# IPA in the SDMB **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [August 9, 2016, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291 "2016-08-09T23:55:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2016, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/1 "2016-08-09T23:55:44Z")
A 4-year-old thread ( [Spell My Name With An Eth: Why is ‘Odin’ pronounced like it is?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=655922) ) was recently revived to discuss the use of the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA) on the SDMB. As far as I can see, this issue was last discussed here about 10 years ago ( [We should use an IPA replacement system to talk about phonetics](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=401452) ). There are strong opinions on both sides: I lean towards using IPA as unambiguous and fairly easy to find information on, starting with the [Wiki article](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Phonetic_Alphabet) and the [official website](https://www.internationalphoneticassociation.org/content/ipa-chart), but others object to having to read the obscure symbols of IPA. So let’s find out what SDMB members with a poll: Do you like the use of the IPA to explain pronunciation on the SDMB? ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/2 "2016-08-10T00:08:22Z")
I don’t think IPA usage should be mandated but I reserve the right to giggle behind my hand at people trying to compare pronunciations without using IPA or X-SAMPA or another phonetic notation system. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/3 "2016-08-10T00:30:02Z")
IPA means “India Pale Ale.” Any other definition is suspect. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/4 "2016-08-10T00:32:29Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > IPA means “India Pale Ale.” Any other definition is suspect. The explosive proliferation of this medicinal-tasting ‘beer’ is suspect. ---
**Author:** ![Backwater\_Under\_Duck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ba8739/32.png) [@Backwater\_Under\_Duck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Backwater_Under_Duck)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/5 "2016-08-10T00:39:03Z")
Snort! ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/6 "2016-08-10T01:28:40Z")
If you were interested in being unambiguous, I should think you’d have bothered to inform the unknowing what IPA means here. We can’t all be as cool and ‘inside’ as you, after all! ---
**Author:** ![fachverwirrt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@fachverwirrt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fachverwirrt)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/7 "2016-08-10T01:41:09Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > If you were interested in being unambiguous, I should think you’d have bothered to inform the unknowing what IPA means here. > > We can’t all be as cool and ‘inside’ as you, after all! Like the part where he defined it in the OP, or the part where he linked to multiple articles on the subject? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/8 "2016-08-10T02:51:29Z")
Do these various systems define the same set of sounds? Can’t one system be translated another with a simple function? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/9 "2016-08-10T03:46:01Z")
> [@fachverwirrt](#): > > Like the part where he defined it in the OP, or the part where he linked to multiple articles on the subject? Yeah, WTF is that about? Pretty clearly written OP and leaves no mystery to the reader. Better than 99.9% of threads on this board that have abstruse acronyms. Anyhow, I voted the third option. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/10 "2016-08-10T05:15:08Z")
I voted “prefer” because I do, but sometimes in the flow of a thread I just can’t be arsed, especially when the thread has already gone down a non-IPA “sounds like ‘pen’. _Do you mean ‘pen’ or ‘pin’?_” rabbit hole. I feel dragging IPA into a thread like that would just show everyone else up 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/11 "2016-08-10T10:52:52Z")
If you want to be clear and unambiguous about pronunciation, when communicating to others who care about clear and unambiguous pronunciation, there’s really no substitute for using a system designed for that, and IPA is the most widespread and broadly understood such system. However, there are also a lot more people who don’t know IPA (including myself), and for such people, IPA provides no understanding at all. So the best practice is to simply give the pronunciation twice, once using IPA and once using more familiar phonetics, with the understanding that any ambiguity in the familiar phonetics is resolved by the IPA. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/12 "2016-08-10T12:39:03Z")
IPA is easily learned by elementary-school children (cite: my nephews.) If only it were a regular part of the curriculum. It’s day one (know it on day two; we’re not going over this again) of any intro to linguistics class. Anyone who understands its utility, is interested in discussing pronunciation, and refuses to understand it is deliberately ignorant and should not be accommodated. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/13 "2016-08-10T12:50:44Z")
I try to give pronunciations in both IPA and ad-hoc means, but I know the latter creates tremendous ambiguity, especially in a diverse forum. I don’t think IPA should be mandatory, but anyone who is interested in discussing pronunciation should learn it and use it—it takes only a matter of an hour or two to master the basic symbol set for common English sounds. It is simply not realistic to expect that there be any kind of enlightening conversation on these boards about pronunciation without using IPA. As for people who actually object to IPA—so far as I’m concerned, they’re not interested in fighting ignorance. ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/14 "2016-08-10T13:30:53Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > I try to give pronunciations in both IPA and ad-hoc means, but I know the latter creates tremendous ambiguity, especially in a diverse forum. > > I don’t think IPA should be mandatory, but anyone who is interested in discussing pronunciation should learn it and use it—it takes only a matter of an hour or two to master the basic symbol set for common English sounds. > > It is simply not realistic to expect that there be any kind of enlightening conversation on these boards about pronunciation without using IPA. > > As for people who actually object to IPA—so far as I’m concerned, they’re not interested in fighting ignorance. I **strongly** object to the IPA. It’s like Esperanto, but much, much worse. It’s an artificial answer to a problem that can be solved by many other means. The idiots who came up with the system were lucky that stupidity was not a crime, because they had lethal levels of stupidity. ---
**Author:** ![Kron](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kron/32/12444_2.png) [@Kron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kron)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/15 "2016-08-10T13:51:36Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > I **strongly** object to the IPA. > > It’s like Esperanto, but much, much worse. It’s an artificial answer to a problem that can be solved by many other means. The idiots who came up with the system were lucky that stupidity was not a crime, because they had lethal levels of stupidity. I agree (as those participating in the other thread already know). There is a reason that such a small minority of people in the world actually know and use IPA, despite its 130-ish years of existence. It does have its place- I can see it being an indispensable tool for linguists. But for your average Joe (and, I would argue, a majority of your above-average Joes), it provides little to no practical benefit. ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/16 "2016-08-10T14:50:57Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > IPA means “India Pale Ale.” Any other definition is suspect. IPA was brewed so it could withstand the long trip to India. As such it’s something less than fulfilling. I don’t know what is taken out, but I basically don’t like it. It’s crap beer that only a peasant would find appealing, think Coors Light. I’m sure others prefer a decent porter or stout, but to insist the teeming millions stick to IPA is just … well … just so American … no offense intended. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/17 "2016-08-10T15:06:43Z")
5 sentences, and 4 of them are completely wrong. That might be a new record for ATMB. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/18 "2016-08-10T15:28:43Z")
ʌv kɔrs wi ʃʊd juz «IPA» tu post sʌtʃ θiŋgz. Its ∂ǝ stændɚd ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/19 "2016-08-10T15:33:21Z")
I voted for “Some other opinion, which I will explain,” so I suppose it behooves me to explain it. I do not know IPA, and my immediate perception is that it would require more effort than I am willing to expend to learn it. I come here to enjoy myself; NOT, as a general rule, to find PITA chores that take away from my time enjoying myself. Anyway, if you drink enough IPA, _everything_ sounds like _blth, nthl ggggglllrrr_… ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2016, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291/20 "2016-08-10T15:43:17Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > ʌv kɔrs wi ʃʊd juz «IPA» tu post sʌtʃ θiŋgz. Its ∂ǝ stændɚd Translated into English: “_Of course we should use IPA to post such things. It’s the standard._” It took me fully ten minutes to figure out how to translate that. Not the most productive ten minutes of my life (in terms of enjoying my time on the Dope). Maybe if there was an online IPA-to-English translating utility we could copy and paste to. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ipa-in-the-sdmb/762291.md?page=2)