# In WWII, were U.S. enlisted men issued pistols? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 10, 2009, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246 "2009-02-10T17:54:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Throatwarbler\_Mangrove](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8c91f0/32.png) [@Throatwarbler\_Mangrove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Throatwarbler_Mangrove)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/21 "2009-02-11T03:51:30Z")
I think the general consensus here is that you were issued what you needed to do the job, and for the front line infantryman, you don’t have much use for a pistol. Of course, most soldiers are not front line infantrymen. I think these days pistols are experiencing a bit of a comeback. Some activities for which pistols are better than rifles, such as searching cars at a checkpoint, are taking up more of a soldiers time than they perhaps did on the WW2 battlefield. Hell, for putting holes in people, a pistol is more useful than a bayonet, and doesn’t weigh a whole lot more. However, the modern maxim is that a pistol is what you use to fight your way to a rifle. ---
**Author:** ![Spiny\_Norman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9de0a6/32.png) [@Spiny\_Norman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiny_Norman)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/22 "2009-02-11T04:31:55Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Don’t officers generally carry the same weapons as their men these days? I suspect it’s the current trend, if for nothing else then to avoid sticking out in a sniper’s scope. Still, I expect that there’s not that many slung rifles to be seen at brigade HQ - as I’m sure you’ve experienced, command vehicles are cramped enough as it is. Back when I wore green, Company CO and Exec were issued pistols. The exec - that being the sort of soldier he was - always somehow managed to commandeer a rifle or submachinegun. On topic, from WWII, I do know of a few examples of officers up-gunning in dire situations: There is a famous photo of Gen. Joe Stilwell in his CP during the Burma defense - with his Garand, complete with bayonet, in the background. If a general is steeling himself (sorry) for personally taking part in defending the CP, it’s pretty much a given that things are not going according to plan. Another example is that of Brig. T. Roosevelt Jr., who pleaded with his superiors and got permission to land with the first wave on Utah beach. According to one record (going from memory, so no cite, sorry) he’d managed to procure himself a rifle, but no ammunition. (Perhaps understandably, once the troops were in the landing craft and felt the reality of the situation, they did not feel inclined to share their ammunition. Apparently he ended up ordering 8 separate men to give up one round each, so he could at least get a full clip.) ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/23 "2009-02-11T05:03:31Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > …The higher your rank, the less business you have packing anything bigger than a pen. I suppose a hand grenade would be out of the question for Gen. Matthew “Old Iron Tits” Ridgeway, then? [http://images.google.com/hosted/life/l?imgurl=1189bbe5e0b995b2&q=ridgway%20korea%20grenades&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dridgway%2Bkorea%2Bgrenades%26gbv%3D2%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG](http://images.google.com/hosted/life/l?imgurl=1189bbe5e0b995b2&q=ridgway%20korea%20grenades&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dridgway%2Bkorea%2Bgrenades%26gbv%3D2%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG) ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/24 "2009-02-11T05:06:21Z")
I thought officers in WWII were issued rifles, carbines, or sub machine guns. Was that not the case? ---
**Author:** ![cornflakes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9d8465/32.png) [@cornflakes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cornflakes)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/25 "2009-02-11T05:27:27Z")
> [@Spiny\_Norman](#): > > Another example is that of Brig. T. Roosevelt Jr., who pleaded with his superiors and got permission to land with the first wave on Utah beach. According to one record (going from memory, so no cite, sorry) he’d managed to procure himself a rifle, but no ammunition. (Perhaps understandably, once the troops were in the landing craft and felt the reality of the situation, they did not feel inclined to share their ammunition. Apparently he ended up ordering 8 separate men to give up one round each, so he could at least get a full clip.) This was recorded in [The Longest Day.](http://www.amazon.com/Longest-Day-Classic-Epic-D-Day/dp/B0002OUQSK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1234329854&sr=1-1) I’m probably wrong, but I thought that it was another officer. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 9:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/26 "2009-02-11T09:44:27Z")
> [@dinoboy](#): > > As interesting and impressive as all of these stories were, none were relating to WWII enlisted… > > They do show that, as stated above in various posts, the pistol is pretty much used only when original plans have gone poorly. Sure a pistol can be useful compared to nothing but nobody wants to get stuck in a firefight with a pistol if everyone else has assault rifles 🙂 Of course they weren’t from WWII but like all threads there has been a certain ammount of thread drift. From post two: > [@](#): > > a pistol is unnecessary weight that could be better spent on more ammo. This and other statements I was refuting. A pistol is of course not going to be your primary weapon in a firefight unless something bad has happened. It is a very useful tool. Most soldiers now would prefer to have one as their secondary weapon and the army for the most part issues two weapons to combat troops. I don’t see it being any different in WWII. I have read many accounts of those who were not issued them did not think they were useless weight. I gave accounts to prove that the statements about how unnecessary a pistol is are false. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 9:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/27 "2009-02-11T09:55:05Z")
> [@Spiny\_Norman](#): > > Another example is that of Brig. T. Roosevelt Jr., who pleaded with his superiors and got permission to land with the first wave on Utah beach. According to one record (going from memory, so no cite, sorry) he’d managed to procure himself a rifle, but no ammunition. He had the pull to get permission to land with the first wave, but didn’t have the pull to get a rifle and a few rounds? A brigadier? I know nothing about this stuff but I have trouble understanding this. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 10:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/28 "2009-02-11T10:13:43Z")
> [@cornflakes](#): > > This was recorded in [The Longest Day.](http://www.amazon.com/Longest-Day-Classic-Epic-D-Day/dp/B0002OUQSK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1234329854&sr=1-1) I’m probably wrong, but I thought that it was another officer. According to Wiki he did not have a rifle. > [@](#): > > Roosevelt would be the only general on D-Day to land with the first wave of troops. He was the first soldier off his landing craft as he led the U.S. 4th Infantry Division’s 8th Infantry Regiment and 70th Tank Battalion landing at Utah Beach. Roosevelt was soon informed that the landing craft had drifted more than a mile south of their objective, and the first wave was a mile off course. Walking with the aid of a cane and carrying a pistol, he personally made a reconnaissance of the area immediately to the rear of the beach to locate the causeways that were to be used for the advance inland. He then returned to the point of landing and contacted the commanders of the two battalions, Lt. Cols. Conrad C. Simmons and Carlton O. MacNeely, and coordinated the attack on the enemy positions confronting them. Roosevelt’s famous words in these circumstances were, “We’ll start the war from right here!” These impromptu plans worked with complete success and little confusion. With artillery landing close by, each follow-on regiment was personally welcomed on the beach by a cool, calm, and collected Roosevelt, who inspired all with humor and confidence, reciting poetry and telling anecdotes of his father to steady the nerves of his men. Ted pointed almost every regiment to its changed objective. Sometimes he worked under fire as a self-appointed traffic cop, untangling traffic jams of trucks and tanks all struggling to get inland and off the beach. It makes sense. He had to use a cane because of arthritis. Hard to use a rifle and a cane. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/29 "2009-02-11T10:41:47Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > In the British Army only officers were issued pistols and I’m pretty sure things haven’t changed since the 60s when I served. Exceptions were Military Police and some guard duties. NCOs were issued pistols during WWI and WWII (when they were available), and I know that Machine-gun crews were generally issued a handgun, along with aircrew and armoured brigade units. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/30 "2009-02-11T11:17:42Z")
Just to hijack a bit. Not many people know about Teddy Roosevelt Jr. He was of course the son of the president. Although he was born into a wealthy family and very successful in private life he volunteered for service in WWI. He distinguished himself and was awarded the Distinguished Service Cross. He was also wounded and gassed which caused problems for the rest of his life. During WWII despite his poor health he served in North Africa and Sicily before successfully campaigning to have a combat command in the invasion. As the Assistant Division Commander of the 4th Infantry Division he went in on the first wave. When he found out that the force landed far from where they had planned he decided to go ahead and attack instead of trying for their intended target. “We’ll start the war from right here!” He improvised the battle plans from that spot and lead the troops off the beach, often exposing himself to enemy fire with little regard for his own safety. He did this with arthritis, a heart condition and walking with a cane. He died of a heart attack a month later and was awarded his Medal of Honor posthumously. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/31 "2009-02-11T11:26:27Z")
> [@Spiny\_Norman](#): > > I suspect it’s the current trend, if for nothing else then to avoid sticking out in a sniper’s scope. Still, I expect that there’s not that many slung rifles to be seen at brigade HQ - as I’m sure you’ve experienced, command vehicles are cramped enough as it is. I guess it depends on the military in question. I’ve been inside plenty of HQs, and they’ve all been armed with rifles or carbines. Even my FiL - a 58-year-old reserve Lt. Colonel serving on the staff of an armored division - was issued an M-16 when he first showed up for reserve duty (he later traded it in for a Gallil SAR). He has no intention of seeing direct combat, but if his base comes under attack (and such things happen in war), he’s expected to take part in its defense. You can’t be too highly ranked to get away with being in the field without a real weapon. Take IDF Chief of Staff, Lt. General [Ashkenazi](http://www.hnn.co.il/images/albums/2227_35010.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![Mk\_VII](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Mk\_VII](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mk_VII)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 12:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/32 "2009-02-11T12:04:25Z")
in WW1 there were plans (never implemented) to issue every GI in France with a pistol (surely unnecessary). By 1942 issue was made only to officers and those whose jobs made it difficult to carry a rifle but still needed something. Plenty of others managed to acquire them by various means. The carbine superseded the pistol to a great extent as the war went on. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/33 "2009-02-11T12:55:41Z")
To answer the OP, yes. Some enlisted men were issued pistols. The US never had an “officers only” policy on pistols. ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/34 "2009-02-11T13:24:38Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > Of course they weren’t from WWII but like all threads there has been a certain ammount of thread drift. > > From post two: > This and other statements I was refuting. A pistol is of course not going to be your primary weapon in a firefight unless something bad has happened. It is a very useful tool. Most soldiers now would prefer to have one as their secondary weapon and the army for the most part issues two weapons to combat troops. I don’t see it being any different in WWII. I have read many accounts of those who were not issued them did not think they were useless weight. I gave accounts to prove that the statements about how unnecessary a pistol is are false. Well of course there’s always going to be exceptional situations in which a backup weapon is necessary. But my statement still stands. I’ve heard from more than one soldier (my great uncle and my uncle respectively) that it would be better to have 3-4 more clips for your primary weapon than a pistol. A pistol uses up space and weight that could be better utilized on other items. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/35 "2009-02-11T13:48:10Z")
> [@Hypno-Toad](#): > > Well of course there’s always going to be exceptional situations in which a backup weapon is necessary. But my statement still stands. I’ve heard from more than one soldier (my great uncle and my uncle respectively) that it would be better to have 3-4 more clips for your primary weapon than a pistol. A pistol uses up space and weight that could be better utilized on other items. If your statement stands on the basis of a couple of anecdotes how is it better than mine? I have several hundred soldiers within walking distance, do you want me to take a poll? The inconsequential weight of a pistol will not keep you from carrying a few extra magazines. It is not either or. You ever train in combat firearm techniques? It is a lot quicker to drop your arm down and draw your already loaded pistol than it is to either clear a jam or find another magazine and reload. It is a common drill that I have done many many times. Trainers in modern warfare understand this. It wasn’t drilled that way in WWII but many of the soldiers understood the need and would beg borrow or steal to get a pistol. Many of them were issued but more wanted them. ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/36 "2009-02-11T13:53:48Z")
I guess we disagree then. ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/37 "2009-02-11T14:00:28Z")
> [@Spiny\_Norman](#): > > One way to tell that the sh.t is really about to hit the fan is officers picking up long guns. In _Once Were Soldiers_, Sam Elliot’s response to Mel Gibson’s request for him to get a M-16 as a attack was on the way > [@](#): > > Sir, if the time comes I need one, there’ll be plenty lying on the ground. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/38 "2009-02-11T15:00:36Z")
> [@yojimbo](#): > > In _Once Were Soldiers_, Sam Elliot’s response to Mel Gibson’s request for him to get a M-16 as a attack was on the way Interesting. I wasn’t aware that Gibson or Elliot served in Vietnam. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Mk\_VII](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Mk\_VII](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mk_VII)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/39 "2009-02-11T15:04:21Z")
The same sentiment was expressed in Colonel Anthony Herbert’s _Soldier_. (might have been where they got it from) ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2009, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246/40 "2009-02-11T15:11:43Z")
> [@Mk\_VII](#): > > The same sentiment was expressed in Colonel Anthony Herbert’s _Soldier_. (might have been where they got it from) Nope. Sergeant Major Basil Plumley was a real guy. They portrayed him exactly as he was shown in the nonfiction book. I think it was a direct quote from him. He was a tough SOB. Four combat jumps in WWII. One combat jump in Korea. Two Silver Stars, two Bronze Stars and four Purple Hearts. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/in-wwii-were-u-s-enlisted-men-issued-pistols/485246.md?page=3)