# Iron Chef Part Wu **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 11, 2001, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905 "2001-10-11T21:51:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Chef\_Troy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/85f322/32.png) [@Chef\_Troy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chef_Troy)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2001, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/101 "2001-10-22T03:14:28Z")
Um…ahem. When I said “combine all ingredients except lobster” in the recipe for the lobster salad used in the lobster rolls, I meant all ingredients except lobster, **rolls and lettuce.** I’m sure you all know that, but I just wanted to be thorough. Oh, and I don’t want to sway anyone from me to Fenris but I have to say the ASCII diagrams are a neat idea. Not something that could be judged, of course, and in a real Iron Chef battle they would be unnecessary, but thoughtful in this virtual stadium. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2001, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/102 "2001-10-22T03:27:12Z")
Heh…I was about to write and say that I liked the nested quote thing you did with the mayo. It made the sub-recipe very readable. Thus endeth the mutual-admiration society! 😉 Challenger Fenris ---
**Author:** ![Chef\_Troy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/85f322/32.png) [@Chef\_Troy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chef_Troy)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2001, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/103 "2001-10-22T18:25:52Z")
_bad Frank N. Furter impression_ Judges! Come up to the lab… And lay your scores upon the slab… You’ve made us shiver with antici- . . . . . . . . . . . …pation. 'Cause Fen-ris and ME! Need…commentary… So tell us how we caused… _chuckle_ You to feel eLATION! ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2001, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/104 "2001-10-22T18:37:17Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Hugh Jass \* > \*\*Archetypal lobster: Not impressed. Don’t they serve this at Red Lobster? Use of rosemary is a nice choice, and the two butters can make for a variety of tastes. But I don’t see any harmony between the steak and the lobster, beyond the general acceptance that these two go together. > \*\* **Hugh** , to explain my motivations (tho’ not to debate), my theory was severalfold: 1. I wanted a plain, unadorned lobster-tail. Let’s face it: lobster is _so_ good that one must be careful not to guild the lily, so to speak. But a plain lobster-tail wouldn’t be enough. 2. The traditional Western thought is that there are four types of taste buds: Sweet, Salty, Sour and Bitter. The Japanese (and Chinese) believe there’s a fifth type “Umami” which translates roughly as “savory” or “meaty”. At this point, it’s pretty well proven that the “Umami” receptor is real. The “meaty-ness/umami” and “saltiness” of the aged steak, along with the sweetness of the lobster (which, according to one article may also be “umami” since it’s shellfish) and the inside part of the roasted squash, the sourness of the lemon butter and the bitterness (only a tiny amount, though) of the slightly charred outside of the roasted squash and steak (and the garlic, if you consider garlic as “bitter”) would get all five types of tastebuds going in this dish. I believe that’s why Surf-n-Turf is so popular. (A couple of articles on Umami can be found [here](http://www.quinion.com/words/weirdwords/ww-uma1.htm) and [here](http://www.nature.com/nsu/000127/000127-6.html) ) That said, if you don’t like the dish, you don’t like the dish! 🙂 Fenris ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2001, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/105 "2001-10-22T20:58:28Z")
LIttle aside: this w/e, Snookie and I speculated about what the Iron Chef and Challenger would come up with (and of course, what Snookie would do, too). I mentioned Portabella’s, Snookie scoffed; Snookie mentioned ‘Lobster salad sandwhich’ and I scoffed. well. First up: **Chef Troy**. While Snookie may not be a Potobellos fan, I am, and you’ve piqued my interest with this on. Simple, yet elegant. The Lobster and Corn Chowder also sounds good, tho’ I’m unsure that the Lobster really adds anything to this hearty soup. I like Corn Chowder, tho’ and, again, anyone who turns down the bread as a bowl can’t be all bad. Now, the lobster rolls - a daring idea. Careful with the tarragon or you’ll loose Snookie completely, and I like the potato salad as a side dish. Very risky to serve, in essence, a salad/sandwhich in an Iron Chef, but it does serve to show a different presentation of the meat. And, you’re right - love the dessert - I was thinking along a similar line (tho’ I was going with a watermelon red/green approach), but the blood oranges will make a wonderful sherbet. **Fenris** A bold and wonderful start to the meal with your dual appetizers. Snookie and I often dine out on simply appetizers as it is, so this was a winner. The sushi version is good (tho I suggest that the hoison sauce would be too overpowering for the delicate lobstermeat.) And I can see that you really wanted to be part of the last competition with your usage of the squashes. The fritters sound fun, and I think the orange ginger drizzel is a real adventurous change. YOur presentation on this one is dynamic. On to the salad. Hmmm. Walnuts and the gorgonzola cheese? I’d be picking these out of the salad, and wondering why we didn’t just keep with the appetizers. A salad, 2 kinds of appetizers, a soup, two entrees (in essence), and a dessert, were we supposed to eat this in one setting or four? I’d have been happier with a few less items. The soup sounds interesting, you’re swearing by the ham, eh? Hmmm again. Tho’ I’ll go along with you 'cause I trust you. The surf N turf - Snookie mentioned ‘how do you avoid the perfection that is this’, but, ya know, again, I think you shoulda gone w/just the broccoli/lobster dish - a different method of preparation, along with a dynamic presentation. And I think again, your choice of dessert was just fine (and appropriate.) scores are on their way. I shall try and nudge Snookie into direct participation this time. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2001, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/106 "2001-10-22T23:31:46Z")
Boy, this one’s tough. On the one hand I have my ancient arch-nemesis Fenris. On the other hand is Chef Troy, who’s twice brought me to resounding defeat. What’s worth is I think we’ve seen two of the finest meals this contest has ever had. I guess I’ll just have to hate them both equally and be impartial in spite of myself. I’ll just have to be very hard on both of them. Chef Troy: Fortunately their are two of your appetizers as I would have inhaled the first one so fast I wouldn’t have time to taste it. I can make no complaint about the blending of flavors in this dish. I mean mushrooms, garlic, lobster and butter, what’s not to like? If I’m looking for a flaw (and I am) I’d have to say it’s texture. Portobellos as you’ve cooked them are soft, and lobster meat while firm, doesn’t form enough of a dichotomy IMO. I am wishing this dish had been fried in a tempura batter or perhaps that the mushroms had been breaded and fried. I am yearning for some crunchiness At first I was annoyed by your lobster and corn chowder as it seemed technically flawless and a wonderful blending of two of my favorite soups; corn chowder, and Lobster bisque. I think it’s an inspired dish, and my annoyance at not being able to find a flaw was alieved when I noted that you make your roux the fast way, a nitpick to a fine course. I find the lobster rolls on the other hand to be somewhat pedestrian, and I’m not a fan of tarragon. I am somewhat disapointed to have recieved what is basically a sandwich after two would class appetizers. Desert left me disapointed as well as I expect a chef of your demonstrated caliber and creativity to have come up with something that actually uses lobster. Fenris: I am intimidated by your attention to detail and awe-inspiring coding skills. I think these are the first full scale illustrations to ever grace this contest. Once again, the bar has been raised. I take the sashimi with wasabi of course, and I endorse the simple yet elegant presentation and mix of tastes. With the lobster fritter, I note the use of spaghetti squash, and can’t help but feel I am being poked fun at, but I don’t care. This is perfect. The taste the texture the sauce. I wonder how the pancake holds up to being fried and baked and broiled. Might it get a little soggy and overcooked, like reheated fried chicken? I don’t know, and I must extend the benefit of the doubt. I loved the salad, and feel as if it was designed just for me. I have to take slight issue with the bisquish soup though. Normally I’m happy to match ham with anything, but with a lobster and cream based soup? Without the ham, this would be perfect. As it stands, I sense a jarring note in an otherwise melodious symphony. Because of the sublime beauty of the rest of the soup this egregious error seems unforgiveable as if you had slashed the Mona Lisa with a jacknife. Bruce Springsteen wrote a song called “Jungleland” which means me of your surf n turf. > [@](#): > > The poets down here don’t write nothing at all. > > They just stand back and let it all be I think that part of greatness is knowing when to go simple old school and let the cosmic truths speak for themselves. There can be no arguing with surf n turf prepared correctly, and I find the hint of Rosemary adds a signature and in-joke to this, the supreme God of all main courses. It is hard to bring my focus back to the perfect pair, and I note the excellent use of the silking technique, and even find humor in the use of the ketchup. I love the blend of crunchy crust, succulent lobster and sweet sauce, but can’t help but think the chicken is superfluous, and the brocolli the slightly wrong choice (though I can’t think what the right one is.) Still, nothing says I have to eat the chicken. I also note the lacking of desert with dispointment. All in all I feel a grand meal, superbly done. Most intriguing are the minor details, and reminiscences of contests past that I sense here, as well as the friendly jibes at rivals in your use of ingredients. The homage to other chefs is noted as well. Not only is this meal a delicious treat, the taste is all the finer for the subtle messages and delightful in-joke quality it presents. Scores sent momentarily. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2001, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/107 "2001-10-23T00:47:44Z")
Aaargh. It’s too late to change this for judging purposes, but the reference to Chicken in the subtitle to the Perfect Pair should be discarded: my initial vision for the dish would have had Lobster in the red sauce and chicken in the white, but, as **Scylla** did, I thought they wouldn’t be an entirely happy combination. I deleted all references to chicken…except in the title :rolleyes: (the chicken broth for the home-version wouldn’t be a problem…trust me on this). Thanks for getting the “in-jokes”. **Wring** : Traditionally on the “real” Iron Chef, the idea isn’t to present a meal as much as it is to showcase the theme ingredient. Each dish should say something different about the theme ingredient. This can lead to a chef preparing 4 or 5 main courses. The times a regular meal (appetizer to dessert) has been prepared, we’ve seen such…\…unique…\ creations as “Bananna and Pork Soup” (paraphrase…it a fruit and meat soup that looked pretty bad) or the dreaded, infamous, abomidible “Fish Sperm Ice-Cream” (AKA “Soft Roe Ice Cream”). Seriously. I’m NOT making this up! Chairman Kaga had to force the BDJ to try it…and who can blame her? On the other hand, the SDMB Iron Chef competitions _do_ have a tradition of making a complete meal, appetizer through dessert (which, to me is _far_ more challenging: five main courses would be much easier!). My intent was to blend the two traditions, which meant for duplicate courses. Certainly if I was serving this for a non-competition setting, I’d choose either one of the main courses. Fenris ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2001, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/108 "2001-10-23T01:39:51Z")
Fenris: I’m not sure how it works, but it seems as if The Iron Chefs on the show seem to know and agree telepathically whether a full meal is required, or whether they should just prepare several entrees, desserts, or what have you. I notice that if one prepares a full meal, the other always does, and if the one just produces entrees, the other does the same. I’m not sure how they know, but they do. ---
**Author:** ![Chef\_Troy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/85f322/32.png) [@Chef\_Troy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chef_Troy)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2001, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/109 "2001-10-23T02:26:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fenris \* > …my initial vision for the dish would have had Lobster in the red sauce and chicken in the white, but, as **Scylla** did, I thought they wouldn’t be an entirely happy combination. Fenris I don’t know, Fenris… there’s a famous Chinese dish called “Dragon and Phoenix” that makes use of lobster and chicken together… very dramatic. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2001, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/110 "2001-10-23T02:54:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Chef Troy \* > \*\*I don’t know, Fenris… there’s a famous Chinese dish called “Dragon and Phoenix” that makes use of lobster and chicken together… very dramatic. \*\* True, but in the varients of “Dragon and Phoenix” I’ve had, the lobster wasn’t battered/silked. I think the…um…stringy-er (?) texture of the chicken would work against the “silked” lobster. Now scallops, on the other hand …mmmmmMMMMMMMmm…scallops… would work as a perfect substitute for the lobster. Fenris ---
**Author:** ![Hugh\_Jass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/4da419/32.png) [@Hugh\_Jass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hugh_Jass)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2001, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/111 "2001-10-23T17:40:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fenris \* > > **Hugh** , to explain my motivations (tho’ not to debate), my theory was severalfold: > > 1. I wanted a plain, unadorned lobster-tail. Let’s face it: lobster is _so_ good that one must be careful not to guild the lily, so to speak. But a plain lobster-tail wouldn’t be enough. > > 2. The traditional Western thought is that there are four types of taste buds: Sweet, Salty, Sour and Bitter. The Japanese (and Chinese) believe there’s a fifth type “Umami” which translates roughly as “savory” or “meaty”. At this point, it’s pretty well proven that the “Umami” receptor is real. That said, if you don’t like the dish, you don’t like the dish! 🙂 > > Fenris \*\* Fenris, I see your point. I can also see that you might have been put off by the way I said that stuff. It struck me on the second reading that I was a little too snide in my comments. I didn’t mean to be, but that’s the way it came across. I apologize. I guess I am handicapped by my expectations. I tend to look for situations where the theme ingredient is presented in a way I’d never considered before. I personally like to see boundaries pushed. It is perfectly reasonable to present something more traditional. Your recipe shows that the surfnturf would be delicious. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2001, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/112 "2001-10-24T01:09:28Z")
I wanted to make a political statement. Bumping threads for the sake of getting the remaining judges to post…is wrong, wrong, wrong. I just _had_ to get that off my chest. Fenris ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2001, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/113 "2001-10-24T01:22:51Z")
Hugh: > [@](#): > > Fenris, > I see your point. I can also see that you might have been put off by the way I said that stuff. It struck me on the second reading that > I was a little too snide in my comments. I didn’t mean to be, but that’s the way it came across. I apologize. This is Iron Chef. The Judges are supposed to be snide. Haven’t you seen it? I love when the fortuneteller says: “No, I don’t like this at all. This is all wrong. What were you thinking?” And the Chef has to sit there and smile and take it. You can tell he’s just thinking “bitch!” It’s my favorite part of the show. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2001, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/114 "2001-10-24T02:06:11Z")
**Scylla** : In the same vein, my favorite bit was during a battle with Chen. The Fortune Teller (who’s apparently a slug, because any hint of salt earns her wrath) says to Chen “Feh! This is toooo salt. This is terrible. I don’t know **what** you were thinking!” And Chen, in the world’s blandest voice, with a tone that said “Screw you” with unconcern said “Huh. I’ll never make this again.” Whadda guy! Fenris ---
**Author:** ![JavaMaven1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/cab0a1/32.png) [@JavaMaven1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JavaMaven1)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2001, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/115 "2001-10-24T02:25:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fenris \* > \*\*I wanted to make a political statement. > > Bumping threads for the sake of getting the remaining judges to post…is wrong, wrong, wrong. > I just _had_ to get that off my chest. > > Fenris \*\* _ahem._ I believe that’s my job. 😃 I have 3 scores in. I need one more judge to post in. ---
**Author:** ![Chef\_Troy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/85f322/32.png) [@Chef\_Troy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chef_Troy)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2001, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/116 "2001-10-24T02:57:36Z")
Boy howdy, if I ever lose a match and go back to being a judge, I’ll be the first one to post every time. My boss asked if anyone can judge… I told her one has to sign up ahead of time. I think her impartiality might have been called into question anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Hugh\_Jass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/4da419/32.png) [@Hugh\_Jass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hugh_Jass)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2001, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/117 "2001-10-24T04:17:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Scylla \* > \*\*Hugh: > > This is Iron Chef. The Judges are supposed to be snide. > > Haven’t you seen it? > > I love when the fortuneteller says: “No, I don’t like this at all. This is all wrong. What were you thinking?” > > And the Chef has to sit there and smile and take it. > > You can tell he’s just thinking “bitch!” > > It’s my favorite part of the show. \*\* Yeah, I’ve seen it, and I was tempted not to apologize, but I’m ever so sensitive. From now on, I will be a real snarky sonuvabitch. ---
**Author:** ![Chef\_Troy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/85f322/32.png) [@Chef\_Troy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chef_Troy)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2001, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/118 "2001-10-24T04:51:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Scylla \* > \*\*I love when the fortuneteller says: “No, I don’t like this at all. This is all wrong. What were you thinking?” > > And the Chef has to sit there and smile and take it. > > You can tell he’s just thinking “bitch!” > > It’s my favorite part of the show. \*\* I love that too. But have you noticed that no matter how much the judges trash-talk the Iron Chef’s dishes or lavish praise on the challengers’ items, it never seems to be reflected in the scores? :eek: You don’t suppose the show is… _gasp_ _fixed_, do you? ---
**Author:** ![Chef\_Troy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/85f322/32.png) [@Chef\_Troy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chef_Troy)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2001, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/119 "2001-10-24T14:12:46Z")
All right, this is unacceptable. I totally did NOT have time to take part in this competition this past week, but I made time because I knew people were into it and my participation was necessary. Well guess what, whichever of you judges is blowing this off? YOUR participation is necessary too. Get off your butt and get your scores in pronto. You are letting everyone down. And if you want to retaliate for being scolded by downgrading my scores, so be it. If I lose, at least I can serve as judge with the other people who care enough to follow through with their commitments. ---
**Author:** ![JavaMaven1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/cab0a1/32.png) [@JavaMaven1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JavaMaven1)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2001, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905/120 "2001-10-24T15:46:07Z")
**Chef Troy** is right. As being a previous Iron Chef, I know fully the frustration he’s feeling right now. If I don’t receive the last set of scores by 2 PM EST, I will judge to finish this round. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iron-chef-part-wu/86905.md?page=7)