# In which I pit aspects of the African American culture of today **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 30, 2005, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854 "2005-03-30T00:14:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Greathouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greathouse/32/2992_2.png) [@Greathouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Greathouse)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/21 "2005-03-30T15:39:43Z")
**brickbacon** , why are you so angry? Must be all that rap music. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/22 "2005-03-30T16:09:39Z")
Oh great, brickbacon has shown up to show us the “real reasons things are the way they are”: It’s because black people are black, and all of us evil white people are keeping them down. No, don’t argue or expect cites, that’s just how it _is_, and if you don’t just roll over and admit it, you’re a fool or a tool. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/23 "2005-03-30T16:20:24Z")
> [@Weirddave](#): > > Oh great, brickbacon has shown up to show us the “real reasons things are the way they are”: It’s because black people are black, and all of us evil white people are keeping them down. No, don’t argue or expect cites, that’s just how it _is_, and if you don’t just roll over and admit it, you’re a fool or a tool. :rolleyes: Yup, that’s it! Damn I love having that kind of power! What a rush to know I can crush total strangers, at will, and don’t even need a reason. ROFL. It isn’t that way people, those of us of the “caucasian persuasion” don’t keep anyone down, we don’t want to, we don’t have the power or the know-how, we have enough problems running our own lives. Only the crazies in the funny uniforms and the stupid titles want to do that, and we whites have just as much contempt for them as any black person does. ---
**Author:** ![threemae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f9b8f/32.png) [@threemae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/threemae)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/24 "2005-03-30T17:03:47Z")
> [@brickbacon](#): > > If don’t realize that every Black journalist has suffered because of Jayson Blair and that every young Black kid suffers because of things [insert rapper] has done, then there is no point in having this discussion. Ah, yes, the much loved and respected, “If you don’t agree with my point already, you’re too stupid to possibly comprehend it,” style of debate. ---
**Author:** ![Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/25 "2005-03-30T18:44:07Z")
Has any Black journalist suffered because of Jayson Blair? ---
**Author:** ![threemae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f9b8f/32.png) [@threemae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/threemae)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/26 "2005-03-30T18:55:10Z")
> [@Bippy the Beardless](#): > > Has any Black journalist suffered because of Jayson Blair? Including Jayson Blair. Does he still have that book deal? If so, here’s my new life plan: 1. Get a job at NY Times 2. Pull Stories out of my ass 3. Get caught and fired from the Times 4. Profit!!! ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/27 "2005-03-30T19:05:24Z")
There was just a thread in IMHO where many, many, many dopers said they would be uncomfortable living in a predominately black neighborhood (of course, some people said they’d be fine with it). Do you really believe that this is the sign on a healthy society that has eliminated racism? ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/28 "2005-03-30T19:22:31Z")
> [@](#): > > Then there are things like how asians who came to the country with money and education are compared to blacks, and people ask why blacks don’t act like them. Nice. Ah… :dubious: > [@](#): > > If don’t realize that every Black journalist has suffered because of Jayson Blair Really? Jason Blair was black? ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/29 "2005-03-30T19:27:29Z")
> [@brickbacon](#): > > If don’t realize that every Black journalist has suffered because of Jayson Blair He’s black? ---
**Author:** ![kingpengvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9dc877/32.png) [@kingpengvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kingpengvin)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/30 "2005-03-30T19:36:11Z")
Regarding the OP. I think the biggest problem with teens (and probably always has been) is this desire to obtain “coolness” Funny thing is everything we once thought of as cool turns out to be idiotic in the light of maturity. I remember Big hair, parachute pants, painters caps and Grown men in Spandex and mascara was seen as cool by some. Yeesh. For some reason a majority of youth has always embraced idiocy as something to aspire to. In my opinion it’s most likely because most youths are in fact still having trouble sliding from the freedom of childhood into the more responsible adult world. Possibly, to fight the overwhelming stress, they turn to stupid behaviour kind of like a way to stay a child. If you really think about it the word cool should be substituted with the word idiotic. Watch it’s easy. “Hey you know what would be (idiotic)?” “What?” “Tie your belt to my bumper get on your skate board and I’ll tow you down the street” “Man, that is the (Stupidest) idea ever” OR “Look I just spent 350 bucks on a pair of sneakers that have wings and flashing lights on the side. I have to make sure they don’t get wet or touch pavement. They are so (idiotic)” ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/31 "2005-03-30T19:36:13Z")
Yeah, I thought that all journalists caught heat because it was revealed that the NY Times had a duplicitous scamming ‘journalist’ on staff who hadn’t been exposed for years. I was unaware that all the white journalists were exempt from fact checking. But hey, who am I to ask for a cite? ---
**Author:** ![threemae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f9b8f/32.png) [@threemae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/threemae)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/32 "2005-03-30T20:01:04Z")
[http://www.editorsweblog.org/040308\_BurningDownMyMasters.jpg](http://www.editorsweblog.org/040308_BurningDownMyMasters.jpg) [http://www.smh.com.au/ffxImage/urlpicture\_id\_1052591733831\_2003/05/12/wld\_blair\_jayson.jpg](http://www.smh.com.au/ffxImage/urlpicture_id_1052591733831_2003/05/12/wld_blair_jayson.jpg) Indeed, it appears so. Also, here’s Blair’s new book. I haven’t read it, but I’m somewhat suprised by the title. I thought that Blair had acted somewhat reticent and apologetic in the wake of his “uncovering,” but perhaps not. ---
**Author:** ![threemae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f9b8f/32.png) [@threemae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/threemae)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/33 "2005-03-30T20:03:43Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > Yeah, I thought that all journalists caught heat because it was revealed that the NY Times had a duplicitous scamming ‘journalist’ on staff who hadn’t been exposed for years. I was unaware that all the white journalists were exempt from fact checking. But hey, who am I to ask for a cite? Yeah, didn’t they end up finding out that one of their travel writers was making up/phoning stuff in, and didn’t they throw his lazy ass out on the curb as well? I mean really, for Christsakes, you’re getting paid to travel on an expense account by the NY Times and write about the lovely times you had in some lovely local. Nobody’s telling you to review the Baghdad Hilton. And yet you still decide this is just too hard and make up travel stories? _Travel stories, people, travel!_ ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/34 "2005-03-30T20:19:41Z")
Or how about [Rick Bragg](http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A51506-2003May28?language=printer)? Obviously the picture they put up of him is in error, as friend **Brickbacon** assures us that there was some sort of witchhunt against black journalists. Certainly the washington post will retract that picture and put up a picture of a black man. Right? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/35 "2005-03-30T20:27:55Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > So in other words, no cite? OK. I see you want to act like an asshole, and ask my to post a bunch of sites detailing what should be painfully obvious to anyone who doesn’t live under a rock. [Here](http://www.maynardije.org/news/features/030521_blair/) is the first site dealing with Jayson Blair. Allow me to highlight the relevant parts. > [@](#): > > \*“Enemies of newsroom diversity now see Blair as exhibit A in their argument that diversity programs promote double standards. They are wrong. But that doesn’t mean the implementation of such programs can’t be critiqued. And diversity pressure is only a thread in a story with many ragged edges,” says a Columbia Journalism Review online commentary, “Trouble at The Times.” \* [and] > [@](#): > > \*Diversity initiatives, never popular in white America, are viewed as “mechanisms to avoid discrimination lawsuits,” says Diversity Inc., an online magazine. And now, says the publication, because of Blair, a “diversity poster child for dishonesty, journalistic fakery and tokenism,” The Times **“has damaged the credibility of diversity initiatives and insulted all the qualified journalists of color who have loved a chance to work there.”** \* [and] > [@](#): > > \*On ABC-TV’s “Nightline,” May 15, anchor Chris Bury asked National Association of Black Journalists president Condace Pressley, “Do you worry that, fairly or unfairly, this whole episode may stigmatize African American journalists?” > > Pressley ignored the bizarre “fairly or unfairly” phrase and said yes she did. “There are some 300-plus members of my organization who are under 30 and upholding the tenets of journalism very well every day. And I know that they are just terrified that their editors are going to look at them in a different way because of this incident.” \* [and] > [@](#): > > \*Now, outside the newsroom, Blair’s blackness is the only thing that matters. Scott Simon, anchor of National Public Radio’s Weekend Edition, spoke May 17 of journalistic fabricators. He mentioned Stephen Glass whose prevarications at the New Republic magazine led to his dismissal there. Glass, subsequently fired, is now promoting his roman a clef about his misdeeds on, among other places, CBS’s “60 Minutes.” Simon ended his comments about journalistic fakers by saying Glass “wasn’t an affirmative action hire.” He didn’t explain how he knew. > > Actually, everybody knows. That’s the tag that’s hung on practically all blacks hired these days by journalistic enterprises. And by equating Blair with affirmative action, and diversity, it becomes possible for the “anti” crowd to chop down two undesirables – blacks and diversity – with one swing of an axe. > > It’s not the same when a white journalist fabricates. The Boston Globe columnist, Mike Barnicle; fired, apparently reluctantly, by the Globe. Now he’s on television and writing for the New York Daily News. Michael Daly, fired by the same Daily News, now back there writing a column. No weeping and wailing by white journalists about their future in the news business; Ruth Shalit, fired for fakery by the New Republic. No questions about whether, fairly or unfairly, the various episodes would stigmatize white journalists. No “terrified” young journalists. These white journalists are simply “bad apples.”\* That should elaborate on the point I made. If that’s not enough for you, you can reference [these](http://www.alternet.org/story/15870) [cites](http://www.jsonline.com/news/metro/may03/142420.asp) [as](http://www.usatoday.com/usatonline/20030514/5155431s.htm) [well](http://www.nationalreview.com/clegg/clegg051903.asp). [If](http://www.nyage.net/from_50_cents.HTM) [you](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3677687/) [want](http://www.crimelibrary.com/classics4/oj/) [more](http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-welfareblack.htm) [examples](http://racerelations.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?site=http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp%2Ddyn/articles/A59055%2D2004May26.html), [please](http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/billcosbypoundcakespeech.htm) [look](http://www.lsadc.org/faq/index.php?aaa=ebonics.htm) [at these](http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=12052) cites. I’m still working on cites stating the Earth is round. Don’t worry, I’ll get around to it. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/36 "2005-03-30T20:30:15Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > He’s black? Bingo. I didn’t know either. > [@Nightime](#): > > Then there are things like how asians who came to the country with money and education are compared to blacks, and people ask why blacks don’t act like them. Nice. > [@smiling bandit](#): > > Ah…:dubious: Count me :dubious: too. Do all Asians come to the country with money and education? ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/37 "2005-03-30T20:35:39Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > Or how about [Rick Bragg](http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A51506-2003May28?language=printer)? > > Obviously the picture they put up of him is in error, as friend **Brickbacon** assures us that there was some sort of witchhunt against black journalists. Certainly the washington post will retract that picture and put up a picture of a black man. Right? :dubious: Did I say witch hunt? I said that whenever a black person screws up, all of us have to suffer. Clearly, Jayson Blair’s dishonesty will hurt other Black journalists. Even the fact that his behavior is used as an excuse to critique diversity goals, affirmative action, etc. is proof that his behavior will affect all black people. I don’t remember people saying Stephan Glass’ plagiarism would hurt white journalists. Please read a more about the situation before you make assumptions. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/38 "2005-03-30T20:42:35Z")
> [@EvilHamsterOnCrack](#): > > These same friends are made fun of as “acting white” because they actually have good manners, speak normally, dress normally, actually work in school, and don’t try to act like idiots. I think “normal” might be something of a loaded word to use. A hippie like you 😉 shouldn’t be expecting people to conform to any particular style of dress or speech. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/39 "2005-03-30T21:04:01Z")
> [@brickbacon](#): > > OK. I see you want to act like an asshole, and ask my to post a bunch of sites detailing what should be painfully obvious to anyone who doesn’t live under a rock. Ah, I see. You’re an asshole who acts like a fucking primadonna when asked to provide proof. For your first two quotes it says nothing about black journalists, but diversity programs. Second, just who are these “enemies of newsroom diversity.” Surely as a piece of journalism they can name names and provide factual confirmation, right? As should be obvious, there’s a huge difference between not wanting to have programs which hire people specifically because of the color of their skin, and not wanting to hire people who happen to have a certain skin color. It should also be obvious that if less qualified candidates are brought in to fill diversity quotas, and some of those candidates turn out to be liars, then yes, people might just rethink non-merit based programs. Your third quote deals with asking a woman to have powers of precognition. Who cares if she thinks it’ll have certain effects, especially if you can’t provide any cites to prove her claims and psychic powers. Fourth, you point to young black journalists fearing that they’ll be stigmatized as proof that they are. This is half assed at best. You got any proof that there’s actual discrimination? And no, I’m not going to read through all your cites judging from the fact that your main cite in this post is ridiculous in the extreme. Prove that as a result of Blair’s actions black journalists are discriminated against. > [@brickbacon](#): > > I’m still working on cites stating the Earth is round. Don’t worry, I’ll get around to it. Awwwww. Does a request to prove your assumptions somehow fall outside the bounds? Are your ideas gospel? Mmm hmmmmm. > [@brickbacon](#): > > Did I say witch hunt? I said that whenever a black person screws up, all of us have to suffer. For which you’ve provided **no** proof. You’ve shown that someone hired based on afirmative action has made people question afirmative action. This is a long way from proving that black journalists are disrciminated against. > [@brickbacon](#): > > Clearly, Jayson Blair’s dishonesty will hurt other Black journalists. Clearly :dubious: Your powers of precognition are also in dispute, I’m afraid. Got any proof to back up your claims? > [@brickbacon](#): > > Even the fact that his behavior is used as an excuse to critique diversity goals, affirmative action, etc. is proof that his behavior will affect all black people. Are you an idealogue? It’s proof that someone hired through that program tarnished the image of that program. Nothing more. > [@brickbacon](#): > > I don’t remember people saying Stephan Glass’ plagiarism would hurt white journalists. And I don’t remember people saying that Blair will hurt black journalists **and then proving it**. > [@brickbacon](#): > > Please read a more about the situation before you make assumptions. Please prove your assumptions before you make them. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2005, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854/40 "2005-03-30T21:14:37Z")
[“Blair, who is African-American, was hired at the Times under a program designed, in part, to attract more racial diversity to the newspaper, leading critics to question whether editors had overlooked his faulty work to protect a black reporter on a fast track to success. Boyd denied that charge but Raines admitted in a staff meeting it was possible Blair’s race had a minor influence on how he was treated.”](http://www2.cnn.com/2003/US/Northeast/06/05/nytimes.resigns/) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-i-pit-aspects-of-the-african-american-culture-of-today/296854.md?page=3)