# Internnational Exchange Program or a Scam? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 8, 2003, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732 "2003-02-08T18:23:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Kat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b19c9b/32.png) [@Kat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kat)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2003, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/61 "2003-02-09T21:14:57Z")
Er…I very much doubt the comment "And yes, I see your point. I just happen to think it is ridiculous. " would net someone a warning in most of the SDMD forums, much less in the Pit. ---
**Author:** ![samarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4da419/32.png) [@samarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samarm)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2003, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/62 "2003-02-09T21:15:14Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by OpalCat > And yes, I see your point. I just happen to think it is ridiculous. You then said: > [@](#): > > "A nice way of phrasing that would be ‘And yes, I see your point. I just happen to disagree.’ > > There is no need to be rude." This is called expressing an opinion. In the BBQ pit, rude is a little stronger than this. You will know all about it when someone is rude to you, trust me (maybe sooner than you think, the way this is going). 🙂 **OpalCat** is right, stop being so sensitive! ---
**Author:** ![Melandry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Melandry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melandry)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2003, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/63 "2003-02-09T21:17:40Z")
Yes, while you’re here maybe you should read some other BBQ Pit threads to gain some perspective on how politely you’ve been handled so far… ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2003, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/64 "2003-02-09T21:21:47Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jeanster \* > \*\*A nice way of phrasing that would be ‘And yes, I see your point. I just happen to disagree.’ \*\* Well, but I don’t just disagree. I think your suggestion was ridiculous. And I said so. ---
**Author:** ![GingerOfTheNorth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/cdc98d/32.png) [@GingerOfTheNorth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GingerOfTheNorth)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2003, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/65 "2003-02-09T21:40:10Z")
Being that this is the pit, she _could_ have said “And yes, I see your point. I just happen to think it is ridiculous, you goat-felching turd-burglar.” Also being that this is the pit, even if you reported it to a moderator, nobody would care. It’s probably a good thing to grow a skin if you’re going to spend any time around here. ---
**Author:** ![tiny\_ham](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@tiny\_ham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiny_ham)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2003, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/66 "2003-02-09T21:48:47Z")
GingeroftheNorth is a smelly, fish headed dorkwad. ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2003, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/67 "2003-02-09T21:56:18Z")
If I may chime in ( 😉 ) I’d say it sounds more like one of those ever-popular timeshare sales events they do. You know what you’re getting into, you know it’s going to cost money, but at times the marketing ploys are a bit over the top, and there is often a lot of pressure to get you to sign before you walk out the door. Scam? Well, not really, because you do get what you pay for. Ethical? That’s up to the buyer to decide (and beware). Esprix ---
**Author:** ![RedDevil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/3ec8ea/32.png) [@RedDevil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedDevil)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2003, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/68 "2003-02-09T22:27:19Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by OpalCat \* > \*\*I have neither flamed you nor called you any names. I think perhaps you meant to post this at the [Sunshine Lollypop Forum](http://www.sunshinelollypopforum.com)? \*\* To think, I actually clicked on this link. Ho hum. ---
**Author:** ![GingerOfTheNorth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/cdc98d/32.png) [@GingerOfTheNorth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GingerOfTheNorth)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2003, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/69 "2003-02-09T22:34:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jarbabyj \* > \*\*GingeroftheNorth is a smelly, fish headed dorkwad. \*\* **jarbabyj** ’s lemon bars smell like twat. ---
**Author:** ![samarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4da419/32.png) [@samarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samarm)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2003, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/70 "2003-02-09T22:37:26Z")
I don’t know what that means, but it sounds vaguely sexual. ---
**Author:** ![samarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4da419/32.png) [@samarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samarm)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2003, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/71 "2003-02-10T00:35:53Z")
**Opal** , I just spotted **jeanster** ’s post here: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=127730&pagenumber=5](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=127730&pagenumber=5) …which would explain why she stopped posting in this thread. Oh well, seems you really offended her! ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2003, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/72 "2003-02-10T00:54:26Z")
ROFL!!! Eh… apparently disagreeing with her = “goading her into an argument” Does she really think that a mod is going to come scold me? I’m so confused. Does she have _any idea at all_ where she is, who we are, and what we’re like? WHY is she even here? Has she ever read one of Cecil’s columns?! She’d probably scold him and sic the mods on him, too, for being so rude. ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2003, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/73 "2003-02-10T01:28:54Z")
Agressive marketing does not make something a scam. A scam means the vendor does not deliver what they promised. The fact that a good or service is ridiculously expensive and agresively marketed does not mean it is a scam. The fact that I would not pay for something does not mean those who choose to pay for it are being scammed. To say something is a scam because they told you “you are special” is just stupid. I get emails every day saying “you have been specially selected” and they are just deleted as a matter of course. A person who believes he got his money’s worth is _not_ the victim of a scam. ---
**Author:** ![CadburyAngel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c2a13f/32.png) [@CadburyAngel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CadburyAngel)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2003, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/74 "2003-02-10T01:50:10Z")
I don’t see above (although it will magically appear as soon as I post this) any mention of how old the “Student Ambassadors” in question are. I only bring it up because my younger sister and I received those letters a few years back: she was 13 and I was 16. We didn’t cling to our parents and wail until they allowed us to go. We glanced at the letters, shrugged, and tossed them out. Why? Well… 1.) The letter was clearly a form letter which made no mention of any accomplishments that would have earned us this opportunity. So we knew it was, if not a scam, then not some benevolent organization keeping extensive files on promising students. 2.) The letters were addressed to non-existent people: just two names that she and I used when we had a suspicion that they would be sold to mailing lists. Looks like we were right. (We got a third one a year ago, too, for another alias.) I’m looking forward to spending my junior year of college in Dublin at Trinity. But I understand that I will have to work extremely hard to get there, and shouldn’t take it for granted. Any child over 13 or so should be aware of mailing scams (not that P2P is one), and realistic enough not to be heartbroken if they don’t get to travel abroad before they’ve learned to drive. It sounds like a good program to participate in, but it is a business at the end of the day, and it seems to employ slighty questionable marketing techniques. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2003, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/75 "2003-02-10T02:36:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jeanster \* > \*\*I am aware this is the BBQ Pit. It is just unfortunate that you choose to conduct yourself in such a manner that calls for others to have to grow thicker skins and not be so touchy about things. Is it so difficult for you to conduct yourself in a manner that cannot be seen as rude? > > I have conducted myself here without resorting to any flaming or name-calling or casting aspersions on the characters of the other members. It is unfortunate that you choose not to do so likewise. > > If you continue to conduct yourself this way, I will report you to the moderator. \*\* and report what, pray tell? the item you quoted may have struck you as snippy or not friendly, certainly not warm and fuzzy, but it was well within the rules of this (and most other forums here) forum. You’re of course free to complain about anything you wish, but realistically complaints are generally reserved for actual rule breaking (in normal situations). None of us are required to **like** everyone else here. or agree w/everything that’s said. In this forum in particular, you’re likely to get some ‘in your face’ bluntness. I concur w/the other suggestions to you to read some other flame fest threads. On your OP - I see it as aggressive marketing, not a scam. A scam (by my defination) would invovle not recieving money’s worth, or some distinct dishonesty about the service being provided. I see this as similar to the “Who’s Who in US (fillintheblank)” (I got offered it as a High school student, as a college student and as a director of an agency). the amount for the trip sounds about right for a lengthy stay in a foreign country, and the potential worth is of course, a personal judgment each parent should make, along w/ the ‘can we afford this’ . ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2003, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/76 "2003-02-10T06:10:09Z")
The dishonesty here is that People to People is portraying itself as a selective academic organization and that participation in it will “mean something” on, say, a college application. There are plenty of parents out there that will do anything to give their kid an academic advantage. I grew up a gifted kid in a poor area. My mom scrimpt and saved to send me to science camp and other extracirricular academic programs, because the only way I was going to get out of the ghetto was to take advantage of every oppertunity I got- even if it wasn’t really affordable. I looked in to being am exchange student when I was in middle school. I wrote all kinds of letters to all kinds of programs- includeing People to People. When I got their brochure, I knew something was off. It was too slick. I don’t think I ever even showed it to my mom. But what if I had? And what if my mom had the naiveity to believe that People to People was a prestigious academic program? She could have very easily spent money she barely has and could have spent on real programs for a fun and only slightly overpriced vacation. This program preys on people who have high hopes for their children and will do anything to help them achieve. In most cases the parents have plenty of money to throw around, so no harm done. But in some cases it can lead to a poorer, more disillusioned bright kid. ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2003, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/77 "2003-02-10T23:41:20Z")
Seems to me that stuff like that probably would mean something on a college application. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2003, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/78 "2003-02-11T00:29:08Z")
It is known that this group has the potential “Ambassador” go through an essay process and an interview, but do we have any evidence that a student who has managed to raise the money has _ever_ been turned down because the essay or interview didn’t turn out all right? I’m wondering if this is something akin to submitting poetry to a vanity house poetry “contest” and being told that the submitter has “won” the right to have their poem published in a book that they have to pay for(that fact being that everyone who pays the moolah gets to be published as long as they agree to buy the book.) ---
**Author:** ![Rick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9f8e36/32.png) [@Rick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2003, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/79 "2003-02-11T01:07:25Z")
Before everyone gets too worked up about this company using mailing lists, I might remind you that the person brought this up is Jeanster, who has been wrong about everything else concerning People to People. (see her 4th post) In my daughter’s case she was nomiated by one of her teachers. I think 4 kids in her class got these letters. So if they are working off a mailing list, they aren’t buying a very complete one. does anyone have a cite that proves that these people work off a mailing list? ---
**Author:** ![CadburyAngel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c2a13f/32.png) [@CadburyAngel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CadburyAngel)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2003, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732/80 "2003-02-11T01:34:46Z")
This is a big moment for me as a Baby Doper - somebody asked me for a cite - and I can’t provide. Shame and anguish are mine. Basically, Rick, I’m assuming that they work from a mailing list because they weren’t able to come up with our actual names, just the ones that we (and our parents, when filling out stuff for us) use for stuff like club cards, online temporary sign-up deals, and so on. We’ve never used aliases when applying for scholarships, taking PSATs/SATs/SAT IIs, etc., so wherever they got their information from, it wasn’t an academic institution. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/internnational-exchange-program-or-a-scam/153732.md?page=5)