# In re: Atheists v. Christians debate **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 19, 2015, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153 "2015-10-19T17:19:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/101 "2015-10-21T13:48:02Z")
I’m not a shill, and neither is my Spartacus. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/102 "2015-10-21T14:01:07Z")
> [@simster](#): > > Shills never admit to being shills - quite often, they deny it vigorously. Uhoh. Looks like he’s got you there, dougie.☹ ---
**Author:** ![dougie\_monty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@dougie\_monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougie_monty)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/103 "2015-10-21T14:47:55Z")
You all are the ones who made up this nonsense about “shill,” and have stuck to it. If I had mentioned a fairly good restaurant in the South Bay, or even a quick, convenient route from someplace to somewhere, does that mean I am “shilling” for the restaurant or the destination? Of course not. You bear the burden of proof here, not I. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/104 "2015-10-21T14:52:41Z")
If someone said “hey, check out this great restaurant’s website”, and then someone said “I’d prefer you use your own words: what do YOU think about the restaurant?”, and the reply was “just go to the website, it’s awesome!”, then people would rightly suspect them of shilling, whether or not it was accurate. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/105 "2015-10-21T14:56:07Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > You all are the ones who made up this nonsense about “shill,” and have stuck to it. **If I had mentioned a fairly good restaurant in the South Bay** , or even a quick, convenient route from someplace to somewhere, does that mean I am “shilling” for the restaurant or the destination? Of course not. You bear the burden of proof here, not I. If it’s a new restaurant that won’t even open for another week or more, yes. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/106 "2015-10-21T15:01:28Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > You all are the ones who made up this nonsense about “shill,” and have stuck to it. If I had mentioned a fairly good restaurant in the South Bay, or even a quick, convenient route from someplace to somewhere, does that mean I am “shilling” for the restaurant or the destination? Of course not. You bear the burden of proof here, not I. If all you say is “go check out this restaurant/destination” with NO OTHER INFORMATION, especially when asked for it - then yes, you are shilling for that restaurant or destination. Your actions are the evidence here - all your protests to the contrary are missing the point entirely. More than anything - I was trying to point out the irony of a JW pointing to a Presbyterian website as the “authoritative” answer on the debate of “christians vs atheists” - when you add in the common JW practice of “dropping off a piece of literature” at the door and leaving without any real discussion - that irony is hard to miss. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/107 "2015-10-21T15:06:41Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > If someone said “hey, check out this great restaurant’s website”, and then someone said “I’d prefer you use your own words: what do YOU think about the restaurant?”, and the reply was “just go to the website, it’s awesome!”, then people would rightly suspect them of shilling, whether or not it was accurate. And if people asked for more information about an item at the restaurant, and the reply was yet again, “Just check out the website”, _although it had already been brought up that the website didn’t go into any detail about that one item_, then shilling is once again suspected. Is it too much to ask for a link that tells us about the debate that is the subject of this thread, instead of just giving us the general link to the church and its calendar over and over again, which doesn’t give us a fucking clue about the debate itself? ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/108 "2015-10-21T15:16:59Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > If I had mentioned a fairly good restaurant in the South Bay, Shilling for Eatalian Cafe, I see. ---
**Author:** ![dougie\_monty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@dougie\_monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougie_monty)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/109 "2015-10-21T15:30:22Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > And if people asked for more information about an item at the restaurant, and the reply was yet again, “Just check out the website”, _although it had already been brought up that the website didn’t go into any detail about that one item_, then shilling is once again suspected. Is it too much to ask for a link that tells us about the debate that is the subject of this thread, instead of just giving us the general link to the church and its calendar over and over again, which doesn’t give us a fucking clue about the debate itself? Well, I see your point… However, all I had to go on was the newspaper ad (which gave the Web address), and that ad didn’t give much detail. Remember, however, that in the OP I wanted to wait until enough interest had been generated before posting any details–otherwise there wouldn’t be much point to it–right? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/110 "2015-10-21T15:32:12Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > Well, I see your point… > However, all I had to go on was the newspaper ad (which gave the Web address), and that ad didn’t give much detail. > > Remember, however, that in the OP I wanted to wait until enough interest had been generated before posting any details–otherwise there wouldn’t be much point to it–right? Here’s a thought: Next time, don’t start a thread until you have something to say, m’kay? ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/111 "2015-10-21T15:44:53Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Here’s a thought: Next time, don’t start a thread until you have something to say, m’kay? Dude. He’s been registered longer than I, and nearly as long as you. You know he won’t change his spots now. (Also, confidential to **Czar** : I finally don’t have a conflict for Ory this year–assuming I make it, buy you a beer?) ---
**Author:** ![Maggie\_the\_Ocelot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@Maggie\_the\_Ocelot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maggie_the_Ocelot)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/112 "2015-10-21T15:47:19Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Shilling for Eatalian Cafe, I see. I personally will shill forever for the Gardena Bowl cafe - yes, it’s a cafe in a bowling alley, yes, it has all the atmosphere of, well, a bowling alley coffee shop, but it has some freaking amazing Japanese-Hawaiian food. Their tempura is some of the best I’ve ever had, and I’ve gotten in discussions with someone who makes a 15-mile drive just for their bacon fried rice. Seriously, give it a shot. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/113 "2015-10-21T15:54:48Z")
> [@andros](#): > > (Also, confidential to **Czar** : I finally don’t have a conflict for Ory this year–assuming I make it, buy you a beer?) See you at The Con. ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2015, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/114 "2015-10-21T22:30:04Z")
Remember [Hanlon’s Razor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanlon%27s_razor)? “Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.” I’m much more inclined to believe dougie is more stupid than he is a malicious shiller. He has a standard, you know. He doesn’t use any source younger than 55 years. ---
**Author:** ![dougie\_monty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@dougie\_monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougie_monty)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2015, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/115 "2015-10-22T05:13:10Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > Remember [Hanlon’s Razor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanlon%27s_razor)? “Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.” > > I’m much more inclined to believe dougie is more stupid than he is a malicious shiller. > > He has a standard, you know. He doesn’t use any source younger than 55 years. Come out here and call me stupid to my face and I’ll show you what I know. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2015, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/116 "2015-10-22T05:23:45Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > Remember [Hanlon’s Razor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanlon%27s_razor)? “Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.” > > I’m much more inclined to believe dougie is more stupid than he is a malicious shiller. > > He has a standard, you know. He doesn’t use any source younger than 55 years. > [@dougie\_monty](#): > > Come out here and call me stupid to my face and I’ll show you what I know. Don’t do it, **Knowed Out**! It’s a trap! He’s gonna hit you with 55 years of unread copies of _The Watchtower_! ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2015, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/117 "2015-10-22T06:03:52Z")
> [@dougie\_monty](#): > > Come out here and call me stupid to my face and I’ll show you what I know. You follow a stupid religion, so many of your actions are stupid, simply because you toe the line. Not being able to see your religion for the farce it is, isn’t stupid in and of itself. You were brainwashed from a young age, I assume. It’s hard to shake it off if devotion comes before reason. So I’d say a person can be smart, but be functionally stupid because of adherence to a backwards moral code, and the delusions that come from being indoctrinated from early childhood into a shitty system. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2015, 8:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/118 "2015-10-22T08:12:51Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > I also predict that no one attending will change their opinion on the matter and both sides will come away firmly convinced that their side won the debate. I dunno…I like it when atheists get invited to a religious gathering to debate, handily win the debate, and so the church in question decides to disband. Then we all had ice cream. True story. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2015, 10:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/119 "2015-10-22T10:05:49Z")
Normally, I’d pick the Atheists. But the Christians are getting five points at home. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2015, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153/120 "2015-10-22T12:09:13Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Normally, I’d pick the Atheists. But the Christians are getting five points at home. That, and the fact that a couple of the debaters are saying that they are not really there to debate, but to win converts. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-re-atheists-v-christians-debate/735153.md?page=7)