# In the MCU, what is a god? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** movies\ **Created:** [June 19, 2021, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634 "2021-06-19T16:01:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2021, 8:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/61 "2021-06-21T08:38:32Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > _Allfather_ is literally one of the names of Odin. In mythology, sure, but is it in the movies? I can’t remember. I know that in Norse mythology, Valhalla is just a place in Asgard, but the movies specifically refer to it as the Asgardian afterlife - their concept of heaven. It’s obvious that the MCU gods believe in something greater than themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Enjoy\_Slurm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/enjoy_slurm/32/3937_2.png) [@Enjoy\_Slurm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enjoy_Slurm)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2021, 9:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/62 "2021-06-21T09:06:56Z")
> [@P-man](#): > > What about One-Above-All? This is what I came into say. “As the supreme being within the Multiverse,[[9]](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/One-Above-All_(Multiverse)#cite_note-Official_Handbook_of_the_Marvel_Universe_A-Z_Vol_1_6-9) the One-Above-All is omnipotent[[_citation needed_](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Marvel_Database:Citation)] (and presents himself as all-powerful),[[3]](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/One-Above-All_(Multiverse)#cite_note-Ultimates_2_Vol_1_100-3) omnipresent,[[_citation needed_](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Marvel_Database:Citation)] and omniscient,[[_citation needed_](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Marvel_Database:Citation)] and is above all cosmic powers and abstract entities, even the [Living Tribunal](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Living_Tribunal).” ---
**Author:** ![Scarlax](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scarlax/32/2927_2.png) [@Scarlax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scarlax)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2021, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/63 "2021-06-21T14:25:34Z")
Ooh baby, do you know what that’s worth? Ooh, > [@Alessan](#): > > Valhalla is just a place in Asgard, ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2021, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/64 "2021-06-21T14:31:15Z")
> [@Kimera757](#): > > Loki is actually a frost giant (who is just really short by the standards of his people) so if godhood is based on heredity then he is not a god. He was adopted by Odin and raised as an Asgardian. He can change his appearance so he normally looks like an Asgardian (who look human) and we rarely see him turn blue. Loki is resentful and said he wanted to inherit Odin’s throne, rather than let his older (adopted) brother Thor inherit. It’s better to say godhood is hereditary, but not genetic. Loki, Thor, and Hel inherited godhood from their father, just like they could inherit the throne of Asgard. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2021, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/65 "2021-06-21T14:32:44Z")
> [@LauderdaleFort](#): > > I have Disney+ and watched a couple of minutes here and there. I watched Civil War and it did nothing for me. The plot holes and the one-on-one massive battles where you know nothing is really going to happen and “gods” figthing alongside a person with a Glock. That’s the problem, you keep watching this movies with zero context. Without their history and character development all you are getting is the big super hero fight scenes, and if you are not into that there is nothing there for you. Try watching the first few in order, at least until the first Avengers movie. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2021, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/66 "2021-06-21T17:05:51Z")
I can’t let this go by without a big 👍. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2021, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/67 "2021-06-21T23:30:36Z")
I wonder if the people would allow Loki to inherit if his (MCU) parentage was known? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2021, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/68 "2021-06-21T23:50:49Z")
Civil War definitely isn’t the movie to start with, unfamiliar with the others. Neither, probably, are any of the movies with “Avengers” in the title. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2021, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/69 "2021-06-22T00:07:37Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > I wonder if the people would allow Loki to inherit if his (MCU) parentage was known? That’s a good question. Loki ruled Asgard (in Odin’s guise) apparently well enough that no one rebelled. He at least has the chops to rule. And we’ll see if there’s any opposition to Valkyrie becoming the Queen. She’s Asgardian, but no hereditary right to the throne. > [@Chronos](#): > > Civil War definitely isn’t the movie to start with, unfamiliar with the others. Neither, probably, are any of the movies with “Avengers” in the title. The best method would be to watch them in the sequence they were released. > **[List of Marvel Cinematic Universe films | Films](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Marvel_Cinematic_Universe_films#Films)** > > Marvel Studios releases its films in groups called "Phases". But if that’s too much, any of the films that introduce the protagonist don’t need much prior knowledge. So, _Iron Man_ (2008), _Thor_ (2011), _Captain America: The First Avenger_ (2011), _Guardians of the Galaxy_ (2014), _Ant-Man_ (2015), _Doctor Strange_ (2016), _Black Panther_ (2018), _Captain Marvel_ (2019). Also, two on schedule to be released this year will be starting new stories: _Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings_ (2021), _Eternals_ (2021). ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2021, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/70 "2021-06-22T00:32:01Z")
“Gods” in the Marvel continuity are basically really powerful aliens that are worshipped. If people worshipped Superman, he’d fit right in to the concept of a god in Marvel comics (that would be a weird Marvel/DC crossover though). They could even talk about Krypton like human legends spoke of Asgard and Olympus. And DC has flirted with the idea too. [![](https://d1466nnw0ex81e.cloudfront.net/n_iv/600/1098425.jpg) ](https://d1466nnw0ex81e.cloudfront.net/n_iv/600/1098425.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2021, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/71 "2021-06-22T00:50:12Z")
> [@Pleonast](#): > > _Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings_ That one I’m looking forward to seeing. Eternals? Not so much. Actually, this raises a question: why _haven’t_ they said Thor and the rest are gods? Why go with the alien idea? ---
**Author:** ![gdave](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gdave/32/3683_2.png) [@gdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gdave)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2021, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/72 "2021-06-22T00:51:59Z")
More than flirted. Kirby’s “New Gods” are literally just powerful aliens. Some of them aren’t even on Superman’s power level. The difference between Orion and Superman is pretty much that Orion thinks of himself as a New God, and Superman thinks of himself as a super-hero. And back at Marvel, Jack Kirby also created the very similar Eternals, who were just super-powered human offshoots who were mistaken for the Olympian gods (who they randomly just happen to strongly resemble and have very similar names to). And in Marvel, the Olympian gods actually exist, but the Eternals are about as powerful as they are. The difference between Athena the Olympian and Thena the Eternal is just down to the fact that one of them thinks of themselves as a god and the other doesn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2021, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/73 "2021-06-22T00:52:36Z")
If you were stingy with time and still wanted the greatest amount of context I’d say probably something like: 1. Iron Man 2. Captain America 3. Avengers 4. Winter Soldier 5. Guardians of the Galaxy 6. Age of Ultron 7. Civil War 8. Ragnarok 9. Black Panther 10. Infinity War 11. Endgame Not necessary to understand, but still good: both spiderman movies, Dr. Strange, Ant Man. The rest are wiki fodder or background watching. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2021, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/74 "2021-06-22T01:02:11Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > Actually, this raises a question: why _haven’t_ they said Thor and the rest are gods? Why go with the alien idea? WAG: particularly back in the '60s and '70s, most of Marvel’s writers were either Christian or Jewish, and they probably didn’t want to be writing comic books in which they postulated that the Asgardians (or the Eternals, or whoever) were actual deities. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2021, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/75 "2021-06-22T01:03:28Z")
Good thought. I wonder when the “alien” idea was introduced? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2021, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/76 "2021-06-22T01:14:54Z")
> [@gdave](#): > > More than flirted. Kirby’s “New Gods” are literally just powerful aliens. Some of them aren’t even on Superman’s power level. The difference between Orion and Superman is pretty much that Orion thinks of himself as a New God, and Superman thinks of himself as a super-hero. I meant “flirted with the idea of Superman as a god” but yes, Kirby definitely did the “superheroes as gods/gods as superheroes” thing both at Marvel and DC. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2021, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/77 "2021-06-22T01:15:51Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > Actually, this raises a question: why _haven’t_ they said Thor and the rest are gods? Why go with the alien idea? Good writers let the characters say what’s what. Asgardians call themselves gods. Tony Stark, Jane Foster, and other scientists in the MCU call them aliens (more properly, “extra-dimensional beings” - which is a good definition of the God of the Bible, as well) . If a viewer has an inclination to differentiate the two, Marvel/Disney is happy to let them make that decision for themselves without alienating the majority of their audience that self identifies as monotheistic. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2021, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/78 "2021-06-22T01:23:51Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > Good thought. I wonder when the “alien” idea was introduced? My WAG was that it originated with Thor, and Asgard first appeared in Marvel Comics in October 1962 in _Journey into Mystery_ #85. That’s when they show Asgard as being a futuristic city, more of a high-tech alien land than a spiritual realm. (Note that Thor himself was introduced 2 issues earlier, in August of that year.) Thor ended up dominating that series until they just renamed it _The Mighty Thor_. But I suspect that it was Thor that started the whole thing in the early 60s. ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2021, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/79 "2021-06-22T01:27:24Z")
Odin refers to himself as Allfather in _Thor_: > Thor Odinson… you have betrayed the express command of your king. Through your arrogance and stupidity, you’ve opened these peaceful realms and innocent lives to the horror and desolation of war! You are unworthy of these realms, you’re unworthy of your title, you’re unworthy… of the loved ones you have betrayed! I now take from you your power! In the name of my father and his father before, I, **Odin Allfather** , cast you out! ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2021, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634/80 "2021-06-22T01:30:40Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > WAG: particularly back in the '60s and '70s, most of Marvel’s writers were either Christian or Jewish, and they probably didn’t want to be writing comic books in which they postulated that the Asgardians (or the Eternals, or whoever) were actual deities. From the very beginning of the medium in the 1930s, comic book writers (overwhelmingly secular Jews) have never been squeamish about tapping pagan mythology for heroes, and they almost always presented them as actual deities. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-the-mcu-what-is-a-god/944634.md?page=5)