# In the 1950s, was male on male sex regarded as something horny guys did when they couldn't get dates? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 6, 2022, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414 "2022-04-06T19:21:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/101 "2022-04-08T16:54:13Z")
Can you please tell us how old you were in 1950, what socio-cultural group you and your friends belonged to, where exactly they engaged in this behavior (parents’ house, car, outdoors, etc.), and what their later sexuality was. The context would be very helpful. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/102 "2022-04-08T17:39:22Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > Are you referring to personal recollections? If so, that would make you about 90, right? > > While it may have been the view among some small subset of the U.S. population, the prevailing attitude in the 1950’s was that gay behavior was a sign of mental illness, I am 89 years old. Between 1950 and 1957 I participated in youth groups that were interested in natural science. This was in Berkeley, Oakland and San Francisco. I graduated from public school and attended San Francisco City college. I was drafted and chose the USAF. I was in pilot training until a post Korea rif made me an enlisted man. I learned and subsequently taught and maintained analogue computers. I was based in California, Arizona, Texas, Illinois and Nevada. The statement is my recollection of what I observed at the time. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/103 "2022-04-08T18:44:18Z")
You don’t need to be gay to get AIDs. > [@Toxylon](#): > > Wasn’t it the Hite Report that discussed circle jerking among heterosexual adolescents as something that isn’t too uncommon? Certainly it was talked about. In Scouts, there were constant rumors. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/104 "2022-04-08T19:13:13Z")
Definitely there were rumors. But rumors are not the truth. For most straight guys in the 50s, male on male sex was repellent. This wasn’t always so (in the 19th century, it was considered a minor issue as long as you didn’t “play the woman”). In the 1920s, NYC and other big cities had thriving and relatively open gay communities. But the Depression led to a crackdown and a major effort to demonize gays. By the 50s, that effort had been successful and straight men would not consider sex with another man. > **[Gay New York: Gender, Urban Culture, and the Making of the Gay Male World,...](https://www.amazon.com/Gay-New-York-Culture-1890-1940/dp/0465026214)** > > Gay New York: Gender, Urban Culture, and the Making of the Gay Male World, 1890-1940 \[Chauncey, George\] on Amazon.com. \*FREE\* shipping on qualifying offers. Gay New York: Gender, Urban Culture, and the Making of the Gay Male World, 1890-1940 ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/105 "2022-04-08T19:51:30Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > For most straight guys in the 50s, male on male sex was repellent. The statement is not valid. There is no data to quantify ‘most’ for New York let alone the entire US. It would be valid to say that ‘to some straight guys in the 50s, male on male sex was repellent’. Also, your statement does not exclude mine. The act may or may not have been repellent to those who used it as a substitute for MF sex. It’s inclusive. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/106 "2022-04-08T20:43:33Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Definitely there were rumors. But rumors are not the truth. Circle Jerks are not really male on male sex. Each dude is jerking himself. Mind you some rumors had it they were jerking the next guy over. The Hite Report, above, seems to think they were not uncommon. I never attended one, so have no dog in this hunt. I can only attest to the rumors. But back to the OP- if we are talking 1950’s and SF etc area, maybe the gay sex among “hetero” males was actually among closeted gay dudes? It must have been tough for gays back then. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/107 "2022-04-08T20:46:07Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > The Hite Report, above, seems to think they were not uncommon. Did the Hite Report state that people admitted to participating in them, admitted to knowing about them, or both? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/108 "2022-04-08T20:49:23Z")
Why not read it? > **[Why Straight Men Are Joining Masturbation Clubs](https://www.gq.com/story/why-straight-men-are-joining-masturbation-clubs)** > > For some men, taking an act that's traditionally solitary and potentially shame-inducing, and instead turning it into a communal bonding experience, can be powerfully freeing. _Ward cites a 1981 report on male sexuality by sexologist Shere Hite, which suggested that nearly 20 percent of men had engaged in group masturbation during adolescence._ > **[The Hite Report A Nationwide Study : Hite,shere : Free Download, Borrow, and...](https://archive.org/stream/in.ernet.dli.2015.139076/2015.139076.The-Hite-Report-A-Nationwide-Study_djvu.txt)** > > Book Source: Digital Library of India Item 2015.139076dc.contributor.author: Hite,sheredc.date.accessioned: 2015-07-04T02:35:40Zdc.date.available:... ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/109 "2022-04-08T20:50:30Z")
What page is the info on? ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/110 "2022-04-08T22:08:33Z")
If this was a substitute for guys who couldn’t get dates, doesn’t that imply that if they HAD dates, they’s be getting all the sex they needed. My recollection it that women, in general, weren’t nearly so accommodating back in the '50s. The guys would be just as horny, or more so, after these dates. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/111 "2022-04-08T22:36:52Z")
That was also true in the 1980s. This movie, which aired a few times on Lifetime, was inspired by a guy I went to HS with who was murdered by a police officer and to this day, all kinds of information has been covered up, hence the movie’s title. > **[The Coverup (2008) - IMDb](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1153543/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1)** > > The Coverup: Directed by Brian Jun. With Gabriel Mann, Eliza Dushku, John Savage, Mark Pellegrino. The story centers on around the mysterious death of repeat drunk driving offender Thacker and the discovery of his body in an alley behind the... I never knew of his existence while he was alive, although I did know his sister. There’s a lot of other backstory, but in the end, it was discovered that while this young man lived in Des Moines, he was making multiple trips to Marshalltown, 40 miles away and the city where he died, because he had a secret boyfriend there. Here’s more information. > **[Thacker v. Eldred](https://law.justia.com/cases/iowa/court-of-appeals/1986/84-2004-0.html)** > > Thacker v. Eldred - 388 N.W.2d 665 I believe the movie was made for theatrical release, although AFAIK it never was, because the home decor and cars were very accurate to the early 1980s. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/112 "2022-04-08T22:43:22Z")
ISTR having seen it on PBS! I do remember it was quite interesting. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/113 "2022-04-08T22:52:44Z")
I’ve also heard that it was not unheard-of for gay men and lesbians who were good friends to get married, and live together, while quietly being with the people they really wanted to be with. Whenever they were asked about children, they would say, “Hasn’t happened yet, has it?” Wasn’t there an episode of “Alice,” in the mid 1970s, that addressed the male homosexual/pedophile thing? ---
**Author:** ![chela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chela/32/21582_2.png) [@chela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chela)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/114 "2022-04-08T23:00:20Z")
Pulp fiction, magazines of the 30’s-60’s were on the fringes yet avail to a wide audience. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2022, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/115 "2022-04-08T23:37:01Z")
Pulp fiction wouldn’t touch homosexuality with a ten-foot bug-eyed-monster. I don’t think they were even allowed as villains. The subject, as we keep saying, was unspeakable. Society may have changed a bit by the late 60s, but the last pulp magazines had died in the early 1950s. Weirdly, Wiki has a page called [Gay pulp fiction](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gay_pulp_fiction), but it doesn’t mention pulps at all. It does note that a few paperbacks were published as early as 1952 but even the racy publishers waited until the late 60s to put homosexuality in over-the-counter novels. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2022, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/116 "2022-04-09T01:54:40Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > Another anecdote: I like to watch old NFL football games on YouTube. If you put in a team and year (say, 1984 Miami Dolphins) you can often find full feature length games, commercials included. Speaking of old TV and what wasn’t generally known about whom, a while back I saw an early episode of _The Carol Burnett Show_ where Jim Nabors was interacting with Rock Hudson. I think Carol knew, but the home audience? No way. ---
**Author:** ![Toxylon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f05b48/32.png) [@Toxylon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toxylon)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2022, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/117 "2022-04-09T06:07:38Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > straight men would not consider sex with another man. But the very essence of a circle jerk is that it skirts the “sex with another man”, with plenty of deniability to self, if needed. No tab went near any slot, and most likely, no-one even touched you except you. Every straight male masturbates anyway, so it’s only a step to masturbate with your buddies etc. ---
**Author:** ![eschrodinger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschrodinger/32/122_2.png) [@eschrodinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschrodinger)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2022, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/118 "2022-04-09T08:13:42Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Pulp fiction wouldn’t touch homosexuality with a ten-foot bug-eyed-monster. I don’t think they were even allowed as villains. The subject, as we keep saying, was unspeakable. There’s a broader meaning than just the magazines. Lesbian fiction was pretty well established in the 50s and 60s. Some literature, but also a fair number of pulp novels. They had a wider audience than the gay fiction. Part of why they were tolerated is that there was a formula of an innocent, younger “straight” girl, who enters a misguided relationship with the older, predatory, usually butch, lesbian. But in the end, the younger “straight” girl usually finds the right man and gets married. Or dies. Or goes insane. The formula was that a character could not reach the end of the novel and be both happy and a lesbian. That would make it degenerate. _The Price of Salt_ was considered groundbreaking in 1952 as the first such (literary) lesbian novel with a “happy ending.” The older woman has lost everything, including even visitation with her child, but the lesbian couple are together at the end. The novel was rereleased a year or two later as a pulp novel. ---
**Author:** ![nightshadea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/7ba0ec/32.png) [@nightshadea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nightshadea)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2022, 10:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/119 "2022-04-09T10:06:01Z")
there was a certain thing going on back in the 90s and 00s because there was a backlash against being bisexual or bi-curious because the way it was looked at was it meant you basically hetro and just saying you were into the same sex because it was easier to “play around” … I ran into this so much that I just said I wasn’t looking for anyone actively … ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2022, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414/120 "2022-04-09T12:28:26Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > > [@RealityChuck](#): > > > > Definitely there were rumors. But rumors are not the truth. > > The Hite Report, above, seems to think they were not uncommon. The Hite Report came out in 1981, not the 50s. Attitudes toward both homosexuality and masturbation had changed greatly over that time frame. In the 50s, both were universally reviled. By 1981, people were more accepting. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-1950s-was-male-on-male-sex-regarded-as-something-horny-guys-did-when-they-couldnt-get-dates/962414.md?page=7)