# Interesting facts about our (USA's) gun culture **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 21, 2000, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-facts-about-our-usas-gun-culture/37825 "2000-10-21T22:45:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![hesredbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/9fc348/32.png) [@hesredbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hesredbird)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2000, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-facts-about-our-usas-gun-culture/37825/61 "2000-10-29T13:37:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mjollnir \* > \*\*(Firm Second Amendment supporter here) > > I read this review of a book ( **Arming America** by Michael Bellesiles) in a local newspaper. I have not actually read this book myself: > > (reviewer’s words) > > “Hardly anyone had a gun because they were too expensive and didn’t work. It was much easier and less time-consuming to chop off a chicken’s head for dinner than to try to shoot almost anything in the woods.” > > “There were few guns manufactured in America for anyone, even the militia, and few men knew how to shoot them. Since almost no one owned guns, there were few opportunities for practice. . . The result was a militia that was pretty much a joke.” > \*\* I don’t have the exact numbers but I remember reading in the latter part of the 18th Century there were 86 registered gunsmiths in Lancaster Co. Pa. alone. My only question would be, “Who were all these guys makin guns for?” I can see these being true statements if they were refering to 17th century Europe. ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2000, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-facts-about-our-usas-gun-culture/37825/62 "2000-10-29T16:34:01Z")
Don’t forget, a late-18th-century gunsmith didn’t have access to the mass-production technology available to a late-19th-century gunsmith. Each gun pretty much had to be made by hand back then. \ ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2000, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-facts-about-our-usas-gun-culture/37825/63 "2000-10-29T19:40:55Z")
Kenneth W. Royce (aka Boston T. Party) has come up with a “re-write” for the Second Amendment: “Neither Congress, nor the President, nor any State shall deny, infringe, regulate, or tax the absolute right of the people, in both their individual and collective militia capacities, to own, carry, and use weapons. Any congressional act, executive order, or State legislative act which would, under any guise or pretense, deny, infringe, regulate, or tax this cornerstone right is null and void at moment of passage, and may lawfully be, without risk of prosecution, ignored, or, if deemed necessary, forcibly resisted.” I like it. But I doubt Charles Schumer or Barbara Boxer would… ---
**Author:** ![Lizard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@Lizard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lizard)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2000, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-facts-about-our-usas-gun-culture/37825/64 "2000-10-29T20:33:17Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by stofsky \* > Damn, damn, damn! When am I finally going to keep that promise to myself to stop arguing with rabid anti-abortionists, gun nuts, racists, republicans, and fundies? \*\* I dunno. Maybe when you figure out that these are not all the same group? I am NOT: a racist a rabid anti-abortionist a republican (sic) a “fundie” I AM: a gun nut Heaven help us! ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2000, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-facts-about-our-usas-gun-culture/37825/65 "2000-10-30T04:18:12Z")
_A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed._ OK, I’ve been out of town for a while, but I just wanted to add one point: The first part of the Second Amendment, if I’m remembering Mrs Barbara Harmon’s 11th grade English class correctly, is a grammatical construct known as a **nominative absolute**. ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2000, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-facts-about-our-usas-gun-culture/37825/66 "2000-10-30T05:10:54Z")
**Mjollnir:** “Nominative Absolute”? Uhm…I got a D in High School English. 18 Years ago. Please elaborate. _ **ExTank** “Mostly Harmless :p”_ ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2000, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-facts-about-our-usas-gun-culture/37825/67 "2000-10-30T06:59:56Z")
The Nominative Absolute: [http://kids.infoplease.lycos.com/ipd/A0554621.html](http://kids.infoplease.lycos.com/ipd/A0554621.html) ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2000, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-facts-about-our-usas-gun-culture/37825/68 "2000-10-30T23:29:08Z")
I’ll buy that for a dollar. I hope for your sake you’re not expecting any money. _ **ExTank** “Mostly Broke :p”_ ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2000, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-facts-about-our-usas-gun-culture/37825/69 "2000-10-30T23:35:35Z")
In either case - be it a “nomitive absolute”, or a “dependent subject”, or a freakin’ “voovee dizzowamp” - I think half of the 2nd Amendment is absolutely clear: “The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.” No matter what talk anyone can bring up about militas (which is easily debunked) or rules of grammar, the latter half is clear as clear can be… clearer than most of the 1st amendment, IMOSHO. ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2000, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-facts-about-our-usas-gun-culture/37825/70 "2000-10-31T00:28:19Z")
Crafter\_Man wrote: > [@](#): > > Kenneth W. Royce (aka Boston T. Party) has come up with a “re-write” for the Second Amendment: Is this the same Boston T. Party who has published at least one patriot/sovereign-citizen book on how to, ahem, “legally” get out of paying income tax? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/interesting-facts-about-our-usas-gun-culture/37825.md?page=3)