# Irresponsible motherhood. (Recreational outrage, I guess) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 1, 2007, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314 "2007-06-01T07:00:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Garfield226](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Garfield226](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Garfield226)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/1 "2007-06-01T07:00:37Z")
I’m a guy. Therefore, I will never know the pain of shoving a kid out of a hole in my body. But my guess is, it hurts a lot. That’s the most obvious reason why this story is dumb. There are a few others too: The mom is 20. Not that that, in and of itself is a problem. Several successful people have had kids at a young age and perhaps it even made them better people. But on the whole, I hear it’s a pretty significant life change. But it gets worse. These are twins. Twice the cost, twice the work, etc. Not that she had any control over that. But it gets worse. It’s her THIRD set of twins. She’s 20. She’s also got a pair of three year olds, and a pair of two year olds. That’s six kids, all under the age of four. It gets worse. She’s got a four year old too. So she got knocked up when she was ~15, and then proceeded to do it again, again and yet again. It gets worse. Neither she, nor the father of the latest twins (apparently they’re not married) is employed. Neither one. So…seven kids on welfare. Maybe I’m wrong and she’ll beat the odds and go on and be successful and happy and the kids will grow up and be successful and happy and so on. I hope so. Then there’s the other side, where you hear of a mother and her kids hanging in a closet, or driving into a lake, or drowning in a bathtub… [link](http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/wfaa/latestnews/stories/wfaa070531_lj_twins.17091f2.html) ETA: Not that the daddy didn’t have a role either, of course…but as far as I could tell from the article, he’s responsible for two sevenths of this problem, and he’s sticking around for now, which near as I can tell is the only good point. ---
**Author:** ![Autolycus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/22d042/32.png) [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 7:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/2 "2007-06-01T07:05:20Z")
I guess time will tell. My real reaction is: How in all that is holy do you get knocked up that many times at such a young age?! I mean… are you trying for Guinness or something? ---
**Author:** ![Auntbeast](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Auntbeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Auntbeast)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/3 "2007-06-01T07:19:27Z")
I know you are pretty young Auto, but don’t you know how babies are made? ---
**Author:** ![Obsidian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/51bf81/32.png) [@Obsidian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Obsidian)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/4 "2007-06-01T07:26:19Z")
[QUOTE=Autolycus] I guess time will tell. My real reaction is: How in all that is holy do you get knocked up that many times at such a young age?! I mean… are you trying for Guinness or something? [/QUOTE] It’s not at all hard at that age, late teens/early twenties women are as fertile as they get. I read a book called Motherhood in Bondage that was a collection of letters sent to Margaret Sanger over the years from women begging for birth control. There is a chapter titled “Girlmothers” which is letters from women in their teens with 4, 5, 6 children. They all were rural poor, married very young (12-13) and were having a baby a year, sometimes twins. (It’s actually heartbreaking to read, these women’s desperation is palpable, and they are SO young) Now, that was before birth control, granted, so this girl is just stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 10:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/5 "2007-06-01T10:10:32Z")
[QUOTE=Garfield226] …Neither she, nor the father of the latest twins (apparently they’re not married) is employed. Neither one. So…seven kids on welfare. … [/QUOTE] I would just like to point out that, with 7 kids under school age, any job she had would have to bring in a significant amount of money just to stay even with the day-care charges. I don’t see even a gifted 20-year-old making that kind of bucks. I have a friend who did something like that. Singleton, 18 months later set of twins, 14 months later set of triplets…she was hard pressed and she was an attorney married to an attorney (and she had her tubes tied, finally). Hers are now all in school. A private school. I think they get a discount. ETA: She is still an attorney. She is not still married to one. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 10:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/6 "2007-06-01T10:29:20Z")
That’s one of the more depressing things I’ve read in a while. Maybe it’s just me, but when you’re 20, with five kids, and on welfare, I feel like popping out another one (let alone two) is just as much an act of despair as firing up the crack pipe. An admission that you’ve reached the point where you can’t even \*imagine \* your life getting any better, so you may as well just keep digging. Or maybe she’s just really, really inspired by the Duggans. Which is not less depressing. And may in fact amount to the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![Madd\_Maxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Madd\_Maxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Madd_Maxx)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/7 "2007-06-01T11:13:33Z")
I guess she like sex. Maybe it takes her mind off all the other shit in her life. It’s a vicious cycle. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/8 "2007-06-01T11:48:31Z")
"But with neither the 21-year-old father nor the 20-year-old mother employed - all the children are supported by welfare - the young family faces financial and emotional obstacles. " What isn’t said – “And the people who do have jobs will continue to forfeit more and more of their wages in order to support lazy, fecund, stupid fuck-ups like the Gonzalez family.” Welfare is a huge double-edged sword. It provides a safety net for the poorest and stupidest people, which are the very people we’d like to weed out. What are the chances of the Gonzalez children growing up to be productive members of society? Nil. ---
**Author:** ![SnakesCatLady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4af34b/32.png) [@SnakesCatLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SnakesCatLady)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/9 "2007-06-01T11:57:27Z")
I hope the stupid bitch gets sterilized when they do the c-section. I realize it is unlikely that she could make enough money to pay for child care, but what is baby-daddy’s excuse? Do the other baby-daddies pay child support? Often stories like this result in a lot of gifts and offers of help for the family. In light of the fact that neither of them are working, I wonder if people will want to help them. I don’t. The only think I would give the stupid bitch is birth control and she can get that free. “Always wanted lots of children.” Fine, you stupid clown car, but don’t expect the rest of us to pay for them. ---
**Author:** ![Cattitude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@Cattitude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cattitude)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/10 "2007-06-01T12:46:43Z")
I can’t stand hearing shit like this. When I was 15, I was busting my ass working and going to school. I also did my fair share of bad teenage shit but it did not include popping out all those damn kids! Can you imagine how many more are out there like her and him? Keep birthin’, the grand ole’ taxpayers will support 'em. It’s bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/11 "2007-06-01T12:53:04Z")
It’s a good chance that all seven of those children will be raised on welfare and come to see it as a legitimate way of life. Then they will go on welfare and have babies, creating a third generation of welfare bunnies. I work with these people every day. I’ve seen women who, threatened with the loss of their welfare checks, get knocked up. One such lovely told me I was a “fool” for working and paying my own way. I saw a welfare who had three children in 10 months rather than go to work. It makes me angry at the parents and sad for the children. ---
**Author:** ![fessie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@fessie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fessie)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/12 "2007-06-01T13:22:41Z")
Gah! So sickening, in so many ways. And why are they so afraid of getting a job? Sheesh, at least at work a person can take a potty break without being interrupted by little people who absolutely HAVE to have their sandals on NOW. ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/13 "2007-06-01T13:31:10Z")
[QUOTE=SnakesCatLady] … “Always wanted lots of children.” Fine, you stupid clown car, but don’t expect the rest of us to pay for them. [/QUOTE] Awwww, I was hoping to make the “clown car” comment first! How long till someone here condemns our judgmentalism & affirms her lifestyle choice? ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/14 "2007-06-01T13:34:36Z")
[QUOTE=Annie-Xmas] I saw a welfare who had three children in 10 months rather than go to work. It makes me angry at the parents and sad for the children. [/QUOTE] It makes me confused about the math. Is that triplets? Or three pregnancies by the same person in 10 months? That seems…unlikely, so I must be misunderstanding you. Sailboat ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/15 "2007-06-01T13:35:06Z")
[QUOTE=Sailboat] It makes me confused about the math. Is that triplets? Or three pregnancies by the same person in 10 months? That seems…unlikely, so I must be misunderstanding you. Sailboat [/QUOTE] Gave birth to one, and ten months later had twins. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/16 "2007-06-01T13:55:35Z")
[QUOTE=Auntbeast] I know you are pretty young Auto, but don’t you know how babies are made? [/QUOTE] You see, when a man and a ladle love each other very much… ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/17 "2007-06-01T14:14:19Z")
[QUOTE=PunditLisa] "But with neither the 21-year-old father nor the 20-year-old mother employed - all the children are supported by welfare - the young family faces financial and emotional obstacles. " What isn’t said – “And the people who do have jobs will continue to forfeit more and more of their wages in order to support lazy, fecund, stupid fuck-ups like the Gonzalez family.” Welfare is a huge double-edged sword. It provides a safety net for the poorest and stupidest people, which are the very people we’d like to weed out. What are the chances of the Gonzalez children growing up to be productive members of society? Nil. [/QUOTE] The sad thing is, people like her only make it that much harder for people who genuinely need help to get it. One hears the echoes of Groucho Marx… ---
**Author:** ![Tibidabo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@Tibidabo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tibidabo)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/18 "2007-06-01T14:41:42Z")
[QUOTE=PunditLisa] What isn’t said – “And the people who do have jobs will continue to forfeit more and more of their wages in order to support lazy, fecund, stupid fuck-ups like the Gonzalez family.” Welfare is a huge double-edged sword. It provides a safety net for the poorest and stupidest people, which are the very people we’d like to weed out. What are the chances of the Gonzalez children growing up to be productive members of society? Nil. [/QUOTE] Jesus… “weed out”? Like let them starve? Maybe they _would_ have a chance of becoming productive members of society if the welfare system did just a little more than keep them alive… like if it guaranteed them the same oppurtunities for a good education as everyone else? If the underpriviledged are kept in poverty and denied oppurtunities then I don’t know what fucking kind of stupid dipshit dingbat it takes to be surprised that their kids, and in turn \*their \* kids and so on and so forth… will also be poor. A half-assed welfare system solves nothing. Do it right or don’t bother. The US seems to be sliding towards the latter. It’s the super-rich, not the super-poor, who are stealing the vast majority of your tax-dollars. Also you seem to equate poverty with stupidity. Before I start a rant I just want to check if you _really_ meant that… It’s so fucking ignorant, I’m inclined to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume I’m mistaken ---
**Author:** ![Orual](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/779978/32.png) [@Orual](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orual)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/19 "2007-06-01T14:49:32Z")
[QUOTE=Quoth the Raven] Also you seem to equate poverty with stupidity. Before I start a rant I just want to check if you _really_ meant that… It’s so fucking ignorant, I’m inclined to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume I’m mistaken [/QUOTE] I don’t believe she’s equating poverty with stupidity. She’s equating ‘continually fucking without birth control’ with stupidity. A position I heartily agree with. ---
**Author:** ![Missy2U](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@Missy2U](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Missy2U)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2007, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314/20 "2007-06-01T14:49:53Z")
[QUOTE=FriarTed] How long till someone here condemns our judgmentalism & affirms her lifestyle choice? [/QUOTE] Looks like it was about an hour and ten minutes. 😉 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/irresponsible-motherhood-recreational-outrage-i-guess/406314.md?page=2)