# Irish Dopers: Is "Jap" a racial slur in your country? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 20, 2004, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072 "2004-04-20T19:10:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![calm\_kiwi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9fc348/32.png) [@calm\_kiwi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/calm_kiwi)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/21 "2004-04-21T07:25:08Z")
I’m not sure if Americans suffer from the same need to shorten everything. It seems to be almost compulsory in some parts of the world. Here people probably wouldn’t refer to a Japanese person as a Jap, but as a significant proportion of the vehicles sold in NZ are second hand from Japan they are always refered to as “Jap imports”. When you buy a car you ask “Is it NZ new or a Jap import?” (it affects the price). This is in no way meant as an offensive term. Australians are always Aussies. The English are always Poms. Americans are always Yanks. None of these are meant in an offensive way. Hey we call ourselves Kiwis! A nocturnal, flightless, fairly unattractive and endangered bird and we love to be called Kiwis. Auckland’s harbour bridge (built in the late 50’s) orginaly had only 2 lanes. When traffic demands found the bridge lacking, more lanes were prefabricated in Japan and added to the bridge. They were locally known as the “Nippon Clip Ons”, they still are. just wanted to say as it is the 21st here and will be there tomorrow that this is credit cardless me’s last night of posting. Be afraid! I will remain addicted though 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 7:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/22 "2004-04-21T07:45:00Z")
> [@calm kiwi](#): > > Australians are always Aussies. The English are always Poms. Americans are always Yanks. None of these are meant in an offensive way. Hey we call ourselves Kiwis! A nocturnal, flightless, fairly unattractive and endangered bird and we love to be called Kiwis. O.K., but again, it’s not the fact that a nickname is used _in and of itself_ that makes something offensive. So all that you just said is irrelevant. The only thing that’s relevant is whether “Jap” is offensive, and I gather from your second paragraph that in your country, it’s acceptable to use it for inanimate objects. So I’m suspecting that the same is probably true in Ireland, although we still haven’t heard from very many Irish dopers. > [@](#): > > Auckland’s harbour bridge (built in the late 50’s) orginaly had only 2 lanes. When traffic demands found the bridge lacking, more lanes were prefabricated in Japan and added to the bridge. They were locally known as the “Nippon Clip Ons”, they still are. “Nippon” is not an offensive word. In fact, it’s the Japanese word for Japan. (Although it’s pronounced Nee-pone or Nee-hone, so rhyming it with “clip on” maybe could be offensive - I don’t know). “Nip”, however, IS an offensive word, at least in the U.S. ---
**Author:** ![zoogirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b9bd4f/32.png) [@zoogirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoogirl)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/23 "2004-04-21T08:00:10Z")
I’m usually pretty PC but oddly enough, I don’t think twice about calling Manderin oranges “Jap oranges.” Of course they’re only around at Christmas. Stranger still, I notice they’re mostly from China these days! ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/24 "2004-04-21T08:27:02Z")
Well as I said in the other thread Jap is used IME when talking about cars or bikes. The one Japanese person I knew was either called by his name or referred to as the Japanese guy I knew. Nip on the other hand is offensive. ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/25 "2004-04-21T08:28:40Z")
> [@ruadh](#): > > A couple years ago an Irish chat show host used the word and it caused quite a bit of controversy, although he seemed unaware himself that it was offensive. So I’d say that it’s recognised as a racial slur by some people but not by all. > > **yojimbo** is definitely not a person to knowingly use a racial slur btw. Who was the chat show host. Never heard of this and I’m a tv junkie. Thanks BTW 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/26 "2004-04-21T08:28:41Z")
> [@zoogirl](#): > > Stranger still, I notice they’re mostly from China these days! Erm, you should know that “Mandarin” has little, nay, to be honest, allmost nothing to do with Japan. Mandarin is a major Chinese dialect. That a tree named after it’s Chinese origin grows in China should not be a suprise to you, even if it also grows in Japan. ---
**Author:** ![calm\_kiwi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9fc348/32.png) [@calm\_kiwi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/calm_kiwi)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/27 "2004-04-21T08:28:59Z")
> [@blowero](#): > > O.K., but again, it’s not the fact that a nickname is used _in and of itself_ that makes something offensive. So all that you just said is irrelevant. The only thing that’s relevant is whether “Jap” is offensive, and I gather from your second paragraph that in your country, it’s acceptable to use it for inanimate objects. So I’m suspecting that the same is probably true in Ireland, although we still haven’t heard from very many Irish dopers. > > “Nippon” is not an offensive word. In fact, it’s the Japanese word for Japan. (Although it’s pronounced Nee-pone or Nee-hone, so rhyming it with “clip on” maybe could be offensive - I don’t know). “Nip”, however, IS an offensive word, at least in the U.S. I would imagine that Irish-English and Kiwi-English are closer then “Yank”-English and Irish-English. That aside, does it matter where the person comes from? I am telling you that the terms “Jap bike” or “Jap car” are not offensive HERE. Possibly it is an offensive term in America. Just be aware it isn’t everywhere else, Ireland or not. Nippon was used earlier in the thread as an example. In NZ Nippon and Clip on DO rhyme…you know why? Cause this is NZ. We have had our clip ons for 30-ish years. I wasn’t suggesting that Nippon was an offensive term (though I have NEVER heard it mentioned here unless it was about the rhyming clip ons). I was suggesting the overly sensitive might see the rhyming as offensive, Well done for you that you only corrected my accent and didn’t take offense. ---
**Author:** ![curly\_chick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ba0ec/32.png) [@curly\_chick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curly_chick)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 9:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/28 "2004-04-21T09:48:19Z")
I’ve lived in Ireland for more than 20 years and what I think you have to remember is that Ireland is not a multicultural society. Not yet, anyway. Words are used here which are considered racist by people who don’t live here and which could cause serious offence in other places. Surely that is self evident from the very fact that this thread was started? In Ireland a sambo is a sandwich, but my Mother is English and she thinks that’s an awful, awful word as it was one of the many words that was used to describe the black immigrants from the Carribean who went to England she when she was a young woman, in the 50s. So while I can see why others might be horrified to think that Irish people routinely use words which others might think are abhorrent, I can see why \*some \* of them aren’t considered abhorrent here. ---
**Author:** ![PookahMacPhellimey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pookahmacphellimey/32/3175_2.png) [@PookahMacPhellimey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PookahMacPhellimey)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/29 "2004-04-21T11:04:35Z")
Another non-Irish blow-in living in Ireland. I would have to concur with the fact that’s it’s inoffensive for vehicles but not too great for individuals. Wouldn’t even have occurred to me that it might be offensive as applied to a vehicle to be quite honest. IMO that’s a bit oversensitive. There are plenty of Japanese people in this part of the country. Many of them seem to be learning English, or Irish music, or both. Haven’t head any of them referred to as “Japs”. They are referred to by their names or “the Japanese(community)” collectively. ---
**Author:** ![ruadh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d2c977/32.png) [@ruadh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ruadh)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 11:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/30 "2004-04-21T11:30:35Z")
> [@yojimbo](#): > > Who was the chat show host. Never heard of this and I’m a tv junkie. I think it was Pat Kenny, but Googling only gives me a couple not-very-reliable sources to confirm. I remember it being in the news when it happened anyway. and you’re welcome, btw 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/31 "2004-04-21T18:41:11Z")
> [@calm kiwi](#): > > I would imagine that Irish-English and Kiwi-English are closer then “Yank”-English and Irish-English. ??? > [@](#): > > That aside, does it matter where the person comes from? I am telling you that the terms “Jap bike” or “Jap car” are not offensive HERE. Possibly it is an offensive term in America. No not _possibly_. The word “Jap” is offensive in the U.S. no matter what the context. There is no doubt. > [@](#): > > Just be aware it isn’t everywhere else, Ireland or not. Uh, yes - I am aware of that. What part of “I gather from your second paragraph that in your country, it’s acceptable to use it for inanimate objects” didn’t you understand? > [@](#): > > Nippon was used earlier in the thread as an example. In NZ Nippon and Clip on DO rhyme…you know why? Cause this is NZ. We have had our clip ons for 30-ish years. I wasn’t suggesting that Nippon was an offensive term (though I have NEVER heard it mentioned here unless it was about the rhyming clip ons). I was suggesting the overly sensitive might see the rhyming as offensive, Well done for you that you only corrected my accent and didn’t take offense. Huh? I think you lost me. The word “Nippon” is pronounced _nee-pone_. The words “clip on” are pronounced _klip ahn_. They do not rhyme. The derogatory word “Nip” is pronounced _nip_. So I was saying that if one pronounces Nippon as _nip-ahn_, it might _possibly_ be offensive to some, because it sounds partially like the derogatory word Nip. I wouldn’t see it that way, but maybe some people would. They don’t rhyme because you’re in New Zealand; they rhyme because you are using a Western pronounciation of a Japanese word. I think we are in agreement, but it’s hard to tell from the jumbled way you present your thoughts. ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/32 "2004-04-21T18:48:45Z")
> [@curly chick](#): > > I’ve lived in Ireland for more than 20 years and what I think you have to remember is that Ireland is not a multicultural society. Not yet, anyway. > Words are used here which are considered racist by people who don’t live here and which could cause serious offence in other places. > Surely that is self evident from the very fact that this thread was started? > > In Ireland a sambo is a sandwich, but my Mother is English and she thinks that’s an awful, awful word as it was one of the many words that was used to describe the black immigrants from the Carribean who went to England she when she was a young woman, in the 50s. > > So while I can see why others might be horrified to think that Irish people routinely use words which others might think are abhorrent, I can see why \*some \* of them aren’t considered abhorrent here. O.K., so in your experience, do Irish people routinely use the word “Jap”? ---
**Author:** ![GaWd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f08c70/32.png) [@GaWd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaWd)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/33 "2004-04-21T18:51:29Z")
blowero- I must question the validity of you being the barometer for all that is considered offensive in the U.S. Standards are different EVERYWHERE. ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/34 "2004-04-21T19:05:34Z")
> [@GaWd](#): > > blowero- > > I must question the validity of you being the barometer for all that is considered offensive in the U.S. Standards are different EVERYWHERE. Fine - call it a “Jap bike” if that floats your boat. I grew up in the Bay Area, and I know for a fact that people don’t appreciate that crap. It’s the kind of thing that’s gonna get you your ass kicked some day. ---
**Author:** ![GaWd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f08c70/32.png) [@GaWd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaWd)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/35 "2004-04-21T19:53:22Z")
> [@blowero](#): > > Fine - call it a “Jap bike” if that floats your boat. I grew up in the Bay Area, and I know for a fact that people don’t appreciate that crap. It’s the kind of thing that’s gonna get you your ass kicked some day. People don’t generally fuck with a guy my size, but if they’re all about it, so am I. Never had any trouble to date. Sam ---
**Author:** ![Judith\_Prietht](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b19c9b/32.png) [@Judith\_Prietht](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Judith_Prietht)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/36 "2004-04-21T19:56:34Z")
I’m not an Irish doper, but a half-Japanese one, and I wanted to weigh in and say while I do understand the cultural nuances of using the word “Jap” as described above, I and my Japanese-American mother would find it offensive to hear it in real life, regardless of whether it’s being used to describe people or inanimate objects. I was also under the impression that “Jap” was one of those universally offensive and derogatory racial epithets. Interesting thread! ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/37 "2004-04-21T20:03:01Z")
> [@GaWd](#): > > People don’t generally fuck with a guy my size, but if they’re all about it, so am I. Never had any trouble to date. > > Sam Now why did I have a feeling that you would respond with some sort of “people don’t fuck with me 'cuz I’m a badass” kind of comment? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![GaWd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f08c70/32.png) [@GaWd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaWd)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/38 "2004-04-21T20:07:02Z")
> [@blowero](#): > > Now why did I have a feeling that you would respond with some sort of “people don’t fuck with me 'cuz I’m a badass” kind of comment? :rolleyes: How did I know you’d respond the way you did? I don’t think that’s what I said. If you’d stop being a prick for one second and just let the fact that we disagree on one single fucking term used to describe machinery(!), you’d see that I said I don’t get much static. In fact, I’m the furthest thing from a badass…I just don’t have trouble with people. Ever. The reason I posit is because of my size. That is all. Christ. ---
**Author:** ![GaWd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f08c70/32.png) [@GaWd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaWd)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/39 "2004-04-21T20:15:31Z")
You know what else(I probably should retreat from this, but sometimes I can’t resist)my cousin, who is Japanese-whose father was interred in WWII-refers to all of his Japanese-produced vehicles as “Jap-vehicles”. So I know it’s not just me. ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2004, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072/40 "2004-04-21T20:17:44Z")
All right, I’m donning the flame proof suit here. There’s another thing to take into account. I suppose there’s no way of saying this without pissing _someone_ off, but trust me when I tell you the following comments are observations only, and carry no judgment with them. Here goes: Americans are more PC and more prone to take offense than any other people I know of. This is a sweeping generalisation, I know. As evidenced, opinions vary even in the American camp in this thread. But it seems true nonetheless. Brought forth here is the fact that the US was directly at war with Japan in WWII, hence the term “Jap” carries more weight there than in Europe or Australia. Or, hell, New Zealand. 😉 Thing is, many Dutch soldiers (and indeed citizens) died in Japanese camps in Indonesia during WWII. Some 12,000 to be precise. To this day, the camps are referred to as _Jappenkampen_ and the Japanese forces as _Jappen_. Mind you: the WWII forces. Calling a Japanese person a “Jap” here and now is completely offensive. Same for the Germans. The Nazis were and are called _Moffen_ (loosely translated: Krauts, Gerrys), but it’s most definitely NOT a term to use for a modern-day German. We differentiate between then and now. As for the term “Jap bike”, I’ve used the term both in English and Dutch, and personally do not find it offensive. Offensiveness is dependant on intentions, to me. If I say “That Jap bastard cut me off in traffic”, I’m crossing a line. If I say I like the latest line of Jap supersport bikes, I’m merely being descriptive, and any taken offense is on the part of the listener. As **yojimbo** demonstrated, we should be careful around these cultural differences, and treat them with respect. It’s an easily avoided term, and therefore it’s not hard for the Europeans and Aussies to adapt. At the same time, a little clarification might help, and offense won’t be taken so easily the next time. Like I said: this is all said with the best of intentions. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irish-dopers-is-jap-a-racial-slur-in-your-country/241072.md?page=3)