# Inflation is not currently a menace **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 8, 2021, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738 "2021-12-08T22:40:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/241 "2022-07-29T04:06:02Z")
Nobody is stupid enough to invest in oil production when a President is shutting them down. He created a toxic business environment… ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/242 "2022-07-29T04:09:56Z")
Yup, nobody was stupid enough to invest under the wrong president > **[ANWR lease sale fizzles for Trump administration, with revenue falling far...](https://www.adn.com/business-economy/energy/2021/01/06/anwr-lease-sale-brings-in-144-million-in-bids-mostly-from-alaska-state-owned-corporation/)** > > The vast majority of $14.4 million in winning bids were submitted by a development corporation owned by the state of Alaska. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/243 "2022-07-29T05:08:57Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > I understand that Biden shut down ANWR and Keystone. He’s created a toxic business environment for the oil/gas industry. The Department of Energy was created during the 70’s oil crisis to deal with this and they have failed under this administration You do not understand contracts, oil flows, or even the simple fact that different grades of crudes require different refineries. But have at it, man. 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 10:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/244 "2022-07-29T10:06:16Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > You do not understand contracts, oil flows, or even the simple fact that different grades of crudes require different refineries. But have at it, man. This constitutes a debating advantage on the right. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/245 "2022-07-29T10:33:23Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > because the current Secretary of Energy’s policy involves the Saudis selling us more oil. They Saudis are selling us _less_ oil than under Trump. I’ve already written this. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/246 "2022-07-29T17:44:50Z")
The U.S. exports more oranges than it imports apples. We will never achieve fruit independence until we can get these to balance! ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/247 "2022-07-29T18:10:57Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > They Saudis are selling us _less_ oil than under Trump. > I’ve already written this. You have a short memory or weren’t aware of what was going on. Bolding below is mine. Reuters April 30 2020 [Special Report: Trump told Saudi: Cut oil supply or lose U.S. military support - sources in 2020 the Saudis were dumping oil and undercutting US prices.](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-global-oil-trump-saudi-specialreport/special-report-trump-told-saudi-cut-oil-supply-or-lose-u-s-military-support-sources-idUSKBN22C1V4) - WASHINGTON/LONDON/DUBAI (Reuters) - As the United States pressed Saudi Arabia to end its oil price war with Russia, President Donald Trump gave Saudi leaders an ultimatum. - In an April 2 phone call, Trump told Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman that unless the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) started cutting oil production, he would be powerless to stop lawmakers from passing legislation to withdraw U.S. troops from the kingdom, four sources familiar with the matter told Reuters. - The threat to upend a 75-year strategic alliance, which has not been previously reported, was central to the U.S. pressure campaign that led to a landmark global deal to slash oil supply as demand collapsed in the coronavirus pandemic - **scoring a diplomatic victory for the White House.** That is what leadership looks like. Trump stepped in to keep the Saudis from undermining US production in a price war. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/248 "2022-07-29T18:20:58Z")
Trump did what now? [![Imgur](https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52249957364_5d44a01127_b.jpg "SmartSelect\_20220729-131950\_Chrome") ](https://www.flickr.com/photos/68782016@N08/52249957364/) ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/249 "2022-07-29T18:28:02Z")
Exactly what I said. You can see the dumping of oil and a return to normal numbers in your chart. That was a result of intervention by Trump. Thanks for the chart. Fortune April 14 2020 [Trump’s oil deal: The inside story of how the Saudi-Russia price war ended](https://fortune.com/2020/04/14/trump-oil-deal-inside-story-saudi-arabia-russia-price-war-ended/) - After a week-long marathon of calls between world leaders and video conferences featuring dozens of energy ministers, it was the moment the [2020 oil price war finally ended](https://fortune.com/2020/04/13/saudi-arabia-russia-oil-price-war-ends-opec-deal-slash-output-prices/). - From Villahermosa, a city near Mexico’s largest crude terminal, Energy Minister Rocio Nahle raised her voice. “Your Royal Highness, Mexico has already agreed. And now I would like to ask you: ‘Do you agree with these terms?’” - In Riyadh, Saudi Energy Minister Prince Abdulaziz bin Salman nearly chuckled as he looked at a wall of video feeds showing his counterparts around the world. “I go with the consensus. I agree,” he replied. - At that moment, the OPEC+ alliance sealed the largest ever coordinated production cut, removing about a 10th of global supply. The [historic deal had almost been derailed](https://fortune.com/2020/04/10/oil-prices-mexico-saudi-arabia-russia-production-cut-opec/) by a fight between Saudi Arabia and Mexico’s populist government, forcing President Donald Trump to step in and broker a face-saving solution. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/250 "2022-07-29T18:33:31Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > You have a short memory or weren’t aware of what was going on. Bolding below is mine. The Saudis dropped production in April 2020. Then they increased it. They produced 10.35 MMBPD last month, more than their pre-pandemic Trump years monthly average of 10.08. Which has very little to do with what they’re “selling us”, what with SA supplying only about 3% of what we consume. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/251 "2022-07-29T18:36:44Z")
The News cites a gave dispute your position. It was Trump’s engagement of OPEC that ended the Russian/Saudi oil war. And John T’s chart shows a 2 month dumping of oil. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/252 "2022-07-29T18:42:17Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > The News cites a gave dispute your position. It was Trump’s engagement of OPEC that ended the Russian/Saudi oil war. My position is that SA both produces more oil than it did pre-pandemic and sells us less. A cite from 2020 cannot dispute data from May/June 2022. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/253 "2022-07-29T18:52:21Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > My position is that SA both produces more oil than it did pre-pandemic and sells us less. A cite from 2020 cannot dispute data from May/June 2022. In 2021 starting in August there is more Saudi oil imported than in 2020. But that doesn’t change the fact that Trump stopped massive dumping on the market to preserve production in the US. Biden’s position was to promote alternative energy at the expense of short term oil production and now we have transportation driven inflation. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2022, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/254 "2022-07-29T20:34:05Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > massive dumping Amounting to 2.3% of 2020 domestic production, if the “massive dumping” had held steady for the remainder of the year. SA is a bit player when it comes to oil consumed in the US. That’s what my objection was about. You wrote that DOE S1’s “policy involves the Saudis selling us more oil” when what they sell us is inconsequential wrt imports and consumption. What affects us more is what they’re selling (or not) to the rest of the world, which affects our and everyone else’s price. I believe the greatest barrier to _short-term_ domestic production is the availability of people and equipment, especially in the Permian Basin, followed by an unwillingness to risk losing shirts (again – the “shale boom” was a $300B hole until recently) on highly leveraged development. And I’m curious what policy actions could ameliorate those. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2022, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/255 "2022-08-11T00:04:06Z")
Apparently, inflation is not a menace. According to Biden, it was zero in July. [Biden says inflation may be easing but people are ‘still hurting’ | Reuters](https://www.reuters.com/markets/us/biden-says-inflation-may-be-easing-people-are-still-hurting-2022-08-10/) ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2022, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/256 "2022-08-11T00:33:46Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > According to Biden, it was zero in July. It’s true that the CPI index didn’t increase in July. It was up 0.3% for everything ex food and energy, food was up over a percent, energy was down like 4%. [Cite](https://www.bls.gov/news.release/archives/cpi_08102022.htm). He didn’t say it’s not a menace. Do you doubt that it was zero in July? Maybe you have a cite? Otherwise, I’m not sure why you say “according to Biden”. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2022, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/257 "2022-08-11T00:41:25Z")
The inflation rate fell from 9.1% in June to 8.5% in July. It was not zero. The cite is the Reuters article quoted, as well as a cite for Joe’s statement “zero inflation last month”. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2022, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/258 "2022-08-11T00:44:26Z")
That’s the annual inflation rate. That is, it’s in increase from last July to this July. The increase from one month to the next was zero. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2022, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/259 "2022-08-11T00:48:30Z")
Saying there was “Zero inflation last month” is false. Zero increase is different than zero inflation. Just like they’ve redefined recession, right? It’s all spin. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2022, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738/260 "2022-08-11T00:51:43Z")
You’re just wrong about this. It’s OK to be wrong sometimes. Prices didn’t increase last month. They increased by 8.5% in the last year, which was down from an annual increase of 9.1% in the previous month. Core inflation increased, month-over-month, as did food, but energy prices cratered. Let’s say I own a stock. The stock price increases by 9.1% from last June to this past June. Then, from June to July, it doesn’t change in price, but it’s still up 8.5% from the previous July. Would you say the price of the stock increased in July? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/inflation-is-not-currently-a-menace/955738.md?page=14)