# Iran shoots down U.S. aircraft over international waters. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 20, 2019, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812 "2019-06-20T16:27:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/201 "2019-06-22T18:57:58Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Let the record note that I’ve asked the simple question several times, and you won’t provide a clear answer whether a country under sanctions is justified to use violence to resist them. Why can’t you answer it clearly? Seems like a yes, no, usually, or sometimes are all clear answers that you could provide. It’s isn’t a simple question; it’s a “gotcha” question. I’ll answer if you’ll answer some of mine, tho: which sanctions? How long have they been in effect? What effects have they had on the target country? Your question is a bullshit question designed to get someone to say something you can attack with glee and ease, IMO. Here’s an analogy: I move 4 100’ long x 40’ tall walls 1 foot closer to your house every day. I start a mile away. On the first day, are you justified in using force to stop me? How about on the 5000th day? :dubious: Are you ever justified in using violence against me? I mean, I’m not touching you… ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/202 "2019-06-22T18:59:04Z")
Trump on Twitter: “We are putting major additional Sanctions on Iran on Monday.” ---
**Author:** ![GreenWyvern](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greenwyvern/32/2834_2.png) [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/203 "2019-06-22T19:15:48Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > A short war in which the U.S. destroys the Iranian air force and navy, and degrades the Iranian military, until the point at which Iran is prepared to sign a new deal on U.S. terms, may not be that painful for Saudi Arabia. Dream on! :rolleyes: America’s ‘quick and easy’ war in Iraq would be like a Sunday picnic compared to a war with Iran. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/204 "2019-06-22T19:29:40Z")
Will rephrase later ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/205 "2019-06-22T19:30:08Z")
> [@GreenWyvern](#): > > Dream on! :rolleyes: > > America’s ‘quick and easy’ war in Iraq would be like a Sunday picnic compared to a war with Iran. The Iraq War was a land invasion, with the aim of changing the regime. If the aim is a limited war with Iran to force them to sign a new nuclear deal - I think a more likely aim than regime change for Trump - then that might not even involve a single American (or Saudi etc) boot on Iranian soil. For the Saudis, the Houthis are an Iranian proxy, so from their point of view, they are already in an indirect military war with Iran. A direct war with Iran would, for the Saudis, mean an extension of an existing war, not starting a new one. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/206 "2019-06-22T19:56:45Z")
I agree with Walken: if we go to war with Iran, I don’t think it’s going to be with the aim of occupation. Who in the hell knows what happens after the first shot is fired. I do expect it to be devastating for Iran’s regime and its civilian population. I think Bolton and Pompeo have a very Curtis LeMay view of warfare. Maybe I’m wrong and are capable of more restraint than I give them credit for but I’m cynical given their history up to this point. But however badly we level Iran, there are always surprises in a war, and things we simply don’t anticipate. I have no idea how this conflict would unfold. All I know is we’re dangerously close to finding out, and it doesn’t have to be this way. ---
**Author:** ![GreenWyvern](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greenwyvern/32/2834_2.png) [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/207 "2019-06-22T19:58:23Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > The Iraq War was a land invasion, with the aim of changing the regime. If the aim is a limited war with Iran to force them to sign a new nuclear deal - I think a more likely aim than regime change for Trump - then that might not even involve a single American (or Saudi etc) boot on Iranian soil. For the Saudis, the Houthis are an Iranian proxy, so from their point of view, they are already in an indirect military war with Iran. A direct war with Iran would, for the Saudis, mean an extension of an existing war, not starting a new one. The US already had a nuclear deal with Iran - which the US tore up. The US could easily reinstate that deal any time. Sorry, but this is out of touch with reality. A conflict with Iran could never be so neat and limited. The Strait of Hormuz would be closed indefinitely to all shipping, just for a start. Iran can do this at will with mines and small attack boats (invisible to radar), and nobody can prevent it. Neither Saudi Arabia, nor Russia, nor China, nor any other country wants this. It would probably cause a world-wide economic recession. See [What a War With Iran Would Look Like](https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/iran/2019-06-04/what-war-iran-would-look) > [@](#): > > In one scenario, all these escalatory pressures set off a larger conflict. The United States sinks several Iranian ships and attacks a port and military training facilities. Iran drops mines and attacks U.S. ships in the Persian Gulf. Iranian proxies kill dozens of U.S. troops, aid workers, and diplomats in the region, and Iranian missiles strike U.S. bases in Bahrain, Saudi Arabia, and the UAE, causing limited damage. At every turn, Iran tries to save face by showing resolve but stopping short of all-out war; Washington, intent on “reestablishing deterrence,” retaliates a little more aggressively each time. Before long, the two have tumbled into full-scale hostilities. … > > Iran’s military is soon overwhelmed, but not before mounting a powerful, all-out counterattack. It steps up mining and swarming small-boat attacks on U.S. forces in the Persian Gulf. Missile attacks, cyberattacks, and other acts of sabotage against Gulf oil facilities send global oil prices skyrocketing for weeks or months, perhaps to $150 or more per barrel. Iran launches as many missiles as it can at U.S. military bases. Many of the missiles miss, but some do not. Iran’s proxies target U.S. troops in Afghanistan, Iraq, and Syria, and Iranian-backed Houthi rebels in Yemen increase their rocket attacks against Saudi Arabia. Iran may even attempt terrorist attacks on U.S. embassies or military facilities around the globe—but will likely fail, as such attacks are difficult to execute successfully. > > Israel might get drawn into the conflict through clashes with Hezbollah, the Shiite militant group and political party in Lebanon. Iran has tremendous influence over Hezbollah and could potentially push the group to attack Israel using its arsenal of 130,000 rockets in an attempt to raise the costs of the conflict for the United States and one of its closest allies. Such an attack will likely overwhelm Israel’s Iron Dome missile defense system, leaving the Israelis with no choice but to invade Hezbollah’s strongholds in southern Lebanon and possibly southern Syria. What began as a U.S.-Iranian skirmish now engulfs the entire region, imposing not only devastating losses on Iran’s leadership and people but serious costs in blood and treasure for the United States, Israel, Lebanon, the Gulf states, and other regional players. [The Iran War: Consequences for US regional allies](https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20190526-the-iran-war-consequences-for-us-regional-allies/) > [@](#): > > As a first step, Tehran is expected to directly target US military assets, such as the aircraft carriers and warships deployed in the Gulf, without engaging Saudi Arabia or other US allies in its vicinity. On 25 May, a day after the Pentagon’s confirmation of plans for troop surge in the Middle East, Morteza Ghorbani, a senior advisor to the Commander-in-Chief of the Revolutionary Guards Hossein Salami, warned that in the event of armed confrontation, IRGC will sink US aircraft carriers with missiles or “new top-secret weapons”. > > Yet, once initiated, a military conflict is unlikely to remain limited to an exclusively Iranian-American exchange of fire for a number of reasons. If anything, the mysterious sabotage assaults on Saudi and Emirati tanker ships in the Gulf, carried out with explosive charges and widely attributed to the IRGC or its proxies, were meant to send a “costly signal” that Iran’s pro-US neighbours could easily fall prey to any escalation of tensions. > > “Both Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates have played a significant role in trying to bring Iran’s crude exports down to zero, so their tankers and oil pipelines were targeted,” a Tehran-based intelligence analyst affiliated with the Revolutionary Guards told MEMO, referring to the Houthi drone attacks against the Aramco East-West pipeline and oil stations in Saudi Arabia on 14 May. > > The high likelihood of conflict expansion is partly due to the fact that US-allied Gulf Arab states host American military bases and forces, which will become natural targets if they are used, directly or indirectly, to carry out strikes against positions on the Iranian territory. > > “Iran will undoubtedly show no mercy to any of them if war erupts, but that is going to follow a process too: Tehran will wait for a ship or fighter jet or missile to pass through their territory or airspace so it can take the development as an unmistakable instance of hostile collaboration and therefore target the collaborating state legitimately,” the IRGC-affiliated intelligence analyst explained. > > But this is not the only reason why an Iranian-American conflagration will likely spread into the wider area and affect US regional allies as well. Absent a powerful air force as a consequence of long-standing isolation and international sanctions, Iran has mastered the art of irregular warfare and developed a military strategy that emphasises asymmetric fighting against a supposedly superior enemy. Since its best strengths lie in such methods of warfare, Tehran will resort to the kind of retaliation where its chances of inflicting damage are best, and this likely means dragging neighbouring states into the fight. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/208 "2019-06-22T20:00:07Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > Trump on Twitter: “We are putting major additional Sanctions on Iran on Monday.” Trump is quite obviously displeased with Iran’s relatively mild response to the recent American provocations. Kind of a not so passive but still aggressive ante upping on Trump’s part. He’ll get them to react the way he and his hope! Just you wait and see! :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/209 "2019-06-22T20:47:06Z")
> [@GreenWyvern](#): > > The US already had a nuclear deal with Iran - which the US tore up. The US could easily reinstate that deal any time. > > Sorry, but this is out of touch with reality. A conflict with Iran could never be so neat and limited. The Strait of Hormuz would be closed indefinitely to all shipping, just for a start. Iran can do this at will with mines and small attack boats (invisible to radar), and nobody can prevent it. Neither Saudi Arabia, nor Russia, nor China, nor any other country wants this. It would probably cause a world-wide economic recession. > > See > > [What a War With Iran Would Look Like](https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/iran/2019-06-04/what-war-iran-would-look) > > [The Iran War: Consequences for US regional allies](https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20190526-the-iran-war-consequences-for-us-regional-allies/) I don’t disagree with any of that. The U.S. and its allies would win a conventional war, but the Iranians would fight back asymmetrically, and use their proxies/allies across the region to cause chaos. Who knows where that might lead. For the Saudis, though, which is what the original point was about, a war against Iran would significantly weaken their arch-rival. It is also something that could be executed by the U.S - the most powerful military on the planet - with little military involvement by the Saudis themselves. It could also help end the war that they are currently in - the Yemeni Civil War - which has been going on for four years and shows no sign of resolution. Here are Saudi Arabian casualties and losses in the Yemeni Civil War to date (via Wikipedia): 1,000-3,000 soldiers killed 10 captured 3 aircraft lost 9 helicopters lost 20 M1A2S lost 1 frigate damaged These are losses that the Saudis have directly received as a result, they likely perceive, of Iranian support for the Houthis. Yet the Saudis have only been able to retaliate against their proxies, the Houthis, and not directly against Iran. I would be surprised if there are not hawks in Saudi Arabia, and I also have no doubt that MBS is determined to achieve victory in Yemen. ---
**Author:** ![Declan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecae2f/32.png) [@Declan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Declan)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/210 "2019-06-22T21:48:04Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Trump is quite obviously displeased with Iran’s relatively mild response to the recent American provocations. Kind of a not so passive but still aggressive ante upping on Trump’s part. He’ll get them to react the way he and his hope! Just you wait and see! > :smack: He has one card that he can play with Iran and that was not worth playing over a downed drone that was coming up to the end of its service life before SLEP. I don’t understand why people don’t get this, Congress is not going to pay for a foreign war under current conditions. Bolton may want regime change to the exclusion of everything else, to everyone else its simply a crisis to good to waste. Its better to avoid direct military confrontation while ramping up psy-ops. Take the play book from Able Archer and adapt to current times. Between B-52 squadron size elements and carrier alpha strikes , should create quite favorable circumstances. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/211 "2019-06-22T21:58:23Z")
There’s lots of other things he could do. He could EASE sanctions. He could try, with his feeble mind, to negotiate a nuclear compromise like we had before he destroyed it. Those are just two off the top of my head. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/212 "2019-06-22T22:20:11Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I agree with Walken: if we go to war with Iran, I don’t think it’s going to be with the aim of occupation. What goal would that be then ? As has been already stated, the US already had a mutually agreed nuclear deal, and could probably get something similar back without killing people (not to mention, going to war to coerce people into making deals isn’t exactly Einstein. When you want people to negociate with you, do you start by punching them in the mouth ? And if so, do you expect them to respect the piece of paper you forced them to sign ?). Blow shit up until some civil war happens ? Great idea, ISIS wasn’t enough… ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/213 "2019-06-22T22:37:06Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > What goal would that be then ? I really don’t know, Kobal2. That’s a mystery to me. So they blow half the country to bits, and then…what? And how would Iran retaliate? And how we would retaliate to their retaliation? I get the impression that as poorly planned out as the Iraq adventure was that there’s even less planning for this conflict, and I would submit that Iran’s a stiffer challenge than Saddam. It seems that the theory floating around right wing nutter regime change circles is that if there’s anything left in Iran to govern, we can install dissident groups once the current government is obliterated. One of the leading contenders for that prize is an exile group called “MEK”, which actually helped Saddam Hussein in his war with Iran. Doesn’t seem like there’s been much serious thought put into any of this, which is understandable in the case of Trump, but it’s inexplicable that he has hardly any senior advisers who’ve really gamed this out either. It’s literally the Fox Newsroom running the Departments of Defense and State. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2019, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/214 "2019-06-23T02:52:28Z")
Well this all sounds good and properly thought through. When has obliterating the popular leadership of a nation, funding “friendly” paramilitary groups and letting chaos run its course ever gone wrong or backfired, except that one time ? No, no that time, I’m talking about _that_ time… though I suppose that other time too. Huh… I’ll get back to you. ETA : actually, come to think of it (although this could be a whole 'nother debate I suppose), when has forceful regime change fostered by a foreign interest \*ever \*worked ? I suppose the colonial era would count, but they were a net negative on most if not all accounts (yes, including economic) ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2019, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/215 "2019-06-23T02:58:42Z")
My fear is that when the shit hits the fan, Trump and the GOP won’t just take their frustration out on his foreign adversaries, but even more so, his domestic ones. Presidents have a history of expanding executive power during times of foreign conflict and crises. Exactly why that hasn’t registered with a single fucking person in this country yet…is a sad commentary on the state of American “democracy”. ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2019, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/216 "2019-06-23T03:17:23Z")
“I don’t want to kill 150 people” I’ve never heard a president since Carter express that sentiment. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2019, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/217 "2019-06-23T04:19:23Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > It seems that the theory floating around right wing nutter regime change circles is that if there’s anything left in Iran to govern, we can install dissident groups once the current government is obliterated. One of the leading contenders for that prize is an exile group called **“MEK”** , which actually helped Saddam Hussein in his war with Iran. Doesn’t seem like there’s been much serious thought put into any of this, which is understandable in the case of Trump, but it’s inexplicable that he has hardly any senior advisers who’ve really gamed this out either. It’s literally the Fox Newsroom running the Departments of Defense and State. Iranian news outlets [are reporting](https://www.tehrantimes.com/news/437297/Leaked-Audio-Shows-Saudi-MKO-Collusion-over-Tanker-Attacks) on audio which they claim shows that the [MEK/MKO](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People%27s_Mujahedin_of_Iran) and Saudis colluded over the tanker attacks. The MEK have [links with various high-profile US politicians](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/jul/02/iran-mek-cult-terrorist-trump-allies-john-bolton-rudy-giuliani) - John Bolton and Rudy Giuliani have both spoken at MEK rallies calling for regime change in Iran. > [@](#): > > It was only in 2012 that the US delisted [MEK] as a terrorist group. But the arrival of John Bolton, the MeK’s most powerful advocate, as US national security adviser has given the group unprecedented proximity to the White House and a new lease of political life. Obviously needs to be treated with a skeptical eye, but it at least adds another party to the suspects list for the oil tanker attacks. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2019, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/218 "2019-06-23T15:34:34Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > ETA : actually, come to think of it (although this could be a whole 'nother debate I suppose), when has forceful regime change fostered by a foreign interest ever worked ? I suppose the colonial era would count, but they were a net negative on most if not all accounts (yes, including economic) Not that I think this is analogous, but off the top of my head Japan and Germany both spring to mind where forceful regime change fostered by a foreign power worked fairly well. 😛 Personally, I don’t think regime change in this case would work if fostered by an outside power. It’s got to come from inside. Just like in North Korea and China, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Philster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/13edae/32.png) [@Philster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Philster)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/219 "2019-06-24T12:19:45Z")
So, what are we saying here? Iran is trying to prompt President Trump into war or other retaliations and they couldn’t do this (regardless of drone location, cost, publicity, etc). Iran has failed to manipulate President Trump. That’s the gist of it. Also, predictions as tension rose, as Iran became more provocative, would be that President Trump would be provoked, yet he hasn’t been. Ok. Cool. ---
**Author:** ![PitJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e9bcb4/32.png) [@PitJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PitJ)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812/220 "2019-06-24T13:10:23Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > There’s lots of other things he could do. He could EASE sanctions. He could try, with his feeble mind, to negotiate a nuclear compromise like we had before he destroyed it. Those are just two off the top of my head. As a non-US citizen it is not up to me to say yay or nay to anything that Bernie Sanders voices, but what I heard coming from him today sounds like a totally new and interesting and worth pursuing point of view. It went along the lines of “why should the US spend billions of Dollars in a never ending fight in the middle east between Iran and Saudi Arabia? We should rather work towards those two getting together and sorting it out between themselves.” The only thing the US might look after would IMO be the safety of Israel so that it doesn’t get caught in the middle of these arch-enemies should they decide to slug it out. Is it only about oil? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iran-shoots-down-u-s-aircraft-over-international-waters/835812.md?page=12)