# Indo-European suffix "-ter / -ther" **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 12, 2008, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/indo-european-suffix-ter-ther/472353 "2008-11-12T15:28:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Mississippienne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d2c977/32.png) [@Mississippienne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mississippienne)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2008, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/indo-european-suffix-ter-ther/472353/21 "2008-11-13T15:35:18Z")
I don’t know about the Hungarian-Turkish connection; someone more versed in their language histories would have to weigh in on that. I think it’s worth mentioning that some linguists group Uralic (Hungarian) and Altaic (Turkish) into one large family called Uralic-Altaic. > [@pulykamell](#): > > Most of those look very similar to words in current-day Slavic languages. Interesting to see. Here’s the modern-day transliterated equivalents: RUSSIAN _Brat_, “brother” _Doch_, “daughter” _Ded_, “grandfather” _Mat_, “mother” _Dyadya_, “uncle” _Muzh_, “husband” _Otets_, “father” _Sestra_, “sister” _Zhena_, “wife” BULGARIAN _Brat_, “brother” _Dshteria_, “daughter” _Dedo_, “grandfather” _Maika_, “mother” _Chicho_, “uncle” _Saprug_, “husband” _Bashta_, “father” _Sestra_, “sister” _Sapruga_, “wife” SERBIAN _Brat_, “brother” _ćerka_, “daughter” _Deda_, “grandfather” _Mati_, “mother” _Ujak_, “uncle” _Otac_, “father” _Sestra_, “sister” ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2008, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/indo-european-suffix-ter-ther/472353/22 "2008-11-13T15:59:07Z")
> [@Panurge](#): > > Point is: Apparently the agent suffix is different from the kinship suffix in some way Right, not just in Sanskrit but in Indo-European in general. But the source I mentioned earlier, and other sources I’ve looked at, seem to indicate that nobody is really sure whether the agent suffix and the kinship suffix really **are** related, or if not, why they’re so similar. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2008, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/indo-european-suffix-ter-ther/472353/23 "2008-11-13T17:02:02Z")
> [@Panurge](#): > > According to MacDonell’s _A Vedic Grammar for Students_… Just to point out that although this is a good reference and MacDonell is in general reliable, he wrote a long time ago and there have been many breakthroughs in I-E Studies that he could not have known about. Doesn’t mean he’s wrong, just not the horse’s mouth for IE stuff. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2008, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/indo-european-suffix-ter-ther/472353/24 "2008-11-13T17:07:21Z")
I’d just like to say that I’m a fan of PIE/ancient language origins and really love these kinds of threads. I.e., I want more! ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2008, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/indo-european-suffix-ter-ther/472353/25 "2008-11-13T20:59:13Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > Cite for the Irish provinces? The suffix has to be _-ster_ because the Irish is _Laigin_, _Mumain_ (dat.), and _Ulaid_, by Middle Irish pronounced _lan_, _mun_ and _ul_, each of them palatalized. I had always heard that the termination was a Norse word. No cite - just an observation. -ster makes more sense, and does indeed look Norse. ---
**Author:** ![Panurge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/fbc32d/32.png) [@Panurge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Panurge)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2008, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/indo-european-suffix-ter-ther/472353/26 "2008-11-13T22:07:37Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > Just to point out that although this is a good reference and MacDonell is in general reliable, he wrote a long time ago and there have been many breakthroughs in I-E Studies that he could not have known about. Doesn’t mean he’s wrong, just not the horse’s mouth for IE stuff. I know. But it was the only related book available to me at the time - these questions always seem to turn up when you’re out of office, don’t they? 🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/indo-european-suffix-ter-ther/472353.md?page=1)