# Iraq Vet thoughts on Afganistan **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 19, 2011, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644 "2011-07-19T23:39:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2011, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/41 "2011-07-21T13:34:19Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Did they fly planes into NYC skyscrapers? Not last time I checked, but their attack on American soil was significantly more destructive. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2011, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/42 "2011-07-21T14:37:38Z")
> [@villa](#): > > Not last time I checked, but their attack on American soil was significantly more destructive. It was a joke. ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2011, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/43 "2011-07-21T14:58:42Z")
I had never heard of **scabpicker** before, but he mounts a cohesive argument. ---
**Author:** ![PurpleHeart07](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ec9cab/32.png) [@PurpleHeart07](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PurpleHeart07)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/44 "2012-08-02T20:44:49Z")
> [@Capitaine\_Zombie](#): > > What made you think you were joining a Supehero team when, in fact, you were just joining the US Army? Haha I know right! Like it was a five man team or something. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/45 "2012-08-02T21:02:52Z")
My youngest cousin, a Marine, was one of those killed in Afghanistan. I don’t think it was worth it. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/46 "2012-08-02T21:16:31Z")
Serious question, **askeptic** : are you drunk right now? ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/47 "2012-08-02T21:18:01Z")
You all do realize this thread is over a year old right? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/48 "2012-08-02T21:42:20Z")
I did not realize that. In fairness, I’m drunk. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/49 "2012-08-02T23:23:27Z")
Would you sacrifice a drunk zombie for Afghanistan? ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/50 "2012-08-03T00:01:28Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > The Taliban doesn’t give a shit one or the other about the US. They will fight us in their country, but not outside it. Al Queda was a small entity that we chased out of Afghanistan a long time ago. The longer we stay in Afghanistan, the more we feed al Queda’s recruiting process and the more we get Pakistani militants pissed off at us. They are a much bigger danger to The West than anyone in Afghanistan. This. A thousand times over. I simply don’t understand why in a site dedicated to fighting ignorance, we keep hearing over and over the “official line” of the supposed dangers presented by the fuckin’ Taliban. As I’ve written in many posts, I certainly have no love lost for those savages, but by the same token they simply don’t give a shit about anything that goes on beyond their sphere of control. Not the first time I’ve posted this cite, but perchace someone will bother reading it this time: [**Taliban Commander: ‘At least 70 Percent Of The Taliban Are Angry At Al Qaeda’**](http://thinkprogress.org/security/2012/07/11/514484/taliban-angry-al-qaeda/) Beyond that, there are copious articles all over the place detailing the (huge) difference in scope of the two groups. As for Pakistani radicals…once again, read what **John** said. There’s your potentially **real** powder keg. _:::sigh:::_ Doubt any of this will make a dent with the dittoheads… ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/51 "2012-08-03T14:06:50Z")
Once again, **THIS THREAD IS OVER A YEAR OLD!** ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/52 "2012-08-03T14:09:11Z")
Dude, your account here isn’t even a year old. ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/53 "2012-08-03T14:11:38Z")
> [@Kimballkid](#): > > Once again, **THIS THREAD IS OVER A YEAR OLD!** Can someone make it A FUCKING BIRTHDAY CAKE!! ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/54 "2012-08-03T14:27:50Z")
I still think our efforts there were worthwhile, despite the lives lost. Its a shame that we had to waste so many other lives, resources, etc in Iraq…how much faster could we have wrapped up Afghanistan if all those troops were there instead of in iraq? ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/55 "2012-08-03T15:51:08Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > I still think our efforts there were worthwhile, despite the lives lost. Its a shame that we had to waste so many other lives, resources, etc in Iraq…how much faster could we have wrapped up Afghanistan if all those troops were there instead of in iraq? What makes you think any number of troops could ‘wrap up’ Afghanistan. Newsflash: however many troops stayed however many years Afghanistan would revert to its normal state of brutal civil war on Bugging Out Day +1. ‘Our’ side - the brutal, torturing, raping, drug-dealing, corrupt klepocratic warlords vs The Fanatics. And when enough of the former see a way to make a buck by changing sides the latter will win. Like what happened last time. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/56 "2012-08-03T15:55:36Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > What makes you think any number of troops could ‘wrap up’ Afghanistan. > > Newsflash: however many troops stayed however many years Afghanistan would revert to its normal state of brutal civil war on Bugging Out Day +1. I don’t think that’s the only certain outcome. ---
**Author:** ![Moonlitherial](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4bbf92/32.png) [@Moonlitherial](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moonlitherial)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/57 "2012-08-03T16:22:30Z")
I can’t believe that this thread sat here for a year and no one noticed that this: > [@Mince](#): > > If I’m gonna get my balls blown off for a word, my word is “poontang”. would be a little counterproductive although I suppose that would depend on the order of operations ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/58 "2012-08-03T17:58:19Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > I still think our efforts there were worthwhile, despite the lives lost. Its a shame that we had to waste so many other lives, resources, etc in Iraq…how much faster could we have wrapped up Afghanistan if all those troops were there instead of in iraq? > [@tagos](#): > > What makes you think any number of troops could ‘wrap up’ Afghanistan. > > Newsflash: however many troops stayed however many years Afghanistan would revert to its normal state of brutal civil war on Bugging Out Day +1. > [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > I don’t think that’s the only certain outcome. Perhaps not. But it’s the way to bet. Your point about the idiocy behind shifting the focus to Irag is well-taken, though. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/59 "2012-08-03T18:04:35Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Perhaps not. > > But it’s the way to bet. > > Your point about the idiocy behind shifting the focus to Irag is well-taken, though. It’s all going to hinge on how well we arm and train the Afghani government and their security forces/police. And if the Afghani government can keep corruption within its ranks to a minimum. I do expect that there will always be places in the mountains and whatnot where extremists/warlords/tribal shit will be going down, but if the new government can hold down the population centers then they will have a shot at a legit, operational and civilized modern government. I mean…look at what keeps happening to these poor girls/women that keep getting attacked with acid in their faces and whatnot just because they want to go to school. They keep going back. Once the floodgates of civilization are opened over there, and people get a little taste of some modernity and its trappings, there will be too many people that want a better way of life for the Taliban or whomever to keep under their collective thumbs. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644/60 "2012-08-03T18:26:48Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > I do expect that there will always be places in the mountains and whatnot where extremists/warlords/tribal shit will be going down\*\*, but if the new government can hold down the population centers then they will have a shot at a legit, operational and civilized modern government.\*\* > > I mean…look at what keeps happening to these poor girls/women that keep getting attacked with acid in their faces and whatnot just because they want to go to school. They keep going back. Once the floodgates of civilization are opened over there, and people get a little taste of some modernity and its trappings, there will be too many people that want a better way of life for the Taliban or whomever to keep under their collective thumbs. Amazing and astonishing ignorance about just about every thing of Afghan and Afghani society, culture terrain and Afghanistan’s history in general. Afghanistan is not Iraq, it is not an urban country, control of the urban centers has never has much relevance to who is actually in charge of the country. You need to control the mountain passes (the last time a central government has those under control was circa 1800) and the roads and have the loyalty of the tribes in that region. NATO does not have any of that and there is no way the any puppet government with an army with is majority non Pashtun is going to be able to do so. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iraq-vet-thoughts-on-afganistan/589644.md?page=4)