# Iran: More sanctions now or wait? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 19, 2013, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300 "2013-11-19T22:23:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 44
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2013, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/861 "2013-12-28T17:49:54Z")
I have growing doubts Riga will answer anyone’s questions, all while demanding answers to his own. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2013, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/862 "2013-12-28T18:17:09Z")
Very odd double post. Never mind. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Riga\_Marole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riga_marole/32/7316_2.png) [@Riga\_Marole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riga_Marole)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2013, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/863 "2013-12-29T04:38:36Z")
> [@Riga\_Marole](#): > > The same thing that distinguishes the degree of grey between black and white. It depends on how black and how white your extremes are. As there hasn’t been any response to this post I assume no one understood it … or perhaps you think it’s just crazy or off the wall. Next to Hitler and Stalin, Reagan and Bush Jr. seem liberal. So building a bomb or threatening to use it or actually using it cannot be deemed liberal, hard line, hawkish, or moderate unless it is put into real time context. The bottom line is that Iran has all of them, just as any other. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2013, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/864 "2013-12-29T05:40:08Z")
Yay, everything’s relative, so there’s no need to blame anybody. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2013, 10:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/865 "2013-12-29T10:56:37Z")
> [@Riga\_Marole](#): > > The same thing that distinguishes the degree of grey between black and white. It depends on how black and how white your extremes are. So they are distinguishable to moderates in the USA and EU member nations and our moderates so to speak would have due cause to be alarmed at a real perception that the extremist hardliners are in control of the government in Iran and thus control of whether or not Iran will build a nuclear bomb that could threaten the flow of one critical resource from that part of the world. Do you think the Carter Doctrine is an extremist hardline doctrine that is solely in response to the moderates position inside Iran who want the peaceful use of nuclear power and nothing to do with making a bomb? Apparently moderates in Iran are now on record as accepting the 5% enrichment level. So why should the international community ignore the Iranian hardliners who must be the only ones who demand that enrichment go beyond the 5% level? ---
**Author:** ![Princess\_Perfume](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/princess_perfume/32/16518_2.png) [@Princess\_Perfume](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princess_Perfume)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2013, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/866 "2013-12-29T11:37:28Z")
I wasn’t around for 1979 but a lot of the problem seems to be that many USians refuse to forgive Iran for 1979 and many Iranians refuse to forgive the USA for 1953. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2013, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/867 "2013-12-29T14:03:25Z")
January 2015: Iran announces that it has 100+ uranium A-bombs. So what? how does this change anything? Israel and Iran now have MAD capacity. The Iranian leadership knows that an atomic attack means suicide. I really don’t see how much changes. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2013, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/868 "2013-12-29T15:52:41Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > Apparently moderates in Iran are now on record as accepting the 5% enrichment level. So why should the international community ignore the Iranian hardliners who must be the only ones who demand that enrichment go beyond the 5% level? Because the hard-liners are the ones who actually control the government, perhaps? I have no problem recognizing that the majority of the country would swing to a moderate position if left to their own devices. However, on the one occasion that it looked as though moderates might actually gain a majority in the Assembly, the Council of Guardians stepped in to disallow over 1600 of those candidates and the three foremost opposition leaders were all placed under house arrest and not permitted to conduct campaigns. And since the Supreme Leader has veto power over the selection of the cabinet, both the executive and legislative bodies are always controlled by hardliners. Regardless whether hardliners are a genuine majority or a self-selected majority of those wielding power, hardliners are the ones who make actual policy. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2013, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/869 "2013-12-29T22:49:47Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Because the hard-liners are the ones who actually control the government, perhaps? I have no problem recognizing that the majority of the country would swing to a moderate position if left to their own devices. However, on the one occasion that it looked as though moderates might actually gain a majority in the Assembly, the Council of Guardians stepped in to disallow over 1600 of those candidates and the three foremost opposition leaders were all placed under house arrest and not permitted to conduct campaigns. And since the Supreme Leader has veto power over the selectioni of the cabinet, both the executive and legislative bodies are always controlled by hardliners. > > Regardless whether hardliners are a genuine majority or a self-selected majority of those wielding power, hardliners are the ones who make actual policy. I agree. The west should be concerned. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2013, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/870 "2013-12-29T23:06:25Z")
Concerned… with extreme prejudice? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2013, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/871 "2013-12-30T00:22:41Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > January 2015: Iran announces that it has 100+ uranium A-bombs. So what? how does this change anything? Israel and Iran now have MAD capacity. The Iranian leadership knows that an atomic attack means suicide. > I really don’t see how much changes. Kind of hard to threaten a suicide bomber. That and it’s tough to do a forensic examination of nuclear shell casings. ---
**Author:** ![Riga\_Marole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riga_marole/32/7316_2.png) [@Riga\_Marole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riga_Marole)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2013, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/872 "2013-12-30T07:00:44Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > So they are distinguishable to moderates in the USA and EU member nations and our moderates so to speak would have due cause to be alarmed at a real perception that the extremist hardliners are in control of the government in Iran and thus control of whether or not Iran will build a nuclear bomb that could threaten the flow of one critical resource from that part of the world. I can agree with that. > [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > Do you think the Carter Doctrine is an extremist hardline doctrine that is solely in response to the moderates position inside Iran who want the peaceful use of nuclear power and nothing to do with making a bomb? I don’t consider myself knowledgeable enough to make even a guess. Anyway, as I was saying, the shades of black and white weren’t the same and I’d venture to guess that over-throwing the American puppet regime of the Shah might have been looked upon as a liberal policy by Iranians at the time … all things considered. > [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > Apparently moderates in Iran are now on record as accepting the 5% enrichment level. So why should the international community ignore the Iranian hardliners who must be the only ones who demand that enrichment go beyond the 5% level? For reasons of their own agenda? They shouldn’t. For reasons of peace, stability and humanitarian concerns however, they should instead work towards constructing an environment whereby Iran doesn’t feel the need to have a bomb - and stop feigning indignance. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2014, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/873 "2014-01-13T01:39:29Z")
[Iran agrees to uranium limits.](http://nypost.com/2014/01/12/iran-agrees-to-uranium-limits-in-deal-with-world-powers/) ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/874 "2014-01-14T23:09:10Z")
The righties are on fire having their new cause for calling for Obama impeachment. The deal with Iran is getting to be too much for talk radio armchair generals. Do we have any here? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/875 "2014-01-14T23:18:13Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > The righties are on fire having their new cause for calling for Obama impeachment. A good point… except that nobody appears to have called for Obama’s impeachment because of Iran. But don’t let that stop you from telling us how great Obama is! ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/876 "2014-01-15T00:14:53Z")
The real problem Obama has is the numerous Democrats in the Senate who really, really want to approve more sanctions now, although they wouldn’t trigger unless Iran defaults on the deal. The Republicans, of course, are lined up against him, and there isn’t much he can do about that. But he should be able to put a leash on the Senators in his own party. More schmoozing is in order. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/877 "2014-01-15T01:32:31Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > A good point… except that nobody appears to have called for Obama’s impeachment because of Iran. > > But don’t let that stop you from telling us how great Obama is! I think the deal with Iran is great. Let it play out. Those favoring derailing it are on an all out blitz to drive Obama into deeper disapproval territory as an appeaser, blame America, Muslim sympathizer. So unless you think Obama, and his Secretary of State(s) have screwed up foreign policy so badly that he (they) deserves to have lost public approval, I would expect you’d have some concern about the effectiveness of those dedicated to destroying his legacy as well as the Iran deal. Do you have concern or has Obama not been good (Approvable) on Foreign policy overall. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/878 "2014-01-15T01:46:17Z")
Still missing the point. You throw out talk of impeachment, and there is none relating to the subject of this thread. Typical. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/879 "2014-01-15T02:30:05Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > I think the deal with Iran is great. Let it play out. Those favoring derailing it are on an all out blitz to drive Obama into deeper disapproval territory as an appeaser, blame America, Muslim sympathizer. Really? You think 16 Democratic Senators are “on an all out blitz to drive Obama into deeper disapproval territory as an appeaser, blame America, Muslim sympathizer”? That would be… extraordinary. But you believe that? ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300/880 "2014-01-15T03:52:49Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Really? You think 16 Democratic Senators are “on an all out blitz to drive Obama into deeper disapproval territory as an appeaser, blame America, Muslim sympathizer”? That would be… extraordinary. > > But you believe that? No I don’t think any Democrats are doing that. Why ask such an extraordinarily silly question? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300.md?page=43) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-more-sanctions-now-or-wait/674300.md?page=45)