# Independence Day Special: Thirteen Facts About America Conservatives Would Like You to Forget, etc.
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/independence-day-special-thirteen-facts-about-america-conservatives-would-like-you-to-forget-etc/724453
**Category:** In My Humble Opinion
**Created:** [July 7, 2015, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/independence-day-special-thirteen-facts-about-america-conservatives-would-like-you-to-forget-etc/724453 "2015-07-07T06:40:07Z")
**Posts on this page:** 6
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Jim\_B](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_B)
#### Post date: [July 7, 2015, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/independence-day-special-thirteen-facts-about-america-conservatives-would-like-you-to-forget-etc/724453/1 "2015-07-07T06:40:07Z")
I know I usu. am not very controversial on these boards–or partisan. But I felt I just had to share this: [Independence Day Special: Thirteen Facts About America Conservatives Would Like You to Forget](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/07/04/1311570/-Independence-Day-Special-A-Dozen-Facts-About-America-Conservatives-Would-Like-You-to-Forget).
And as long as I am at it, why not: [If Our Founding Fathers Were All Christians, Why Did They Say This](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/03/18/1285607/-If-Our-Founding-Fathers-Were-All-Christians-Why-Did-They-Say-This)?
Realize, I am not trying to make people angry. On the contrary, I think some conservatives will find these enlightening too.
Please post your feelings on what I shared. But keep it cordial:).
:):)🙂
P.S. And on the off chance someone already posted this (it actually does sound a little familiar–even to me), I think it really bears repeating, because it is so true:).
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### Author:  [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)
#### Post date: [July 7, 2015, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/independence-day-special-thirteen-facts-about-america-conservatives-would-like-you-to-forget-etc/724453/2 "2015-07-07T07:14:34Z")
Apart from “you’ve got to see this”, what are your thoughts?
Can you summarize any of the points?
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### Author:  [@Jim\_B](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_B)
#### Post date: [July 7, 2015, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/independence-day-special-thirteen-facts-about-america-conservatives-would-like-you-to-forget-etc/724453/3 "2015-07-07T07:21:47Z")
> [@Mijin](#):
>
> Apart from “you’ve got to see this”, what are your thoughts?
> Can you summarize any of the points?
I think the links speak for themselves, and I endorse all that they say in them wholeheartedly.
Keep in mind, I am very serious about this appealing to rightwingers too. Indeed, many of the points are consistent with that philosophy too. The problem with this country, is we get so partisan, we don’t even realize where we might agree too. Very sad, in my opinion.
And lastly, as I have already said, and made clear too, I am actually all over the political spectrum myself. I identify with the left, for brevity’s sake. But I also don’t think I (or anyone else, for that matter) fits neatly into any one category.
🙂
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### Author:  [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)
#### Post date: [July 7, 2015, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/independence-day-special-thirteen-facts-about-america-conservatives-would-like-you-to-forget-etc/724453/4 "2015-07-07T16:54:38Z")
> [@](#):
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> 1. Conservatives opposed the Founding Fathers, the American Revolution and a lot of other righteous stuff as well
.
This is a literal meaning of conservative but not a political one. What modern conservatives want to conserve is the classical liberalism of the Founding Fathers. What the Revolution was revolting against was a central government that was too strong and that wielded power arbitrarily.
> [@](#):
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> 1. The United States is not a Christian nation, and the Bible is not the cornerstone of our law.
The US is not a Christian nation but has always been a nation of Christians. The separation of church and state was to protect the church from the state. That is why the first amendment includes freedom to exercise your religion as the first right.
> [@](#):
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> 1. Long before the United States even existed, it was drawing “problem” immigrants.
This applies to a time when the US was mostly unpopulated due to the massive die off of Indians. These days failure to assimilate means poor outcomes for the immigrants and a less cohesive nation.
> [@](#):
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> 1. Those Pilgrims were commies… and it saved their lives.
The first year under “communism” almost killed all of the Pilgrims. They only survived by finding the ruins of an indian village and eating the food buried there. When the pilgrims stopped sharing everything and made all property private the economy took off and starvation stopped being such a danger to the colony.
> [@](#):
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> 1. One of the Founding Fathers, Thomas Jefferson, hated Thanksgiving.
Another of the founding fathers, Washington proclaimed the first national day of thanksgiving in 1789. James Madison, author of the constitution also proclaimed days of thanksgiving while he was president.
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> 1. The Pledge of Allegiance was written by a socialist.
Just because someone can write a good pledge does not mean their economic ideas are any good.
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> 1. Roe v. Wade was a bipartisan decision made by a predominantly Republican-appointed Supreme Court.
Dredd Scott was a bipartisan decision also decided 7-2. Both were bad decisions. Unfortunately, Democrats do not have monopoly on appointing bad justices who do not follow the constitution.
> [@](#):
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> 1. Conservative icon Ronald Reagan once signed a bill legalizing abortion.
Only for the health of the mother. Reagan thought if he vetoed the abortion bill he would have been overrode by the legislature. So he worked to make it so it only legalized abortion for health reasons and did not authorize abortion on demand.
> [@](#):
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> 1. Reagan also raised federal taxes eleven times.
Reagan was faced with a democratic congress and had to compromise to get his legislation through. He also signed a tax reform bill which increased some taxes in exchange for making the tax code simpler. When Reagan was elected the top rate was 70% and when he left it was 28% so there is no question overall he was a tax cutter.
> [@](#):
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> 1. Barry Goldwater was pro-choice, supported gay rights, deeply despised the Religious Right, and - gasp! - liked Hillary Clinton.
As Goldwater got older he got more socially liberal. By that point he had long been eclipsed as someone influential in the conservative movement.
> [@](#):
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> 1. The first president to propose national health insurance was a Republican.
Roosevelt was a progressive and had lots of bad ideas. He was an enthusiast for war, and imperialism. He helped get the US into WW1. He was not close to infallible.
> [@](#):
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> 1. Those “job-killing” environmental regulations? Republican things.
Everything runs into diminishing returns. In the late 1960s the environment was much worse. Now the air and water are much cleaner and instead of being satisfied, environmentalists keep wanting more and more. Even thought the ROI for environmentalism is getting smaller and smaller.
> [@](#):
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> 1. President Obama was not only born in the United States, his roots run deeper in American history than most conservatives’ - and most other Americans’ - do.
His roots are not just his mother’s family. His father was not an American and he lived ten out of his first twelve years in another country. Surely those are more important roots than where his great great great grandfather lived.
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### Author:  [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)
#### Post date: [July 7, 2015, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/independence-day-special-thirteen-facts-about-america-conservatives-would-like-you-to-forget-etc/724453/5 "2015-07-07T22:38:30Z")
> [@puddleglum](#):
>
> .
> His roots are not just his mother’s family. His father was not an American and he lived ten out of his first twelve years in another country. Surely those are more important roots than where his great great great grandfather lived.
Wait, what? This Wikipedia entry is terrible (it doesn’t seem to have been written by a native English speaker) but the facts in it are consistent with what I remember reading in “Dreams of My Father”:
> [@](#):
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> Obama spent most of his childhood years in Honolulu, where his mother completed college after his parents divorced. Obama started a close relationship with his maternal grandparents. In 1965, his mother remarried to Lolo Soetoro from Indonesia. Two years later, Dunham took Obama with her to Indonesia to reunite him with his stepfather. In 1971, Obama returned to Hawaii to attend Punahou School, from which he graduated in 1979.
link: [Early life and career of Barack Obama - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_life_and_career_of_Barack_Obama)
The above indicates that he lived in Indonesia from 1967 to 1971, which is four years, not ten. So are you saying that the above is factually incorrect?
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### Author:  [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)
#### Post date: [July 8, 2015, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/independence-day-special-thirteen-facts-about-america-conservatives-would-like-you-to-forget-etc/724453/6 "2015-07-08T16:21:10Z")
> [@CairoCarol](#):
>
> Wait, what? This Wikipedia entry is terrible (it doesn’t seem to have been written by a native English speaker) but the facts in it are consistent with what I remember reading in “Dreams of My Father”:
>
> link: [Early life and career of Barack Obama - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_life_and_career_of_Barack_Obama)
>
> The above indicates that he lived in Indonesia from 1967 to 1971, which is four years, not ten. So are you saying that the above is factually incorrect?
You are right, I thought he moved to Indonesia after his mother and step father married, but after looking into it, he did not move to Indonesia until later.