# Interesting Atlantic article - "All The Single Ladies" - It's OK to be single! **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 26, 2011, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903 "2011-10-26T20:54:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/161 "2011-11-03T00:15:59Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Do you all really see men as either hunky well-to-do guys and guys living in their parents basement and working in the sub shop? > How about a guy who isn’t a slob but isn’t Adonis and who has a good job with chances to make it better but doesn’t have a really well-paying one? Is that settling? There is only one George Clooney out there, after all (or pick someone more age appropriate.) Maybe just maybe it is possible to be attracted to someone without measuring their abs and their bank balance? (And this goes the other way also, of course.) Doesn’t attraction and personality count any more? Similar interests? Somehow, most of my male coworkers are married, despite none of them being (much to my chagrin) George Clooney. Average looking guys (some of them downright funny looking) with average careers. I work in IT - lots of systems administrators. Three of our male desktop techs have gotten married in the past five years. One of them downright obese, one of them the among the most annoying people at work (nasal voice, tells Star Trek puns, not terribly bright), and one of them tattoo’d. I suspect the one who isn’t married is gay. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/162 "2011-11-03T01:32:37Z")
> [@treis](#): > > From this man’s perspective, I don’t care if you want to be single and stay single. But I’m not retarded enough to believe that women who have had a string of long term relationships, or systematically dated online really want to be single. People who really want to be single, stay single. Trying to achieve something, not succeeding, and then declaring that you really didn’t want it to begin with is the oldest self-justification in the world. No one is buying it. Except, of course, the other people in the midst of this self-justification, as it makes them feel better. Being happily single =//= being happily celibate. Serial monogamy is a pretty classic human pattern, with more of the “Ohhhh I’m falling in love and this is so much fun” and less of the “Ugh, I’m married, losing interest, haven’t had sex in years and this is such a drag.” Personally I tend to find that I lose interest in a relationships around the one year mark. It’d be great if I found someone who could overcome that, but short of that I don’t have any real compelling reason to “stick it out” just because that’s what I’m supposed to do. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/163 "2011-11-03T03:19:08Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > Being happily single =//= being happily celibate. Single doesn’t mean celibate. > [@even\_sven](#): > > Serial monogamy is a pretty classic human pattern, with more of the “Ohhhh I’m falling in love and this is so much fun” and less of the “Ugh, I’m married, losing interest, haven’t had sex in years and this is such a drag.” Personally I tend to find that I lose interest in a relationships around the one year mark. It’d be great if I found someone who could overcome that, but short of that I don’t have any real compelling reason to “stick it out” just because that’s what I’m supposed to do. Your supposed to try and find that person. Not simply shrug you shoulders and say if it happens it happens. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/164 "2011-11-03T03:50:54Z")
Girls, you’ve had plenty of chances to find “the one”: -Your high school sweetheart -College pre-med lacrosse team guy -That nice guy from work at your first job -The fun guy your friend set you up with who maybe drinks a bit too much -That nice looking dude from the bar (who never called you back) -The hipster with the band who never seems to have a job always crashing on your couch -Your boss (who swears he is about to leave his wife) -Creepy “angry at women” guy -40s the new 20 “not looking for a commitment” party guy > [@Argent Towers](#): > > 40 Year Old Virgin is about an eccentric, dorky over-aged virgin and a middle-aged woman with three kids and one grandchild. And Steve Carell’s character isn’t a “loser man-child” anyway, he’s actually pretty successful and likeable, just clueless about sex. Working in a Circuit City (or whatever the store was called) and having your coworkers think you are a creepy serial killer is “pretty successful and likeable”? > [@you with the face](#): > > No I don’t, but look at the context in which the “you should have realistic expectations” arose. The prevailing assumption in this thread appears to be that women (in the OP’s article) are single because they’re pining after men with 6-figure incomes and penthouse condos, like the stuff we see on TV. I think it’s much more likely that women are pining after men who are their intellectual and financial peers. There’s nothing unreasonable about that, even if it is a little unrealistic for all of them to get that. Women want a guy who isn’t a total loser. Having a high income is nice, but they don’t want some weird eccentric millionare unless they are a total golddigger. They want a guy whose fun and social but doesn’t get wasted every night with his buddies. He has to be sexually desirable, but not some sort of “player”. He needs to be smart and hardworking without being a total workaholic nerd. Strong without being a freakin lunatic. You get the idea. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/165 "2011-11-03T04:00:10Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Your supposed to try and find that person. Not simply shrug you shoulders and say if it happens it happens. _Excuse me_? Who the hell are you to tell me what I’m “supposed” to do? I follow the law and pay my taxes. Back off. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/166 "2011-11-03T04:03:03Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > _Excuse me_? Who the hell are you to tell me what I’m “supposed” to do? I follow the law and pay my taxes. Back off. Wowser. That sure hit a nerve. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/167 "2011-11-03T05:08:01Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Working in a Circuit City (or whatever the store was called) and having your coworkers think you are a creepy serial killer is “pretty successful and likeable”? You may have only seen the movie once or twice, but I have seen it dozens of times, as it used to be one of the several movies I’d play to help me fall asleep. At the outset of the movie, Carell’s character, Andy, is the inventory manager at the store (Smart Tech), i.e. the back room manager, not the floor manager. It’s established at the beginning that he “can’t afford a car”, as he tells his neighbor, but he bikes to work and doesn’t seem to mind doing that. He lives alone in an apartment, and so without car payments, a family or a mortage to pay off, he’s able to save a lot of money. Cal (Seth Rogen) does remark that he thinks Andy “is a serial murderer,” but, first of all, he’s the only person who makes such a remark, and second, I think it’s obvious that he doesn’t truly believe it - he just thinks Andy is “odd,” but it’s mostly because _he doesn’t know him._ A big theme of the movie is that Andy has worked with these guys for several years but they don’t really know him because he’s too reserved to talk to them. As the movie progresses, he is promoted to floor sales and then to assistant manager of the store. I don’t know if floor sales makes more money than inventory manager; the main reason he was moved to sales was because Paula wanted him to learn to be more outgoing. But certainly, once he was an assistant manager, he probably made a salary (probably the second highest in the store.) Towards the end of the film, he sells off a large portion of his vintage toy collection, netting him enough money to open his own store, though this is implied rather than shown. His girl Trish (Catherine Keener) had issues of her own, as well - her multiple kids and her age definitely decreased her strength in the dating “market”, making it more logical that she’d wind up with someone like Andy. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/168 "2011-11-03T12:18:45Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Wowser. That sure hit a nerve. Possibly because you are being annoying. You make it sound like there is some sort of sign-in where single gals can go pick up a man. My girlfriend has a single friend who does nothing but look for a man and whine about being single. We’ve hung out like a dozen times and all I know about her is she hates being single. Or like these girls who sign up for softball leagues or classes or hang out in sports bars or whatever so they can meet men. You’re never going to meet a man looking to get married by going to places like that because the men are either there to do their own thing or they know the girl who go there are desperate to meet men. > [@you with the face](#): > > With regard to movie depictions, Hollywood is notorious for portraying reality in a manner that is the polar opposite of the truth. Hollywood is filled with pretentous people who are decidedly NOT Middle America. What they produce is their interpretation of it, and in many ways it should be insulting. Although Middle America seems to love that crap so maybe it isn’t that far off. > [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > You may have only seen the movie once or twice, but I have seen it dozens of times, as it used to be one of the several movies I’d play to help me fall asleep. Oh I’ve seen it baby! He’s “doing alright” in movie terms. He is shown having a typical middle-class job. Something stable, but relatively non-descript. It wouldn’t make sense from a storytelling perspective to show him as “movie successful” (which typically means doctor, lawyer, investment banker, entertainment industry executive) because then he’d be “high powered executive who threw away love for his career” and we would be like “why can’t this guy get laid”? ---
**Author:** ![Barrett\_Bonden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5e9695/32.png) [@Barrett\_Bonden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barrett_Bonden)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/169 "2011-11-03T12:40:18Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Wowser. That sure hit a nerve. > [@msmith537](#): > > Possibly because you are being annoying. Thanks. **treis** : women are not required to do anything merely because it would guarantee that more males would get dates or mates if they did. Also, women are not required to wail and gnash their teeth because they are single. There is some company to which solitude is preferable. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/170 "2011-11-03T13:34:35Z")
> [@Barrett\_Bonden](#): > > Also, women are not required to wail and gnash their teeth because they are single. There is some company to which solitude is preferable. People (men and women) can stay single their whole lives, and that’s fine. I don’t think everyone has to get married at 22, or even at all. However, I think there’s a growing class of people who spend their 20s just farting around, getting silly degrees, living in tiny apartments, enjoying having money for the first time, and generally being boring. And then they spend their 30s being interesting, travelling the world, working cool jobs, dating fun people and posting all of this to facebook. And there’s really nothing wrong with that either. Until they get to their late 30s and they finally decide to have babies. And they utilize medical science and only have 1.2 kids because they don’t have the money or energy to concoct any more. Then they’re 43 on the playground, having skipped parenthood and gone straight to an early grandparenthood. And you know what? Free country, I’m not saying people can’t do that. But don’t expect me not to get judgmental. This being the land of gossip and everyone having an opinion, I’m going to have an opinion, and it’s not going to be to applaud people who couldn’t get their shit together and then couldn’t make up their minds about bringing human beings into the world. I also don’t know why society, in general, should encourage that sort of wish-washery. People need to decide in their early 20s if they want to breed or not, because that’s when the ball starts rolling. ---
**Author:** ![lindsaybluth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/90db22/32.png) [@lindsaybluth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lindsaybluth)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/171 "2011-11-03T13:37:09Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > If you can find me studies that control for age, income level, reason for being single (i.e. are you single because you’ve prioritized career, or because you are so batshit crazy nobody will come near you), supervision ( **I will, most likely, have access to a live-in nanny and other household staff** ), bolding mine Looks like we missed this gem. She’s a 30 year old never-employed-in-a-real-job grad student who did the Peace Corps after college. So with such certain access to live-in help, it’s clear she intends to raise her child exactly like the movie [Jungle 2 Jungle](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jungle_2_Jungle). ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/172 "2011-11-03T14:14:42Z")
> [@lindsaybluth](#): > > bolding mine > > Looks like we missed this gem. > > She’s a 30 year old never-employed-in-a-real-job grad student who did the Peace Corps after college. So with such certain access to live-in help, it’s clear she intends to raise her child exactly like the movie [Jungle 2 Jungle](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jungle_2_Jungle). Meeting with my former boss today- she’s going to offer me my job back, and I’m not going to take it. I’ll let her know that running a project at a think tank isn’t a real job, while I’m at it. I imagine she’ll be quite surprised- I got paid quite well, had my own office, and everything. I will probably live a couple more years in DC and then move abroad to a part of the world where household staff is common. If I had a kid, I’d try to swing it so that my mother (who would like to move abroad after she retires) could live with me as well. It probably will not resemble a Disney movie, but from the many, many people I know who do this, it’s by all means a comfortable, if unusual, life. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/173 "2011-11-03T14:46:56Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Working in a Circuit City (or whatever the store was called) and having your coworkers think you are a creepy serial killer is “pretty successful and likeable”? Yeah, the protagonist in that movie isn’t a bad guy, but he’s attractive like a puppy dog is attractive. Which is to say, not what we would consider a “good catch” by any reasonable metric. Socially inept, has a hobby on the geeky juvenile side (action figures decorate his apartment), zero confidence, no car although he lives in what looks like suburbia, completely inexperienced in life, easily influenced by peers, no history of any previous girlffriends. I’m sorry, but this is a man-child character. His job is the least of his problems, but I find it interesting that, yet again, _that_ is what we’ve glommed onto in a discussion about his desirability or lack thereof. Not his social immaturity. The one quality that supposedly makes him endearing to his love interest is that he’s completely non-threatenening and adorable (e.g. “sweet”). In reality, most women are probably not going to wowed by a guy simply because he’s non-threatenening, and adorable only goes so far, too. Also, the protagonist’s friends all show signs of being developmentally stunted as well, and yet they are presented as “normal guys”. This is classic Apatow: men are portrayed as mediocre adolescent types that still manage to succeed romantically. That said, 40-Year Old Virgin wasn’t what I had in mind when I talked about the “beloved dumb husband” trope. As much as it’s talked about on this board, yall know I’m not making that up. ---
**Author:** ![Barrett\_Bonden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5e9695/32.png) [@Barrett\_Bonden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barrett_Bonden)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/174 "2011-11-03T14:59:17Z")
> [@Barrett\_Bonden](#): > > Also, women are not required to wail and gnash their teeth because they are single. There is some company to which solitude is preferable. > [@steronz](#): > > Until they get to their late 30s and they finally decide to have babies. And they utilize medical science and only have 1.2 kids because they don’t have the money or energy to concoct any more. Then they’re 43 on the playground, having skipped parenthood and gone straight to an early grandparenthood. I’m not commenting on the accuracy of your post or lack thereof. I’d just like to point out that I said nothing about age or fecundity. I think you’re having an argument with someone else about something else. ---
**Author:** ![Barrett\_Bonden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5e9695/32.png) [@Barrett\_Bonden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barrett_Bonden)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/175 "2011-11-03T15:01:15Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > It probably will not resemble a Disney movie, but from the many, many people I know who do this, it’s by all means a comfortable, if unusual, life. Yes, but how many colanders do you plan to own? ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/176 "2011-11-03T15:43:04Z")
Bart: “Mom! Maggie threw up in your purse.” Lindsey Neigal: “Poor me! The only thing in my purse is disposable income!” –The Simpsons > [@steronz](#): > > Until they get to their late 30s and they finally decide to have babies. And they utilize medical science and only have 1.2 kids because they don’t have the money or energy to concoct any more. I plan to use my penis (which, coincidently I named “Medical Science”). > [@steronz](#): > > Then they’re 43 on the playground, having skipped parenthood and gone straight to an early grandparenthood. How does someone who has kids in their late 30s become a grandparent at 43?😕 ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/177 "2011-11-03T15:50:05Z")
> [@Barrett\_Bonden](#): > > Thanks. > > **treis** : women are not required to do anything merely because it would guarantee that more males would get dates or mates if they did. > > Also, women are not required to wail and gnash their teeth because they are single. There is some company to which solitude is preferable. I’m not requiring single women to wail and gnash their teeth. I’m not requiring them to do anything. What I am doing is not believing them. I don’t really believe that people take life changing decisions with the attitude I have about seeing the new Adam Sandler movie. I also don’t believe that people who have been in serious relationships since their freshman year of college are happy being single at 39. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/178 "2011-11-03T15:53:34Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I plan to use my penis (which, coincidently I named “Medical Science”). lol > [@msmith537](#): > > How does someone who has kids in their late 30s become a grandparent at 43?😕 I get into conversations with people who have kids my kids’ ages that end awkwardly when I say things like, “Oh yeah, my parents like that show.” ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/179 "2011-11-03T16:16:36Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > I will probably live a couple more years in DC and then move abroad to a part of the world where household staff is common. If I had a kid, I’d try to swing it so that my mother (who would like to move abroad after she retires) could live with me as well. It probably will not resemble a Disney movie, but from the many, many people I know who do this, it’s by all means a comfortable, if unusual, life. I got no problem with unusual (although I’m one of those freaks who married at 24, so perhaps I’m not welcome in thread), but you can understand how this comes off a bit pie-in-the-sky right? You’ve got everything planned, but it requires a very certain set of circumstances that aren’t exactly easy to complete. You may be setting yourself up for disappointment. Which I believe is **msmith** ’s and **treis** ’s point. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2011, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903/180 "2011-11-03T16:30:21Z")
> [@Barrett\_Bonden](#): > > Thanks. > > **treis** : women are not required to do anything merely because it would guarantee that more males would get dates or mates if they did. I missed the implication here the first time. My advice had nothing to do with getting men dates or mates. My advice was how to get a relationship, and really can be applied to anything. If you want something, don’t just shrug your shoulders and say if it happens, it happens. If you want something, you have to take steps to make it happen. We aren’t invalids passively floating down the river of life. We are people that have a say in what happens in our lives. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-atlantic-article-all-the-single-ladies-its-ok-to-be-single/600903.md?page=10)