# Industrial or Goth music....... **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 20, 2004, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070 "2004-04-20T19:02:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Trigonal\_Planar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/0ea827/32.png) [@Trigonal\_Planar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trigonal_Planar)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/21 "2004-04-21T07:48:24Z")
heh, figures nobody would mentioned the incomparable **Gary Numan**. I personally prefer his early electronic stuff better, but throughout the 90s he’s been releasing some heavy/goth stuff. In particular, his latest album, **Pure** is stellar. What was that name again? Oh yes, **Gary Numan - Pure** ---
**Author:** ![Cerri](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3bc359/32.png) [@Cerri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cerri)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/22 "2004-04-21T08:04:04Z")
Not one Sisters of Mercy mention so far?? ---
**Author:** ![Hunter\_Hawk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/50afbb/32.png) [@Hunter\_Hawk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hunter_Hawk)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/23 "2004-04-21T08:26:46Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#): > > You can’t mention Throbbing Gristle without mentioning Psychic TV! I was considering mentioning Psychic TV, but then decided not to, because IMO a lot of their stuff doesn’t really fall into either the industrial or goth categories that the OP asked about. Some of their early releases would, of course. And then, of couse, there’s always Coil and CTI/Chris & Cosey. ---
**Author:** ![tiny\_ham](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@tiny\_ham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiny_ham)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/24 "2004-04-21T13:34:23Z")
I thought **Ministry** was just a given. Everyone should own **The Land of Rape and Honey**. There would be no good industrial music without it. And if you care about what your band’s stand for, I’d stay away from **Laibach** , as they are decidedly…um…FAR right wing, if you get my drift. ---
**Author:** ![Lissla\_Lissar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8491ac/32.png) [@Lissla\_Lissar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lissla_Lissar)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/25 "2004-04-21T14:30:37Z")
Well, now we know who does vanity searches. 😃 I rather like Revolver 1010, although it’s more straight dark electronica. Same for This Morn’ Omina. I saw Ayria perform at the Das Ich concert, and they were pretty good. I tend to go by individual songs instead of bands, because I usually just pick up song titles at my favourite club (“ooh! this one’s good! what’s it called?”). Except for my undying loyalty to VNV and Assemblage. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/26 "2004-04-21T15:40:37Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > And Diamanda Galas is a true goddess. In the [Macha Morrigan](http://www.iol.ie/~sinann/grove/morrigan.html) mold, no doubt :). She’s insanely talented (adverb chosen carefully), but she’s not my cup of Drano. I’d forgotten all about the Cure’s Pornography; along with their Disintegration and The Creature’s Boomerang, it was one of my favorite albums as a semigoth teen. (Semigoth=Chaotic Goth with Druidic Tendencies, the kind of goth who makes allusions to Macha Morrigan). The Creatures consisted of Siouxsie Sioux and Budgie, IIRC, two of the members of Siouxsie and the Banshees, and their album Boomerang is spare, cryptic, surreal, and darkly funny. Brilliant stuff. I should get ahold of a copy of it. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/27 "2004-04-21T15:54:49Z")
Joy Division. I’m sorry Lissener, but Diamanda Galas is nothing but a pretentious harpie. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/28 "2004-04-21T15:57:29Z")
> [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > In the [Macha Morrigan](http://www.iol.ie/~sinann/grove/morrigan.html) mold, no doubt :). . . . Definitely. Although I usually think of her as Vagina Dentata, or Aunty from _Riddley Walker._ ---
**Author:** ![interface2x](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c0e974/32.png) [@interface2x](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/interface2x)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/29 "2004-04-21T17:12:05Z")
> [@Lissla Lissar](#): > > Well, now we know who does vanity searches. 😃 Actually, I just happened to enter Cafe Society to see a thread title that practically SCREAMED my name 😃 ---
**Author:** ![NailBunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecae2f/32.png) [@NailBunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NailBunny)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/30 "2004-04-21T17:22:25Z")
> [@Tengu](#): > > OT, but I didn’t notice until you posted on this particular thread… > > You’re a Johnny the Homicidal Maniac fan, aren’t you? Why yes, yes I am! And thank you for the comment, **lissener**. I could never sit through **Diamanda** for very long, but I love her as a person just for doing the crazy shit she does. **Foetus** , on the other hand, I can listen to day in and day out, much to the chagrin of my neighbours. The only good Christian is a dead Christian! 😉 And can I just say I am punching myself in the face as we speak, for not mentioning **Ministry** , **Sisters of Mercy** , **Coil** , **Throbbing Gristle** , **Legendary Pink Dots** and **Front 242**. I knew I was forgetting lots yesterday, and there you go. My goth license is officially temporarily suspended. Once again, the above are all bands that you should be able to find at any Tower Records or CD World or whathaveyou. Ah, this thread is taking me on a happy (or should that be gloomy) trip down memory lane. I can see myself now, 17, in a wedding dress and big black boots, with my lunchbox and eyeliner, seizuring across the dance floor of The City nightclub in Portland, Oregon (The Other Side, upstairs, was the goth portion of the club, downstairs was all techno/disco) to **Einstürzende Neubauten** ’s _Z.N.S._. Good times. ---
**Author:** ![Infovore](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/infovore/32/420_2.png) [@Infovore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Infovore)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/31 "2004-04-21T18:19:29Z")
I recently got into goth/industrial music too, after attending a party at an industrial club at Gen Con last year (Micah Skaritka from Cruciform Injection also happens to be the head of the Apophis Consortium gaming company and a friend of the line developer for Shadowrun where I freelance, which is how square little me ended up getting invited to such a thing). Anyway, I recommend wandering over to [industrial-music.com](http://industrial-music.com), Metropolis Records’ website, and checking out their offerings. So far I’ve bought and enjoyed: VNV Nation (Futureperfect and Empires) funkervogt (Survivor) haujobb (Solutions for a Small Planet) Informatik (Nymphomatik) Cruciform Injection (Response Stimuli, Critical, Epilogue, and Biomechanical Disintegration) I’m planning to pick up Icon of Coil, Assemblage 23, and a few others soon. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/32 "2004-04-21T18:30:58Z")
> [@TwistofFate](#): > > Joy Division. > I’m sorry Lissener, but Diamanda Galas is nothing but a pretentious harpie. Now why would you try to pick a fight like that? You know some people see something valuable in her work, and some people don’t. Ever since it’s become clear to me that I’m not allowed to discuss certain unpopular directors around here, I’ve decided not to engage in any negative Cafe Society threads; in fact I’ve decided not to say anything at all if I can’t say something positive. For now at any rate. But then you come along with this, something that if I’d said it–_poof_! there’d be three pages of pileon about how condescending I am. I just don’t get it around here anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/33 "2004-04-21T22:07:26Z")
> [@jarbabyj](#): > > And if you care about what your band’s stand for, I’d stay away from **Laibach** , as they are decidedly…um…FAR right wing, if you get my drift. Actually, they along with Ramstein, are members of an “art collective” who have adopted the Fascist bent merely as a type of “performance art.” (In the liner notes for one of their albums they point this out.) Laibach’s cover of the Beatles _Let It Be_ is not to be missed, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![tiny\_ham](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@tiny\_ham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiny_ham)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2004, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/34 "2004-04-22T13:22:18Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#): > > Actually, they along with Ramstein, are members of an “art collective” who have adopted the Fascist bent merely as a type of “performance art.” (In the liner notes for one of their albums they point this out.) Laibach’s cover of the Beatles _Let It Be_ is not to be missed, IMHO. Please don’t lump Rammstien (two m’s) with Laibach. There is absolutely nothing facist about Ramsmtein, unless you count the German language itself as facist. :rolleyes: Nor is their anything in any Rammstein liner notes about adopting a facist bent as ‘art’. I’ve seen them live seven times and have never seen any evidence of this, eitehr. ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2004, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/35 "2004-04-22T15:14:26Z")
No one’s mentioned Collide, Butterfly Messiah, or Unto Ashes yet. All three are very definitely worth checking out. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2004, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/36 "2004-04-22T21:58:03Z")
> [@jarbabyj](#): > > Please don’t lump Rammstien (two m’s) with Laibach. There is absolutely nothing facist about Ramsmtein, unless you count the German language itself as facist. :rolleyes: Nor is their anything in any Rammstein liner notes about adopting a facist bent as ‘art’. I’ve seen them live seven times and have never seen any evidence of this, eitehr. Well, the reason you haven’t seen in Rammstein’s liner notes, is because it’s mentioned in **Laibach** ’s liner notes. I don’t remember all the details, but Rammstein, Laibach, and a few other groups are all members of the same collective and they all use aspects of fascist/totalitarian imagery in their performances. A roommate of mine had this huge book on the the collective (damned if I can remember what the name of it was, though the text was in English and German), it mentioned who the groups were, and what their overall philosphy was. Plus it had a lot of shots from their various performances along with stills from various fascist films which inspired the stage performances. Just because they use fascist imagery doesn’t make them fascist. _The Lion King_ used rotoscoped shots from _Triumph of the Will_, that doesn’t make it a pro-Nazi movie. ---
**Author:** ![eunoia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eunoia/32/97_2.png) [@eunoia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eunoia)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/37 "2004-04-23T10:33:57Z")
Some more not yet mentioned: 16 Volt Action Directe Ah Cama-Sotz Amduscia Ascii Disko ASP A Split Second à;Grumh Absurd Minds Aimless Device Alien Sex Fiend Altaïr And One Anne Clark The Arch Aslan Faction Beborn Beton Bigod 20 BlutEngel Borghesia Butthole Surfers C.C.C.P. C-Tec Cabaret Voltaire Camouflage The Cascades Cassandra Complex Cesium 137 Chamber Chameleons U.K. Cleen Click Click ClockDVA Code Industry Cold et Soman Colony 5 Conjure One Converter Corvus Corax Covenant The Cramps Cultus Ferox Cyberactif Cyber Axis Cyborg Attack DAF DavaNtage Deathline International Deathstars Decoded Feedback Decree Delerium Depeche Mode Dessau De/Vision Diary of Dreams Die Warzau Din Fiv Dismantled Dorsetshire Dogwalker Download Dulce Liquido Eisbrecher Evils Toy Fatal Morgana Fad Gadget The Fair Sex Faith & the Muse Faun Fear Factory Fictional Fiddler Green Fields Of The Nephilim Feindflug Fixmer/Mc Carthy Flesh Field Front Line Assembly The Gathering The Ghost Of Lamora Ghosting, Pride And Fall Girls Under Glass The Glove God Module Gothminister Grauzone Gravity Kills Graveworm Grendel Haggard Hate Dept. Hioctan Hocico The House of Usher In Strict Confidence Informatik Inkubus Sukkubus In Extremo In Mitra Medusa Inri Insekt Intermix Interpol Invincible Spirit Jesus and the Gurus Juno Reactor Kartagon Kevorkian Death Cycle Killing Miranda Killing Ophelia Kirlian Camera Klinik Kraftwerk Lacrimas Profundere Lacrimosa La Floa Maldita Lassigue Bendthaus Leaves Eyes Lene Lovich Liaisons Dangereuses Lights Of Euphoria London After Midnight Lords Of Acid Love And Rockets Luxt Marilyn Manson Matore Mastertune Melotron Mila Mar Miranda Sex Garden The Mission U.K. Monofader Mystic Circle Nekromantix NamNamBulu Neon Judgement Neon Dream Negative Format Nightwish Nina Hagen Nitzer Ebb Noctulus Noise Unit Northern Lite Ohgr Ordo Rosarius Equilibrio Out Out Persephone Pitchshifter Plastic Pop Will Eat Itself Primal Scream Proyecto Mirage Psyche Pygmy Children Qntal Ravenous Ressurrection Eve Revolting Cocks Robotiko Rejekto Rob Zonbie Rotersand Salonorchester Weimar Saltatio Mortis Samsas Traum Sanguis Et Cinis Sara Noxx Say Y Schamdmaul Seabound Secret Discovery Serotonine Severed Heads Siglo XX Silence Is Sexy Sister Machine Gun SITD Skeletal Family Spetsnaz S.P.K. Star Industry Staub Staubkind Stromkern Suicide Commando Switchblade Symphony Tactical Sekt Terrorfakt Theatre Of Tragedy Therion Thrive The Tors Of Dartmoor Trans X Tribantura Trisomie 21 Tristania Tweaker Type O Negative Ultraviolence Ultravox Undergod Untoten Umbra et Imago Velvet Acid Christ Welle Erdball Winterkälte Within Temptation X Marks The Pedwalk Xorcist Xotox Xymox yelworC Many club nights publish playlists such as [Sinister](http://www.barsinister.net/diary.php) in L.A. which has more classic old school, or [Replikant](http://www.kao-production.com/n005e.htm) in Montréal (click on a DJ, then “playlist”) which plays the modern dance/techno that passes for Goth/Industrial these days. But at some point, you will order CD’s from Metropolis Records, trust me. If ever you get a better connection, look into [Digital Gunfire](http://www.digitalgunfire.com/) 'net radio. ---
**Author:** ![tiny\_ham](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@tiny\_ham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiny_ham)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/38 "2004-04-23T13:29:12Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#): > > Just because they use fascist imagery doesn’t make them fascist. _The Lion King_ used rotoscoped shots from _Triumph of the Will_, that doesn’t make it a pro-Nazi movie. Incidentally, Rammstein’s video for STRIPPED uses film from Olympia…and it’s beautiful. But just to clarify,I did some research on this art collective and found [this website](http://www.nskstate.com/) listing their goals and projects, and didn’t find one mention of Rammstein. I’ve been listening to industrial/metal music for years and have never heard Rammstein mentioned in conjunction with them. Laibach, however, I have heard has very violent, right wing leanings (perhaps not so far as to be fascist), and I would be very careful to put the two bands as peas in a pod. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2004, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/39 "2004-04-24T02:51:41Z")
> [@jarbabyj](#): > > Incidentally, Rammstein’s video for STRIPPED uses film from Olympia…and it’s beautiful. > > But just to clarify,I did some research on this art collective and found [this website](http://www.nskstate.com/) listing their goals and projects, and didn’t find one mention of Rammstein. > > I’ve been listening to industrial/metal music for years and have never heard Rammstein mentioned in conjunction with them. Laibach, however, I have heard has very violent, right wing leanings (perhaps not so far as to be fascist), and I would be very careful to put the two bands as peas in a pod. Well, I don’t know about the violent leanings of Laibach. It’s been years since I glanced at that book, but I seem to recall that it mentioned something about how the full membership of the group would be hidden, and that one of the “codes” they used was certain iconography (akin to how the early Christians supposedly used the “fish” symbol to make themselves known to one another without saying, “Hey, Xerxes, I’m Christian, how about you?”), all of which Rammstein seems to have adopted. Now, the members of Rammstein could have said, “Ya know, the stuff the NSK State guys are doing is pretty cool, let’s rip 'em off!” or they might not have. Considering the Rammstein folks are in Germany, and the German government takes a **very** dim view of anything which smacks of the Nazi party, I can well imagine that the Rammstein folks would want to keep any affiliation with NSK State pretty low-key. ---
**Author:** ![Lissla\_Lissar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8491ac/32.png) [@Lissla\_Lissar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lissla_Lissar)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2004, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070/40 "2004-04-24T14:30:56Z")
Y’know, I recognise most of those bands. That’s somehow scary. And This Morn 'Omina and a guy from Ah Cama-sotz have a side project called Powder Pussy that performed at Savage Garden in Toronto last Friday. It was pretty good. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/industrial-or-goth-music/241070.md?page=3)