# International Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [December 1, 2010, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553 "2010-12-01T16:47:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/81 "2010-12-07T18:19:29Z")
The game begins NOW. No need to confirm or wait for others to confirm. I never understood the need for confirmations so we’re not doing it. ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/82 "2010-12-07T18:19:38Z")
PM received! ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/83 "2010-12-07T18:32:39Z")
Well, I guess I’d better get up and stretch my legs…these long plane flights can be deadly, you know… I wonder if Idle is on the same flight as me? Bastard’s probably up in first Class… ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/84 "2010-12-07T18:44:29Z")
Sweet. Let’s get started! My first reaction upon seeing the sample role PMs that **sach** provided was that I would definitely start by voting for anyone traveling. Of the 3 roles, Vanilla could not travel, Dual Citizen could travel, and Scum could travel. Therefore, travelers have a higher percentage of being scum. Sadly for my theory, however, **sach** then clarified that the roles were samples only, and that not all Vanilla Town, Dual Citizen, or Scum roles need to be identical. So, it is possible that there are Vanillas who can travel, making travel currently a null tell. So it’s back to the usual Day One flailing about blindly/game mechanic speculation! ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/85 "2010-12-07T18:54:44Z")
PM received. And automatically, from ShadowFact’s post above, I want to point out that one could be Dual Citizen AND vanilla, because that’s just what I am. Dual Citizen alone. Your post, ShadowFacts, sounds like it’s making a difference between “Vanilla Town” and “Dual Citizen”. I think this would be a foolhardy assumption to make since the only role I got was “Dual Citizen”. So I think a better assumption would be: Some people who are not allowed to travel (those you call "Vanilla Town:) MAY have role powers (in which case, they wouldn’t be vanilla) and some people able to travel (those you call “Dual Citizens”) may not have any powers at all (in which case, they’d be “Vanilla Dual Citizens”), ---
**Author:** ![Natlaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a88e57/32.png) [@Natlaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Natlaw)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/86 "2010-12-07T19:06:17Z")
Wut! The amercians with their stupid War on Terrorism. How did the manage to convince the international community to enforce curfews at Night? /me skims the rules again, still doesn’t see any mention of it, sighs and goes to bed. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/87 "2010-12-07T19:21:20Z")
There’s a lot to digest for this game. I tend to agree with **ShadowFacts** that anyone travelling is immediately suspect. Without travel, we are essentially playing two separate mafia games, one at each venue. My first inclination is to let each venue deal with its own scum, since a killer must be at that location to kill there. Of course, those thoughts were disturbed when I received my role pm: > [@](#): > > You are an Agricultural Attache. > Citizenship: New Zealand > Win Condition: Arrest all members of the International Crime Ring > > Ah, New Zealand! Land of Sheep. > > You are strictly compelled to travel between the United Kingdom and New Zealand. Travel will occur after you have spent a full Night at your destination. The Dawn after you have spent a Night in a City you will spend Day of your current location traveling to your new location. You will be able to participate during that Day, but cannot vote. You will be able to vote at Dawn of your destination. > As an Attache, travel is compulsory. No action is required on your part. > > You begin the game in London, United Kingdom. As you can see, I automatically travel back and forth. However, I do think anyone who does travel will need to justify themselves. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/88 "2010-12-07T19:21:23Z")
Confirmed. Excited. See there is already a claim on the table. Woot. ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/89 "2010-12-07T19:31:10Z")
Oh, we can post PMs? In that case, here’s mine. Since I’m vanilla, I have nothing to hide. > [@](#): > > You are a Dual Citizen. > Citizenship: New Zealand and United Kingdom > Win Condition: Arrest all members of the International Crime Ring > > You may travel freely between the United Kingdom and New Zealand. Travel must be initiated (requested) during Night of your present location. Send a PM to the moderator with your intent to travel and you will spend the next Day of your current location traveling to your new location. You will be able to participate during that Day, but cannot vote. You will be able to vote at Dawn of your destination. > > You begin the game in transit to Wellington, New Zealand. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/90 "2010-12-07T20:04:00Z")
Here, but just had outpatient surgery this morning and am doped up. Should probably not post much, as it took me about three re-reads of sach’s game start post to figure out that **Idle** was, indeed, allowed to post. I should be fine by real-life tomorrow. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/91 "2010-12-07T20:37:37Z")
I’m still trying to wrap my head around the travel rules…but the way I see it anyone who is traveling is immune from lynching; is that correct? Travel begins at Dawn (Departure City) and ends at Dawn (Destination City). Voting can only occur during the Day, and is only effective in the City where voting occurs. So if a person is in transit _out of_ your City and you vote for them, they won’t be around to lynch come Dusk. And if the person is in transit \*to \*your City, then it’s Night (from your perspective) while they are traveling, so you can’t vote for them in the first place. Which, I suppose, is one reason to be suspicious of a person who does a lot of traveling. And please accept my apologies if this has been blatantly obvious to everyone else for the last week. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/92 "2010-12-07T20:42:24Z")
A travelling player is immune to immediate gaoling, but their destination can do it once their Day breaks. I think anyone who flees a venue for something incriminating will be quickly gaoled at the other. ---
**Author:** ![Rin\_Twisted](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/82dd89/32.png) [@Rin\_Twisted](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rin_Twisted)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/93 "2010-12-07T21:29:52Z")
I’m at work and can’t post much for a few hours, but I don’t think you can avoid gaoled by trying to travel, right? You’d be gaoled before you got to travel, I’m assuming. Cause otherwise, it’s not fair. Scum could just stay in the air that way. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/94 "2010-12-07T21:48:16Z")
> [@Rin\_Twisted](#): > > I’m at work and can’t post much for a few hours, but I don’t think you can avoid gaoled by trying to travel, right? You’d be gaoled before you got to travel, I’m assuming. Cause otherwise, it’s not fair. Scum could just stay in the air that way. No, Scum couldn’t stay in the air, because whenever you travel you land at Dawn local time. Travel is a Night action, so once you land you will need to spend a full Day/Night cycle in your current city before you can leave again at Dawn the following Day. You are therefore subject to gaoling during the Day and also to Mafia Kill at Night before you can take to the air again. Travel ‘protects’ you for one Day, but also takes away your ability to vote during that Day. It also effectively causes you to skip a Night, because once you land you begin a new Day in your new City. I’m not sure yet when that would be considered a ‘good’ thing, and when it’s a ‘bad’ thing… ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/95 "2010-12-07T22:32:20Z")
So, let me see if I have this straight. When Plankton and I land…it will be Day for just the two of us, but Night for everyone else? ---
**Author:** ![MHaye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bbe5ce/32.png) [@MHaye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MHaye)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/96 "2010-12-07T22:53:29Z")
> [@Idle\_Thoughts](#): > > So, let me see if I have this straight. When Plankton and I land…it will be Day for just the two of us, but Night for everyone else? That’s not what I understand, no. When you land, it will be Dawn in Wellington. Everyone listed as being in Wellington, including yourself and Suburban Plankton, will start a new Day. I think. I haven’t reread the rules since being killed in the Castle and committing to this game. I probably should. ---
**Author:** ![Rin\_Twisted](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/82dd89/32.png) [@Rin\_Twisted](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rin_Twisted)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/97 "2010-12-07T23:08:51Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > No, Scum couldn’t stay in the air, because whenever you travel you land at Dawn local time. Travel is a Night action, so once you land you will need to spend a full Day/Night cycle in your current city before you can leave again at Dawn the following Day. You are therefore subject to gaoling during the Day and also to Mafia Kill at Night before you can take to the air again. I think we are actually saying the same thing, only you said it more clearly. Anyway I agree with what you said. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/98 "2010-12-07T23:16:25Z")
So, how do we do this? I have to assume that there are scum on both sides of the world, and travel is going to make things interesting. A mass claim is frankly just going to make my head hurt right now, but I am not totally sure where to dig in. Maybe we can get a count of people who have dual citizenship? It’s not like we aren’t going to notice travelers when they travel anyway and it will give us some place to start digging into the mechanics of the game. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/99 "2010-12-07T23:20:48Z")
I don’t think dual citizenship matters as much as who can travel. Perhaps everyone should state whether or not they can travel? I don’t think that gives any indication about alignment or vanilla-ness. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2010, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553/100 "2010-12-07T23:28:00Z")
Any sort of ‘mass claim’ is actually impossible at this point, as we have 9 players who are prohibited from posting until next Monday (those for whom it is currently Night in Wellington). For that matter, a mass claim will be impossible at any point, because there will always be a number of people in the ‘Nighttime’ city that will be unable to post. The only way to make such a claim work would be for half the players (more or less) to claim during their Daytime, and then have the other half follow up 12 Hours later. I think this would be even harder to accomplish than a ‘traditional’ mass claim. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/international-mafia/562553.md?page=6)