# In what ways are men discriminated against? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 8, 2012, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184 "2012-04-08T16:38:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/121 "2012-04-09T21:55:30Z")
> [@ladyfoxfyre](#): > > I thought this thread was about actual gender discrimination, instead of “things **Rig** is angry with pretty girls about.” Can you tell me how what I posted is anything other than discrimination? ---
**Author:** ![miss\_elizabeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/838e76/32.png) [@miss\_elizabeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/miss_elizabeth)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/122 "2012-04-09T21:59:10Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > Can you tell me how what I posted is anything other than discrimination? Hun, it isn’t that it isn’t discrimination, per se, it’s just that if this is the worst stuff you can come up with, you don’t really have a problem. Get it? ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/123 "2012-04-09T21:59:45Z")
> [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > My point is, there are very real ways in which men are discriminated against - what a shame that this thread is filled up with misogynist garbage instead of a discussion of those actual issues. That being said, page two and page three are a big improvement. This needs to be reposted again, because AMEN. > [@Rigamarole](#): > > And then there’s the fact that if a girl is attractive, she can pretty much have whatever she wants in life handed to her on a silver platter simply for being cute. That isn’t the case for even very attractive men (though it is still advantageous for men to be attractive, just not to the same degree). Oh, fucking bullshit. I’m sorry a pretty girl was mean to you at some point in your life, but the content of your above post is just utter nonsense. Allow me to offer the inverse of your ridiculousness: a pretty girl is NEVER taken seriously in the workplace, regardless of how intelligent she is or how hard of a worker she is. Why? Because knuckle-draggers like to hyuck hyuck, whisper, and snicker that she only got where she did by laying on her back. ---
**Author:** ![Belrix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ed655f/32.png) [@Belrix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belrix)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/124 "2012-04-09T22:17:39Z")
As a man, I wasn’t allowed to work in my church’s nursery unsupervised by a woman. You never know when a man might just snap and become a pedophile. We’re all, apparently, just inches away from it. A woman and a man are equally responsible for creating a baby yet a woman can abort that baby without the father’s permission. However, should she choose to carry the baby to term, he’s fully responsible for her decision and will be required to provide child support. A woman using false claims of abuse is seems common. A male friend of mine had it happen to him recently and only the fact that he recorded the conversation, where she frankly declared her intent to make this claim, kept him out of jail. A brother of close friends has his daughter removed from his home after a teacher’s claim in child abuse was raised. His daughter complained of a sore back in class. When asked why she said it was because her father was on top of her. This was a father-kid wrestling session, non-sexual, but the girl was removed and kept out of her family’s home for more than two years. The hoops the family had to jump through seemed to keep increasing since it seemed they had the ability to keep paying for these various classes and external evaluations. All men are closet pedophiles and abusers. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/125 "2012-04-09T23:01:57Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > …Generally, until very, very recently, medical research has been done mostly or ONLY on males. And on male medical students at that, which means, in the US, mostly WASP males… I had a great aunt who went to medical school in the 1930s who can attest to this. All the demonstation subjects were either volunteers from men in the class, or “volunteered” by the instructor (or were a corpse). The only exception were gynecology lectures, for obvious reasons, when a prostitute was hired. > [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > Some airlines have had (and some still have) [a policy that forbids seating unaccompanied children next to adult men.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airline_sex_discrimination_policy_controversy) I think we can all agree that’s a horribly misguided thing to do to men, and to the poor adult women who get stuck sitting next the unaccompanied children. > [@Rigamarole](#): > > Oh I thought of another one: cover charges to places. Often girls get in free but men have to pay… That isn’t the case for even very attractive men (though it is still advantageous for men to be attractive, just not to the same degree). Gay clubs tend to treat young twinks exactly the same way straight clubs treat women. > [@Belrix](#): > > …A woman and a man are equally responsible for creating a baby yet a woman can abort that baby without the father’s permission. However, should she choose to carry the baby to term, he’s fully responsible for her decision and will be required to provide child support… Well, of course a woman can about her pregnancy without consulting the father; it’s taking place inside her body. _Biology_ gives women a 2nd chance at deciding whether they want to be parents. As for child support; do you have a better idea? One that won’t result it either the child going without or the state picking up the tab? Or increase litigation in family courts that are already overworked & understaffed? Male sterilization is alot less risky and invasive than female sterilization, and judging from some of the threads we’ve had on this topic in the past men have a _slightly_ easier time finding someone to peform the procedure then women do. The only think men lack is a reversible contraceptive like the pill or implant, but againt that’s a function of biology and alot of money is being spent on research to correct that. ---
**Author:** ![Pixel\_Dent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bc8723/32.png) [@Pixel\_Dent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pixel_Dent)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/126 "2012-04-09T23:17:35Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I guess this would be an issue if, in fact, someone could provide evidence that it actually happens in the real world. > > Maternity leave in the USA is what, 5 weeks? Six? And the employer pays nothing, IIRC. My wife got 12 weeks paid maternity leave for each of our kids at two different employers. She was an engineer in one case and a technical project manager in the other. Both in the US. It was no vacation, of course and she stretched it to 5 months in one case by working half time from home. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/127 "2012-04-09T23:24:32Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > Oh I thought of another one: cover charges to places. Often girls get in free but men have to pay. > > And then there’s the fact that if a girl is attractive, she can pretty much have whatever she wants in life handed to her on a silver platter simply for being cute. That isn’t the case for even very attractive men (though it is still advantageous for men to be attractive, just not to the same degree). If men have to pay a cover charge, but women don’t, I guarantee that the place is going to be packed with grabby men who think that because they paid a cover charge, they get to paw the female patrons. And if a pretty girl is handed something for being cute, she’s usually expected to pay back in some way. Pretty girls might get a few material goods, but they are not taken seriously at all. Og help the woman who is extremely attractive AND ambitious in a non-glam field. Oh, sure, the men will enjoy her company, but when it comes time to mentor her, or be her teammate, they don’t want that. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/128 "2012-04-09T23:28:56Z")
Thing is, a pretty girl can make herself ugly easily. An ugly girl can’t make herself pretty. But what does this have to do with the topic? If it only applies to pretty girls, then it’s not an inequality towards males. ---
**Author:** ![Laudenum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7993a0/32.png) [@Laudenum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laudenum)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2012, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/129 "2012-04-09T23:30:06Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > I’ll be in my bunk. I LOLl’d ---
**Author:** ![Bemused](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/46a35a/32.png) [@Bemused](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bemused)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/130 "2012-04-10T02:56:15Z")
If the accuser is a woman and the accused is a man, and there is any hint of sex anyplace in the accusation, he is guilty as accused. See, for instance, the Duke 3. When it turns out that she lied in order to cause trouble for him, his reputation remains ruined while she walks free: “the poor thing…she must be troubled. We should be helping her.” See, once again, the Duke 3 and how Crystal Gayle Mangum was handled. Crystal’s in jail now, but only because she killed somebody. A guy, as it happens. ---
**Author:** ![blindboyard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blindboyard/32/2833_2.png) [@blindboyard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blindboyard)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 7:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/131 "2012-04-10T07:02:05Z")
> [@shiftless](#): > > Hardly a huge discrimination but this has been an issue in my government office. I see women wearing flip-flops, shorts and T-shirts all the time, even executives, but I had to try to explain to one of my male staff why he wasn’t allowed to wear sandels to work. Shorts are absolutely forbidden on men, not women. If a guy wore a tank top to work I would send him home to get dressed else I would end up in trouble from my boss. If a women wore a tank top I better not say anything else I might find myself in a sexual harrasment situation. A man working for the DWP in England, Matthew Thompson, found himself being made to wear a tie to work in hot weather while the women in the office wore whatever they liked, so he sued. Won, doesn’t have to wear a tie anymore. ---
**Author:** ![blindboyard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blindboyard/32/2833_2.png) [@blindboyard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blindboyard)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 7:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/132 "2012-04-10T07:13:43Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > - I don’t have a cite, but I once read that a \*lot \*less money is spent on male-related medical R&D (e.g. cures prostate cancer) verses female-related medical R&D (e.g. breast cancer). Eight times as much is spent on women, according to Yvette Cooper, the then-public health minister here in the UK. > [@](#): > > - I strongly suspect that, all else being equal, a woman has a better chance of getting a “warning” when pulled over by cop verses a man. Women get shorter sentence for the same crime, that’s certainly true. ---
**Author:** ![blindboyard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blindboyard/32/2833_2.png) [@blindboyard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blindboyard)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/133 "2012-04-10T07:14:52Z")
> [@miss\_elizabeth](#): > > Hun, it isn’t that it isn’t discrimination, per se, it’s just that if this is the worst stuff you can come up with, you don’t really have a problem. Get it? Let’s rephrase it then, men are more likely to be unemployed, and unmarried men make less money for the same work than unmarried women do, but are expected to pay for access to females and female affection, in cover charges, paying for meals, gifts, whatever else. ---
**Author:** ![Blackberry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecd19e/32.png) [@Blackberry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blackberry)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 9:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/134 "2012-04-10T09:10:07Z")
> [@Bemused](#): > > If the accuser is a woman and the accused is a man, and there is any hint of sex anyplace in the accusation, he is guilty as accused. Oh, so that must explain why women always report it when they’re sexually assaulted! ---
**Author:** ![phxjcc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8491ac/32.png) [@phxjcc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phxjcc)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/135 "2012-04-10T11:09:28Z")
The alimony issue is pure unadulterated sexual discrimination by the courts. You want “cites”, I got your cites right here… My brother works his butt off for 20 years, pays off the house, accumulates retirement savings, then he files for divorce due to her infidelity. She has not worked for 15 years, she brought exactly $2600 into the marriage, He had $50,000 equity in his house when they were married, $5000 in savings. What does she get? 50% of the house equity 50% of the retirement savings 40% of his salary, until he is 62 50% of his SSA benefits No kids. She is 51 y.o. working full time for a charity (uncompensated) at the time of divorce and claims she “cannot be retrained for the modern work environment”. So, all of you “alimony deny-ers” out there, please tell me how this is fair. This was ordered by the court, in CA–because “she has a right to maintain her lifestyle”. Really? Why? Who gave her this _ **RIGHT** _? Celebrity break-ups are full of this kind of crap. Elin was a bikini-model and au-pair prior to the marriage, she walks off with $110 million. Why? Why doesn’t she go back to her previous work? Oh, wait–that’s right, she was discriminated against and did not make as much as he did. Gibson’s wife walks off with $425 million. Tell me why. Come on, I want a feminist view of this. All feminists should be outraged that these poor frail little things don’t have the desire to stand on their own two feet and provide for themselves, so they are reduced to depending upon men for their support. I never hear this. Gloria S? Gloria A? Where are you? Silent, as usual. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/136 "2012-04-10T12:33:34Z")
A university I attended (back in the days of compulsory student unionism) had it set up so there were apparently almost no grants/funds from the student union available to white, heterosexual males (even if they were nominally open to “everyone”). There was actually quite a brouhaha about it at one point and the situation was finally changed, to their credit. ---
**Author:** ![blindboyard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blindboyard/32/2833_2.png) [@blindboyard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blindboyard)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/137 "2012-04-10T12:43:33Z")
Perhaps the worst aspect of this discrimination is so few caring about the discrimination. Feminists can dream up any bullshit “Gravity keeps women down” fake discrimination and get a media houpla. Look at [this](http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/articles/2010/12/01/20101201beautiful-women-job-woes.html), for example. That’s a study purporting to show that pretty women are less likely to get hired than ugly women, because women dominate recruitment and don’t want to hire pretty women. Also mentioned, that pretty men do better than ugly men for similar reasons. Not commented on is that fact that women were on average significantly more likely to be picked, and were more likely to be picked among those who didn’t sent photos with their CVs. Or the conclusion to [this](http://www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/female-teachers-accused-of-giving-boys-lower-marks-6943937.html) article that “It is fascinating research. It does stress the importance of independent marking for high-status examinations.”, rather than stressing the anti-male aspect of it. ---
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/138 "2012-04-10T12:46:17Z")
> [@phxjcc](#): > > The alimony issue is pure unadulterated sexual discrimination by the courts. > > You want “cites”, I got your cites right here… > > My brother works his butt off for 20 years, pays off the house, accumulates retirement savings, then he files for divorce due to her infidelity. > > **She has not worked for 15 years, she brought exactly $2600 into the marriage, He had $50,000 equity in his house when they were married, $5000 in savings.** Uh, nobody has said that alimony doesn’t exist. What we are saying is that it’s based on income disparity, not gender, which your anecdote demonstrates. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/139 "2012-04-10T13:23:59Z")
> [@miss\_elizabeth](#): > > Jeez, it’s a damn good thing I actually wasn’t trying to rile anyone up. Three little lines, and I’ve gone and hijacked the whole thing. Or maybe you’re a little too sensitive to criticism of your (dumb) complaints? Nah, it must be me. :rolleyes: You’re so adorable when you’re not bringing any actual content. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2012, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184/140 "2012-04-10T14:23:07Z")
> [@blindboyard](#): > > Perhaps the worst aspect of this discrimination is so few caring about the discrimination. Feminists can dream up any bullshit “Gravity keeps women down” fake discrimination and get a media houpla. > > Look at [this](http://www.azcentral.com/offbeat/articles/2010/12/01/20101201beautiful-women-job-woes.html), for example. That’s a study purporting to show that pretty women are less likely to get hired than ugly women, because women dominate recruitment and don’t want to hire pretty women. Also mentioned, that pretty men do better than ugly men for similar reasons. Not commented on is that fact that women were on average significantly more likely to be picked, and were more likely to be picked among those who didn’t sent photos with their CVs. > > Or the conclusion to [this](http://www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/female-teachers-accused-of-giving-boys-lower-marks-6943937.html) article that “It is fascinating research. It does stress the importance of independent marking for high-status examinations.”, rather than stressing the anti-male aspect of it. Yep. On a somewhat related point, it’s interesting as well that the word misandry is so obscure compared to misogyny (in fact, my browser thinks misandry is a typo), when both seem quite common to me. To add my own anecdote to the OP; while I was at uni I tried for a while to get secretarial work (temping). I went to an agency and they gave me test after test and kept asking me in dozens of different ways why I wanted that kind of work, and I could tell they didn’t quite know what to do. I think they boxed themselves in by implying an interview would be arranged if I could pass the typing tests (and they had assumed I would fail). And typically waiter and barista jobs are much harder for men to get, but of course the discrimination goes further than this (they are quite hard jobs to get if you’re over 30 as well). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-what-ways-are-men-discriminated-against/618184.md?page=8)