolated loonies, either; they have a lot of financial support and the ear of a number of influential people. Prominent evangelist (and Presidential candidate) Pat Robertson has written that “there is no way that government can operate successfully unless led by godly men and women operating under the laws of the God of Jacob”—which include capital punishment for homosexuality. Plenty of Christians embrace the idea of Christian theocracy just as strongly as many Muslims do Islamic theocracy. So far, the extremist Islamic theocrats—working in much more deprived and unstable countries, with more chance for violent power seizure—have been more politically successful. But if the extremist Christian theocrats get their way, they will kill homosexuals just as enthusiastically. For the present, they have to make do with illegal murder, like these members of the group [Christian Identity](http://www.rickross.com/reference/christian_identity/christianidentity16.html): > [@](#): > > Violence has followed Identity followers themselves. In the past year, claiming they were acting under the authority of “God’s Law,” Identity followers have been charged in the slaying of a gay couple and the killing of a postal worker in a shooting spree at a Jewish day-care center. Want to “use the PC terms” and claim that those are just “warped” views that don’t represent “true” Christianity? Fine, but in that case, non-extremist Muslims are similarly entitled to distance themselves from “warped” views that don’t represent “true” Islam. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2002, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/37 "2002-11-28T01:27:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kimstu \* > Want to “use the PC terms” and claim that those are just “warped” views that don’t represent “true” Christianity? Fine, but in that case, non-extremist Muslims are similarly entitled to distance themselves from “warped” views that don’t represent “true” Islam. But how many choose to do so? It seems to me that the ones protesting the most that this must be a “warped” version of Islam are Western (non-Muslim) apologists, _not_ the Muslims themselves–who seem to give off a deafening silence on the matter much of the time. ---
**Author:** ![milroyj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@milroyj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/milroyj)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2002, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/38 "2002-11-28T01:39:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kimstu \* > **[Well, if Christians are allowed to claim that the homophobia of fundamentalist Christians is not really Christianity’s fault and doesn’t represent “true” Christianity, seems to me Muslims can equally well claim that the homophobia of fundamentalist Muslims is not really Islam’s fault and doesn’t represent “true” Islam.** Well, there is the matter of numbers. As in numbers of people killed based on religious beliefs. Your cite about Christian Identity indicates a “gay couple and a postal worker” were killed. That would be 3. How many were killed on 9/11? That would be 3,000. How many hundreds of Jews have been killed since the start of the last intifada? How many hundreds of vacationers were killed in Bali? How many hundreds of people were killed in the Nigerian riots? All based on “warped” Islamic religious beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2002, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/39 "2002-11-28T02:09:54Z")
**DR:** _But how many choose to do so? It seems to me that the ones protesting the most that this must be a “warped” version of Islam are Western (non-Muslim) apologists, not the Muslims themselves–who seem to give off a deafening silence on the matter much of the time._ Or at least, deafening silence is all you hear from the mainstream media. But that doesn’t mean there **aren’t** moderate Muslims strongly condemning Islamic-extremist violence: [here](http://www.religioustolerance.org/reac_ter16.htm) are some examples, including ones from the Organization of the Islamic Conference (57 Muslim nations), high-level politicians in Muslim countries, and prominent imams and other Muslim religious leaders. And of course, Muslims in America and other developed countries have been [very vocal](http://www.capitalresearch.org/publications/organizational_trends/0204c.htm) in warning against and condemning Islamic extremism. Why don’t you learn about these reactions in your newspaper or on the TV, next to the constant stream of stories about violence by Muslims? Because the stereotype of the Evil Violent Muslim Fundamentalist is a hot news item these days. Partly because we were attacked by Muslim fundamentalists, partly because we’re gearing up for a war with a Muslim nation, partly because violence and barbarity sell well, Muslim peacefulness and rejection of extremism is just not considered newsworthy. **milroyj:** _Well, there is the matter of numbers._ Let’s see: first, you say that maybe the homophobia of the person described in the OP is the fault of her religion (Islam). I say “well, by that logic, the homophobia of a Christian is the fault of Christianity.” You say that Christian extremists don’t do bad things like support the killing of homosexuals. I provide evidence that shows that they do. Now you say, “well yeah, but Christians don’t do as much of it.” :rolleyes: So, okay: what are your numerical criteria for determining when religiously-motivated violence and bigotry are the fault of the essential nature of a religion, and when they are simply the fault of unworthy followers who don’t represent the “true” nature of the religion? Please be precise. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2002, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178/40 "2002-11-28T02:27:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kimstu \* > Or at least, deafening silence is all you hear from the mainstream media. But that doesn’t mean there **aren’t** moderate Muslims strongly condemning Islamic-extremist violence: [here](http://www.religioustolerance.org/reac_ter16.htm) are some examples, including ones from the Organization of the Islamic Conference (57 Muslim nations), high-level politicians in Muslim countries, and prominent imams and other Muslim religious leaders. Well, from the very top of that link you provide (bolding mine, of course): > [@](#): > > **Political** representatives from the Organization of the Islamic Conference issued a statement on 2001-OCT-10 which condemned the terrorist attacks on the U.S. (See below). **Notably absent has been a corresponding statement by an organization of moderate Muslim religious leaders.** Also, > [@](#): > > And of course, Muslims in America and other developed countries have been [very vocal](http://www.capitalresearch.org/publications/organizational_trends/0204c.htm) in warning against and condemning Islamic extremism. If moderate Muslims identify the “extremist” ideology as such a threat, and if they are so powerless to do anything to combat it, what does that say about which branch of Islam–the moderate or the extremist–truly holds the mainstream? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-our-country-we-kill-people-like-you/139178.md?page=3)