# Introducing you to the latest fibber... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 15, 2002, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818 "2002-04-15T20:38:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/41 "2002-04-17T01:13:53Z")
“Voice of Reason.” And we all know how much sway that has with the “OMG, they’re _different_ than us!” crowd. ---
**Author:** ![Jervoise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d2c977/32.png) [@Jervoise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jervoise)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/42 "2002-04-17T03:10:07Z")
Wow. **Monty’s** flailing about with the “liar” paintbrush again. Such confidence. Such righteousness. But careful mate, that brush has a way of slipping outta your grasp, eh? But he’s probably correct, this time around. Good on ya. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/43 "2002-04-17T03:24:06Z")
Just out of curiosity-what IS so bad about the World Book Encyclopedia? ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/44 "2002-04-17T03:58:59Z")
Go to Hell, Narrad. ---
**Author:** ![kuroashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e9a140/32.png) [@kuroashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kuroashi)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 5:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/45 "2002-04-17T05:52:27Z")
I’d just like to say again that this is the silliest complaint in a while. Your hangups on words is annoying. That you opened a thread to declare somebody a fibber because they called you on your hangup is even more annoying. Bad kitty! ---
**Author:** ![Jervoise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d2c977/32.png) [@Jervoise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jervoise)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/46 "2002-04-17T07:48:15Z")
Sorry **Monty** , I take that back. In fact, you are not correct. I apologise for giving the impression that you were in fact spot on in labelling **Angelslantern** a fibber. **Angelslantern** is a bigot. Wrong-headed about your religion and afflicated with a terminally closed-mind. Poor at referencing and crap debater. Call the poster up on these things. Defend your faith. Start a pit even. I’ll cheer you on the whole way. But please don’t get carried away with another round of liar, liar, pants on fire. It makes you look like a damn fool. **Guinastasia** : I think the World Book encyclopaedia is frowned upon because it is chiefly the research tool of lower school students. Which, quite possibly, **Angelslantern** is. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 10:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/47 "2002-04-17T10:01:19Z")
As opposed to your postings, hey Narrad? FTR, I couldn’t care less how you consider me. I obviously don’t have much respect for your opinion. I’ve provided evidence for what I said in my OP. kuroashi: Here’s a concept–try knowing what you’re talking about before talking about it. Your last posting above isn’t in that category. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/48 "2002-04-17T12:02:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > I don’t understand why fundamentalist Christians need to dispute with the LDS over matters of faith. They’re afraid we’re right. \ ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2002, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/49 "2002-04-17T14:26:49Z")
> [@](#): > > All right, Andros, after you die, I’m going to make you a member of the Church of Scientology. No worries, **SPOOFEr**. . . just don’t make me a Republican. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![kuroashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e9a140/32.png) [@kuroashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kuroashi)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2002, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/50 "2002-04-18T05:19:53Z")
Are you accusing me of NOT KNOWING WHAT I’M TALKING ABOUT? Alright, I ventured a guess the you don’t like it when people use the word “cult” for an otherwise respectable “religion.” Am I wrong? The whole damn point of Angelslantern’s argument was that the two words are closer in meaning than most care to admit, and if you ain’t in, there’s a tendancy for the thing to be seen negatively. I’m saying I think you have a hangup. I know that’s what I think, so don’t tell me I don’t know what the hell I’m talking about. Go start a religion or something ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2002, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/51 "2002-04-18T13:09:16Z")
Ah, justification for prejudice. How, er, quaint must be the word I’m looking for. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2002, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/52 "2002-04-18T14:42:47Z")
> [@](#): > > The whole damn point of Angelslantern’s argument was that the two words are closer in meaning than most care to admit, and if you ain’t in, there’s a tendancy for the thing to be seen negatively. But it’s a stupid argument based on a willful miuse of the word “cult.” Cults are small, shadowy groups that use thought control and manipulation to hold their adherents in thrall, for example, the Heaven’s Gate suicides, Jim Jones and the Peoples’ Temple, David Koresh and the Branch Davidians all can be classified as cults. The LDS is a worldwide religion beleived in by millions of people, and I submit that calling them a cult is meant as an insult. If you want to engage the Mormons on the validity of their faith, namecalling isn’t the way to go about it. You could, however point out that Joseph Smith’s fantasy of Jews founding pre-Columbian societies has absolutely no archeological evidence to support it and a wealth of evidence to contradict it. If you’re going to tackle a bleief system, you can only really form a solid argument based on falsifiable statements. Questions of faith, however, like the existence of God, the preexistence of souls, and baptism of the dead, are really not amenable to resolution through debate. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2002, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/53 "2002-04-18T18:37:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > But it’s [referring to Angelslantern’s postings in the thread linked in the OP here] a stupid argument based on a willful miuse of the word “cult.” Agreed. Moreover, it’s a willful switching from one definition of a particular word to another in an attempt to discredit the object of attack. > [@](#): > > Cults are small, shadowy groups that use thought control and manipulation to hold their adherents in thrall, for example, the Heaven’s Gate suicides, Jim Jones and the Peoples’ Temple, David Koresh and the Branch Davidians all can be classified as cults. Works for me. IIRC, the LDS never used “thought control and manipulation to hold their adhereints in thrall.” On the contrary, free will has always been a very big part of the LDS theology. > [@](#): > > The LDS is a worldwide religion beleived in by millions of people, According to the membership distribution listed on [http://www.lds.org](http://www.lds.org), there are over eleven million LDS members on Planet Earth. > [@](#): > > and I submit that calling them a cult is meant as an insult. As I said in the thread in question: > [@](#): > > Seeing as that poster already provided the evidence that the LDS Church is not a cult, the only reason left for that very same poster to declare it a cult is prejudice. Therefore, your submission is obviously correct. > [@](#): > > If you want to engage the Mormons on the validity of their faith, namecalling isn’t the way to go about it. Exactly. > [@](#): > > You could, however point out that Joseph Smith’s fantasy of Jews founding pre-Columbian societies has absolutely no archeological evidence to support it and a wealth of evidence to contradict it. And we could respond with the same concerns regarding biblical archeological evidence, physical impossibilities, etc. > [@](#): > > If you’re going to tackle a bleief system, you can only really form a solid argument based on falsifiable statements. Questions of faith, however, like the existence of God, the preexistence of souls, and baptism of the dead, are really not amenable to resolution through debate. Again, exactly. gobear: Damn, you’re good. Not only that, you’re damn good. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2002, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/54 "2002-04-18T19:18:49Z")
Not to mention, that by **Angelslantern** ’s overly broad definition, ALL religions are cults. We all have unusual practices and beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2002, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/55 "2002-04-19T03:56:43Z")
> [@](#): > > Not to mention, that by Angelslantern’s overly broad definition, ALL religions are cults. Which means either, A: the word “religion” is useless and should be abandoned, B: the word “cult” is useless and should be abandoned, or C: one of the words should have its definition altered slightly. I would contend that C: has already happened… to the word “cult”. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2002, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/56 "2002-04-19T06:05:44Z")
Especially since AL said, “Since X does y & z, then it’s a cult by definition j.” When proven that it does not do y & z, AL responded with “Well, according to definition r, it is.” That’s a pretty poor debating stance, and it is dishonest. ---
**Author:** ![Angelslantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@Angelslantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Angelslantern)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2002, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/57 "2002-04-20T23:09:24Z")
Wow I was just told about this 30 minutes ago… Monty what an absolute child you are… You have to start a new thread to discredit, slam ,bash to try to win your little debate. Look at how far you have gone…My goodness, does your mommy know that you are playing with the computor again. She would spank your childish ass for presenting this kind of nonchristian attitude. You mentioned English classes, you need growing up classes. Hopefully when you get through puberty you will understand what a childish prank this was. If you cant debate properly, and with out resorting to this kind of low stunt…why dont you find something else to waste your time with. Honestly son…just when I thought Id seen it all Would Jesus approve…Slander…telling others to go to hell…you display a very sinful character… Is the best that LDS has to offer. I could go on my chid how ever it is probably time for your mommy to change your childish ass. You have greatly degraded your self and your little mind group of friends with this one…How ever I understand your type and foregive you bcause foregivness is all that I can offer you. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2002, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/58 "2002-04-21T00:01:32Z")
Well, gee, Lantern, mommy dearest…exactly when do you expect to start teaching that which you cerainly can’t do? That is: proper debate. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2002, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/59 "2002-04-21T00:03:15Z")
BTW, punk. I’m not your son. & now that you’ve gotten that out of your system, care to actually address the points (all of them valid, btw) made in the OP? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2002, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818/60 "2002-04-21T00:35:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SPOOFE \* > \*\*C: one of the words should have its definition altered slightly. > \*\* \ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/introducing-you-to-the-latest-fibber/103818.md?page=4)