# International Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [December 1, 2010, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553 "2010-12-01T16:47:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/361 "2010-12-16T17:31:39Z")
> [@special\_ed](#): > > I suppose travelling could be conidered a power since it is an action that can impact the game. > > Also, are we certain that the ICR have no incentive to lie? Did I miss something? (I honestly haven’t read all of the London Day 1 yet.) Or is it just an assumption that we are taking for fact just because it’s the safer assumption to make? I think we came to a general consensus that there was no correlation between travel and alignment, or travel and power, because either one would be pretty much game-breaking. So if travel is a null-tell, then there is no reason for Scum to not be truthful about it. Obviously we’re not absolutely certain, but I think there was general, in not necessarily unanimous, agreement on that subject. > [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > I think **Mahaloth** ’s question is different. We have evidence that there is not a direct correlation between travelling and being a power role but he is asking if there could be power roles who are required to travel in order to use their power: I think it’s pretty much a given that there are power roles that need to travel in order to maximize the use of their abilities; for example, detective and doctor types who would need to travel in order to reach their intended targets. Whether or not there are people who are required to travel in order to use their abilities at all…I can imagine some roles where a person would initiate an action that wouldn’t take effect until they had traveled to the other city, but who knows if such roles are in use. And Cookies has provided us with a role that can affect gameplay in a foreign city without requiring travel at all. > [@peekercpa](#): > > \ > > i was just kind of curious if anyone had the ability to initiate anything prior to **sach** ’s game state announcement. and i kind of figured that i would get the type of reply that i got. but yaneverknow. In (almost) every game of Mafia there is discussion prior to the ‘official’ start of the game. And every time, it is understood that “nothing happens” before the mod actually calls a start to the game. Why would you think this game was any different? ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/362 "2010-12-16T17:47:31Z")
Wow. I had a major net-split while typing up my post. Good thing I cached a copy. > [@Natlaw](#): > > If I would have to give a reason why it was ‘weak’ it would be because it a public one so it’s easy to fake. As others have pointed out all VT claims by town VTs are honest so the ‘some’ qualifier is a bit odd. I don’t think Lost Mafia was particular power role heavy so make a vanilla claim more suspect. What I intended to say was that IM not so valid opinion Scum may claim VT as well. > [@Natlaw](#): > > So the other think that stand out is an utterly confused **peeker** and some odd comments by **Scuba\_Ben**. So I’ll pick a bit more at that: > > > [@Scuba Ben](#): > > > > I don’t recall OTTOMH whether you had claimed anything, but I think you hadn’t. This is meaningful to me in that if we HAD had people start Today in transit to LHR, I would suspect one of the group of players-starting-in-transit would be ICR Scum. > > Why do you suspect that if there had been traveller(s) to London now Idle or Plankton should be scum? Just for the nice balance of things? 1. I meant to say that one of ALL the players starting in transit, including the set starting Wellington to London, would probably be Scum. As the sample size is only two, it would be utterly Gastard of the Mod to give us at the start a clear sub-group which is 50% Scum. But it is possible. So I consider this as no indication of Idle’s or Plankton’s sides. > [@special\_ed](#): > > Maybe Scuba Ben has a habit of saying things that I don’t correctly understand. But in post 288, he mentions that we can be objective towards London people and then can to us. As if we aren’t involved in the same game and don’t influence each other. Very odd. > > @Scuba, are you trying to say that London people shouldn’t take what Wellington people say as an attack or even bother defending against it? Or, what exactly are you trying to say? I think I’m trying to say that the two cities can analyze the other city’s posts calmer than they can analyze their own. I keep going back and forth on whether this is all one game or two sub-games. Now for my own analysis. I think **peeker** ’s vote in #303 is for almost no reason. Yeah, I’m suspicious of peeker’s vote. I’d like to see more explanation as to why. But there’s a bandwagon forming against em. Given my history with joining bandwagons – I usually get it wrong – I’ll be over here looking at other people for a while. That’s all I’ve got for now. I’ll do some more reading and see what I can figure out. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/363 "2010-12-16T17:48:02Z")
> [@Normal\_Phase](#): > > Forget tickles, how about a wedgie? > > I’d like to see where you’re going, if anywhere, with the dozen or so questions you asked in this post. Am anxiously awaiting your return to health. You are quite correct. While difficult to give myself a wedgie, it is not impossible. it does appear to be impossible to tickle myself. I have no plan of direction for the comments I made earlier. As I read through our Day, I just wanted to post my thoughts. We will see where those thoughts and others might lead me later on today when I’m home from work. I am feeling much much better today. I’m glad that I can at least ease your anxiety in that regard. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/364 "2010-12-16T18:50:55Z")
T12:00 post #250 Suburban Plankton(1): peekercpa(303) peekercpa(2): GuiriEnEspaña(347) Normal Phase(358) ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/365 "2010-12-16T18:54:25Z")
My mistake. I thought there were three votes on peeker. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/366 "2010-12-16T19:23:09Z")
I have a power and I can’t travel, though technically my empowered extra vote travels via the underbelly of the interwebs. It will be difficult to convince me that there are not players who’s only power payload is the ability to travel _and vote_ at another location. Again, this is based on what insight to the setup comes from having a traveling vote. It is not much of a stretch of the imagination to see how one extra vote can have a big impact for either side, and traveling to place such a vote also does not seem like a stretch. Especially if there are other players who either have and/or claim other powers but are apparently locked in one location, or power-house analyzers who are apparently locked in one location. Just don’t underestimate the travel-just-to-vote mechanic, is all I’m sayin’. ---
**Author:** ![Natlaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a88e57/32.png) [@Natlaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Natlaw)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/367 "2010-12-16T20:23:30Z")
> [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](#): > > I have a power and I can’t travel, though technically my empowered extra vote travels via the underbelly of the interwebs. It will be difficult to convince me that there are not players who’s only power payload is the ability to travel _and vote_ at another location. Aren’t you just describing the Dual Citizen? > [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > I meant to say that one of ALL the players starting in transit, including the set starting Wellington to London, would probably be Scum. As the sample size is only two, it would be utterly Gastard of the Mod to give us at the start a clear sub-group which is 50% Scum. But it is possible. So I consider this as no indication of Idle’s or Plankton’s sides. OK but then it’s more a generic statement of ‘if you take five players one of them is likely scum’ (regardless of travel). > [@peekercpa](#): > > _blink_ > > as near as i can tell we have two travelers so far, right? Pleonast has claimed (forced) traveler as well. Do you get why your reason to vote Plankton doesn’t make much sense? That he was in travel because the moderator but him there and not by taking some action himself and lying about it (what motivation has he to do that)? Why did you ignore the explanations of it? > [@peekercpa](#): > > i was just kind of curious if anyone had the ability to initiate anything prior to **sach** ’s game state announcement. and i kind of figured that i would get the type of reply that i got. but yaneverknow. So it was not related to Plankton at all anymore? I might as well give Scuba his bandwagon: **Vote peeker** ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/368 "2010-12-16T20:40:57Z")
Yes, I functionally described the Dual Citizen. I forgot it was listed as a sample role and thought people still might be having a hard time swallowing it because we have one claimed and one flipped but the flip didn’t refer to the the mechanics of the role. Which is moot because there is a sample role that I forgot about. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/369 "2010-12-16T21:12:00Z")
**Vote peeker** Peek has moved from trying to discern the detail of the setup to being distracting and, I think, intentionally sidetracking us. For me, that is good enough for a Day One vote. However, I think London needs to take a good look at Drain Bead. I still think her attempt to characterize people as coming out guns-blazing was wrong and potentially quite scummy. ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/370 "2010-12-16T21:26:38Z")
Sorry to have not posted as much as I usually do in games, I’ve been rather sick the last two days (and still ongoing). I have to say that Peeker is looking like the best vote since he’s making noises about the travelers possibly lying in some way. Since that includes me and I know I’m not lying, I couldn’t even begin to guess at his motives for wanting to cast suspicion. So **Vote Peekercpa**. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/371 "2010-12-16T21:56:55Z")
as usual the participants on this board go for a townie. i don’t know that this helps or hurts but the following is my pm. btw, i think it was on idles’s board that the oine sure scum tell was to vote for moi when i am town because for some reason that seems to be a real easy out. - 12-07-2010, 12:00 PM sachertorte Guest Join Date: Apr 2007 International Mafia * * * You are Peter. Citizenship: New Zealand and United Kingdom Win Condition: Arrest all members of the International Crime Ring You emigrated to New Zealand over 20 years ago, but still have ties to your city of birth, London. Your twin brother, Rufus (Astral Rejection), still lives in London. Despite the distance separating you, you know for a fact that Rufus is not a criminal. You are not eligible to travel. You begin the game in Wellington, New Zealand. \* and i guess it’s kind of par for the course. two of my favorite players are **story** and **sach** (i still like **story** better so don’t get a big head **sach** ). so to bust out early on their games is kind of not unexpected. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/372 "2010-12-16T21:58:30Z")
Ok fine. But I’m voting for him for the little magic bag he dangled after I claimed that he has yet to make good on, just to show that I’m a unique snowflake. **Vote peeker** ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/373 "2010-12-16T22:03:17Z")
and **sach** just so you know i thought emigrate and immigrate were basically synonomous and was primarily regional or cultural. but now i see that there is truly a distinction. ignorance fought. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/374 "2010-12-16T22:03:22Z")
Ninja claim. 😛 **Unvote peeker** If Astral claims him it makes things much more interesting, and if he doesn’t get claimed we can lynch him next cycle, since he’s not going anywhere. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/375 "2010-12-16T22:05:42Z")
Unfortunately I don’t think looking at your voters is going to be very fruitful for scum-hunting, though justification analysis may get closer to the mark. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/376 "2010-12-16T22:07:40Z")
I was hoping that \*\*peeker \*\*might come back and try explaining himself again, but since he hasn’t, I’ll go ahead and **vote peeker** as well. I can understand being confused about the unusual setup of this game, but I think he’s gone well beyond ‘confused’ and is now into ‘deliberately obtuse’ territory. A couple other items from Today that have caught my notice: > [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > Less for the record and more for analysis: I observe that everybody who started round 1A (NZ’s starting Night) in NZ was still here in the morning; nobody is presently in transit. This could be game balance, as half the players are here toDay. Or it could be people had a travel option but did not exercise that option. I blame the Mod. This is similar in tone to what peeker has been doing all day (which is probably why it rubbed me the wrong way)…it was pretty plainly pointed out in the setup and in the opening post how this game works. The reason that nobody is In Transit today seems quite clear to me: it’s because nobody in Wellington chose to travel last Night. I don’t see **Scuba\_Ben** feels a need to “Blame the Mod” for anything… > [@Natlaw](#): > > Related to that I would like to hear **Plankton** s and\*\* Idle\*\*s travel plans for the future. Plans can change of course with new info but I would like a baseline to compare it against (I might have skimmed it if they already laid this out earlier). > [@Natlaw](#): > > I agree that (especially in the end game) knowing who is going to be where in the coming Days is good to know. My reason to ask for ‘travel plans’ was however to be able to compare the reasons for travelling now with future explanations for (not) travelling. \*\*Natlaw \*\*seems to want **Idle** and I to divulge information, while not expecting the same from anyone else. I understand that we are the only two players known to have any sort of travel ability at this point, but I don’t like the idea that because of the setup of the game, we are expected to behave differently than everyone else. If Natlaw wants a mass-travel-plan claim, then he should say so, but I don’t link being singled out (doubled out?) for special treatment. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/377 "2010-12-16T22:09:08Z")
And of course the one time I forget to check for new posts on preview, I miss peeker’s claim…gimme a couple minutes to read through things and I’ll be back… ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/378 "2010-12-16T22:11:57Z")
neta: and i did consider redacting **astral** ’s name from my post in order to give him some cover. but shoot, since he is not scum i figured if you folks to decide to go through with this at least he is confirmed and IF their is a dick in london you don’t have to waste investigating him. btw, you could of course decide not to lynch my ass and then i will be confirmed town when london Day breaks and either he is dead and disclosed to be rufus or he can confirm me. so yeh, basically you folks are lynching a mason. way to go straight dope mafia players. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/379 "2010-12-16T22:15:10Z")
T12:00 post #250 Suburban Plankton(1): peekercpa(303) peekercpa(6): GuiriEnEspaña(347) Normal Phase(358) Natlaw(367) Mahaloth(369) Idle Thoughts(370) [del]ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies(372-374)[/del] Suburban Plankton(376) ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2010, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/380 "2010-12-16T22:18:59Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > so yeh, basically you folks are lynching a mason. way to go straight dope mafia players. **Unvote** **Peeker** , why haven’t you unvoted **Suburban**? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553.md?page=20)