# In Which Society Would You Prefer to Live In **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 13, 2010, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947 "2010-10-13T02:13:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/1 "2010-10-13T02:13:55Z")
Simple question. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/2 "2010-10-13T02:17:22Z")
In a society without grammatical redundancies. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/3 "2010-10-13T02:20:08Z")
Both of those choices look like contradictions in terms to me. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/4 "2010-10-13T02:25:56Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Both of those choices look like contradictions in terms to me. Oligarchic Democracy: Theoretically everyone’s equal and everyone has rights roughly equivalent to that of a new democracy but virtually everyone in power is the top 1,000 families or something like that. Meritocratic Dictatorship: Not an insane dictatorship but a “rational” one based on efficiency and utilitarianism. Criticism of government is allowed and everyone is treated equally regardless of birth or wealth. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/5 "2010-10-13T02:26:36Z")
No “huh?” option? I abstain, then. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/6 "2010-10-13T02:30:21Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > Both of those choices look like contradictions in terms to me. > > Oligarchic Democracy: Theoretically everyone’s equal and everyone has rights roughly equivalent to that of a new democracy but virtually everyone in power is the top 1,000 families or something like that. > > Meritocratic Dictatorship: Not an insane dictatorship but a “rational” one based on efficiency and utilitarianism. Criticism of government is allowed and everyone is treated equally regardless of birth or wealth. I know what they mean. They are still contradictions in terms. An oligarchy can’t be a true democracy and a dictatorship can’t be a true meitocracy. ---
**Author:** ![Rhiannon8404](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rhiannon8404/32/17929_2.png) [@Rhiannon8404](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhiannon8404)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/7 "2010-10-13T02:39:52Z")
Is the second one the same thing as a benevolent dictatorship? ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/8 "2010-10-13T03:31:16Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > In a society without grammatical redundancies. Heh. I thought the thread title was a palindrome at first. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/9 "2010-10-13T04:08:44Z")
Given the two real-life examples cited, I think A is preferable. I actually live in a country that’s pretty much A. I don’t think I would like B at all. If these two are examples, then A offers far more personal freedom. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/10 "2010-10-13T04:09:07Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > > > Oligarchic Democracy: Theoretically everyone’s equal and everyone has rights roughly equivalent to that of a new democracy but virtually everyone in power is the top 1,000 families or something like that. > > > > Meritocratic Dictatorship: Not an insane dictatorship but a “rational” one based on efficiency and utilitarianism. Criticism of government is allowed and everyone is treated equally regardless of birth or wealth. > > I know what they mean. They are still contradictions in terms. An oligarchy can’t be a true democracy and a dictatorship can’t be a true meitocracy. For the former adding “pseudo-” to "democracy is all that’s needed; there’s plenty of fake democracies with rigged or outright faked elections, after all. As for the other, I don’t think that “meritocratic dictatorship” is actually a “contradiction in terms”, but only in practice. In theory one could have some enlightened absolute ruler who would promote according to merit even to the point of stepping aside if a more worthy leader was found; but in reality that’s not what you get. It’s one of those theoretical governments that would work just fine if you could just find morally flawless superhumans to staff it. As for the real world versions, it depends. Neither corrupt “democracies” nor dictatorships are all created equal. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/11 "2010-10-13T04:11:36Z")
Banana Republicans? Allow me to be the first to say… Band name! ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/12 "2010-10-13T04:47:47Z")
Whichever offered me the most personal freedom and voice in the government. ---
**Author:** ![Gestalt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/90ced4/32.png) [@Gestalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gestalt)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/13 "2010-10-13T05:59:54Z")
In this ever-changing world in which we live in, I’d much prefer a benevolent constitutional monarchy. Sometimes I wished we had that United States. Cuz people besides me is dumb. Actually, I think Fahreed Zakaria makes a really good case for the limitations of democracy in _The Future of Freedom_ ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/14 "2010-10-13T06:43:15Z")
Ah, but a Banana Republic isn’t just an oligarchic democracy. It’s one where one or more corporations (in the original banana republics, Chiquita Banana), which isn’t/aren’t even owned by local oligarchs, tells the government what to do. Which actually sounds a lot like every so-called democracy in the world; some simply happen to be more discreet than others. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2010, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/15 "2010-10-14T03:30:10Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > Ah, but a Banana Republic isn’t just an oligarchic democracy. It’s one where one or more corporations (in the original banana republics, Chiquita Banana), which isn’t/aren’t even owned by local oligarchs, tells the government what to do. Ah yes, the [United Fruit Company](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Fruit_Company). ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2010, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/16 "2010-10-14T03:41:37Z")
It sounds like in the dictatorship, at least I’d have a better chance of clawing my way to the top, by clubbing the right heads or doing well in The Party. The Oligarchy sounds like they’d want to keep their power “in the family,” no matter what. Maybe the question really comes down to guillotining. Do I want the chance to run the guillotine when the government _collapses_, or run the guillotine on _behalf_ of the government, in hopes of rising up the ranks to become dictator myself? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![athelas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5e9695/32.png) [@athelas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/athelas)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2010, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/17 "2010-10-14T04:03:56Z")
Meritocratic dictatorship. I don’t care about the cultural trappings of equal opportunity, I want the fact of it. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2010, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/18 "2010-10-14T05:30:05Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > a dictatorship can’t be a true meitocracy. Why not? A dictator has to have a government and there’s nothing saying he can assign people to jobs in his government based on their abilities. ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2010, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/19 "2010-10-14T19:31:25Z")
I don’t know how to answer this. In a way, both choices are dictatorships. ---
**Author:** ![Lobsang](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobsang/32/4067_2.png) [@Lobsang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobsang)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2010, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947/20 "2010-10-14T20:35:04Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > In a society without grammatical redundancies. I opened this thread to point out same. “In which society would you prefer to live?” “Which society would you prefer to live in?” [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-which-society-would-you-prefer-to-live-in/556947.md?page=2)