# Irregular English plurals? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 6, 2006, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144 "2006-12-06T23:26:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 8:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/21 "2006-12-07T08:36:02Z")
[QUOTE=lissener] I think the list in the OP is words that have a unique word for its plural that is not subject the regular rules of ANY language [/QUOTE] That’s not true for at least 3 of the OP’s examples - brethren, children, and oxen, all of which are proper Germanic plurals. ---
**Author:** ![Jeff\_Lichtman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeff_lichtman/32/1531_2.png) [@Jeff\_Lichtman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jeff_Lichtman)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 9:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/22 "2006-12-07T09:04:43Z")
I found a pretty good [web page listing irregular English plurals](http://www2.gsu.edu/~wwwesl/egw/crump.htm#ListOne). Some words from that page not already listed here: calf - calves elf - elves half - halves hoof - hooves life - lives loaf - loaves scarf - scarves self - selves shelf - shelves wife - wives wolf - wolves analysis - analyses axis - axes basis - bases crisis - crises diagnosis - diagnoses emphasis - emphases hypothesis - hypotheses neurosis - neuroses oasis - oases parenthesis - parentheses synposis - synposes thesis - theses ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/23 "2006-12-07T15:41:05Z")
[QUOTE=Tengu] That’s not true for at least 3 of the OP’s examples - brethren, children, and oxen, all of which are proper Germanic plurals. [/QUOTE] “Children” is a double plural. “Childer” (cf. German _Kinder_) was the historic plural, but since even early English didn’t pluralize with -R much, then -EN plural was added. Dialectal “chilluns” is a triple plural (although plural #1, the -R, has vanished away). But in fact all of the OP’s examples are regular plurals. Pluralizing by umlaut (raising the internal vowel) is a perfectly fine is uncommon way of forming plurals. Compare Welsh \*asgwrn \* (bone) / \*esgyrn \* (bones). And there is no mention of words like _person_, whose plural is either the regular \*persons \* or the highly irregular _people_, taken from a different root altogether. I think what the OP is asking is “uncommon English plurals derived from Germanic roots.” - So we have the vast majority of nouns pluralizing by -s / -es. Some of these make the list because of subsequent phonetic changes in English: F and V were originally allophones; so word-final -F was pronounced /f/ (cnif \> knife) and in between two vowels it was pronounced /v/ (cnifes \> knives). Also die \> dice. - A few remanants of earlier ways of forming the plural: n-stems by adding -n / -en instead of -s / -es (ox, oxen) or athematic consonant stems by umlaut (mouse, mice) - children, an old -r / -er plural “regularized” to and -n / -en plural. - plurals taken from other cases and used in special circumstances (penny, pennies / pence). - nouns where a different word altogether is used to make the plural (person, people). - Latin plurals: 1st declension -a \> -ae (alumna), 2nd declension -us \> -i / -um \> -a (datum, data), third declension -is / -es (crisis, crises) - Greek plurals: -on \> -a (phenomenon, -a), plus some other ones (my Greek isn’t good enough for a list). ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/24 "2006-12-07T15:48:55Z")
Have just looked at Roger Lass’s _Old English_. He says: “In post-OE times, only _foot_, _goose_, _man_, _louse_, \*mouse \* have not gone over to” adding a plural ending, but once the group included the words] oak, burgh, cow, goat, turf, furrow, nut. “The plural of _brôc_, i.e. _brêc_, does remain in the double-plural form _breeches_, though the singular (which would be \*_brook_) has been lost.” (p. 136) He also notes that calf, lamb, and egg all used to have -r plurals. (OE: _cealfru_, “calves”) ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/25 "2006-12-07T15:56:11Z")
[QUOTE=Jeff Lichtman] I found a pretty good [web page listing irregular English plurals](http://www2.gsu.edu/~wwwesl/egw/crump.htm#ListOne). Some words from that page not already listed here: calf - calves … wolf - wolves [/QUOTE] You could argue that these are regular, because English has a rule that nouns endding in -f or -fe form their plural with -ves. However, if that is the rule, then the dwarfs form of the plural of dwarf becomes irregular! ---
**Author:** ![Gymnopithys](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/fbc32d/32.png) [@Gymnopithys](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gymnopithys)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/26 "2006-12-07T16:32:21Z")
genie - genii ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/27 "2006-12-07T17:12:12Z")
Biceps is singular, and the plural is bicepses, according to my old 12 pound Webster. Kudos is singular. It seems to be one to a customer, because there’s no plural listed. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/28 "2006-12-07T17:17:33Z")
One more irregular plural: “Maple Leafs” (as in the Toronto hockey team). If “leaves” is the regular plural of “leaf”, then this is irregular. (They really do need to define what a “regular plural” is.) ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/29 "2006-12-07T17:40:20Z")
[QUOTE=AskNott] Kudos is singular. It seems to be one to a customer, because there’s no plural listed. [/QUOTE] I would assume it has a plural in Greek. I once read a columnist decrying the fact that people pronounce it “koo-doze” as if it were plural, instead of “koo-dos”, and that some people acually refer to a “kudo” as a single act of praise. I think he said something like-- what’s next, a single instance of feeling a patho?" It seemed funny at the time. ---
**Author:** ![Jeff\_Lichtman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeff_lichtman/32/1531_2.png) [@Jeff\_Lichtman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jeff_Lichtman)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/30 "2006-12-07T18:11:24Z")
A good book for those interested in regularity and irregularity in language is [Words and Rules](http://www.amazon.com/Words-Rules-Ingredients-Steven-Pinker/dp/0060958405/sr=1-1/qid=1165514786/ref=pd_bbs_1/102-6419329-4960157?ie=UTF8&s=books) by Steven Pinker. Much of the book is about irregular verbs and nouns: where irregularity comes from, how it persists, how people learn them and what this says about how the brain processes language. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/31 "2006-12-07T18:45:30Z")
And there is a good Wikipedia article on [English plural](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_plural), asccording to which many other words have irregular plurals. ---
**Author:** ![Blake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a9a28c/32.png) [@Blake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blake)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/32 "2006-12-07T21:26:35Z")
[QUOTE=Dr. Drake] “Children” is a double plural. “Childer” (cf. German _Kinder_) was the historic plural,… [/QUOTE] It’s been many years since HS German, but isn’t “kindern” also a perfectly acceptable dative plural? If so it seems that “children” has simply been taken from the dative and so follows regular Germanic pluralisation. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/33 "2006-12-07T23:16:48Z")
[QUOTE=Cunctator] 1. brother - brothers/brethren [/QUOTE] I’m not so sure on this one: if someone referred to their ‘brethren’, I’d assume that they were not biologically related. ---
**Author:** ![Jeff\_Lichtman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeff_lichtman/32/1531_2.png) [@Jeff\_Lichtman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jeff_Lichtman)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2006, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/34 "2006-12-07T23:43:20Z")
[QUOTE=Quartz] I’m not so sure on this one: if someone referred to their ‘brethren’, I’d assume that they were not biologically related. [/QUOTE] Interesting semantic drift. The word “brethren” is now most commonly used in certain religious organizations to refer to members of the group. The singular is still “brother,” which is how a member would refer to a single male member of the group. One might also hear the word “sistern” in this context to refer to female members of the group. Anyway, you are able to deduce that “brethren” doesn’t refer to blood relatives because the word is now used only in contexts where it means “metaphorical brothers.” ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2006, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/35 "2006-12-08T00:12:19Z")
They also left off mongoose -\> polygoose. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2006, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/36 "2006-12-08T00:53:57Z")
[QUOTE=Chronos] They also left off mongoose -\> polygoose. 😃 [/QUOTE] Polygeese, silly. ---
**Author:** ![Colophon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f05b48/32.png) [@Colophon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colophon)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2006, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/37 "2006-12-08T13:35:10Z")
[QUOTE=jjimm] “Pence” is still current in the UK. [/QUOTE] Not only is it still current, it actually seems to be gaining ground over the singular. “One pence” is heard quite commonly – in fact Orange (the mobile phone company) had big billboards up a couple of years ago advertising text messages for “ONE PENCE EACH”. Ugh. ---
**Author:** ![Bookkeeper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bookkeeper/32/281_2.png) [@Bookkeeper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bookkeeper)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2006, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/38 "2006-12-08T18:19:43Z")
[QUOTE=Cunctator] 9. mouse - mice [/QUOTE] Any Slvester fan can tell you that the plural of “mouse” is “meeces”. ---
**Author:** ![Gus\_Gusterson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/85f322/32.png) [@Gus\_Gusterson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gus_Gusterson)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2006, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/39 "2006-12-08T18:49:08Z")
Index/indices? ---
**Author:** ![Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/73ab20/32.png) [@Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alive_At_Both_Ends)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2006, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144/40 "2006-12-08T19:05:29Z")
[QUOTE=Dr. Drake] “Children” is a double plural. [/QUOTE] “Chickens” is as well, since “chicken” used to be plural (singular “chick”, of course). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irregular-english-plurals/383144.md?page=1)