# Is a boycott really a boycott if you only stop buying non-essentials? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 19, 2010, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051 "2010-05-19T21:08:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/1 "2010-05-19T21:08:06Z")
So the City of Los Angeles issued a resolution for the City to boycott all things Arizona in response to Arizona’s recent immigration enforcment law. A member of the Arizona Corporation Commission, the Arizona state energy utility, that supplies a substantial portion of Los Angeles’ electricity, as well as many other California cities that also have joined the Arizona boycott, sent a letter to the Mayor of LA saying that if you truly don’t want any of our resources or services, we’ll gladly cut-off your electricity. The LA mayor issued a statement that he will not respond to threats. So, is a boycott really a boycott if you only quit buying non-essentials? I think LA should stand firm and let Arizona shut off the electricity as well. Let them explain that to their residents. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/2 "2010-05-19T21:14:27Z")
> [@Wilbo523](#): > > The LA mayor issued a statement that he will not respond to threats. That’s an amazingly arrogant statement to make from someone who specifically stated an intent to do financial damage. Pot let me introduce you to kettle. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/3 "2010-05-19T21:18:41Z")
> [@Wilbo523](#): > > So the City of Los Angeles issued a resolution for the City to boycott all things Arizona in response to Arizona’s recent immigration enforcment law. > > A member of the Arizona Corporation Commission, the Arizona state energy utility, that supplies a substantial portion of Los Angeles’ electricity, as well as many other California cities that also have joined the Arizona boycott, sent a letter to the Mayor of LA saying that if you truly don’t want any of our resources or services, we’ll gladly cut-off your electricity. > > The LA mayor issued a statement that he will not respond to threats. > > So, is a boycott really a boycott if you only quit buying non-essentials? > > I think LA should stand firm and let Arizona shut off the electricity as well. Let them explain that to their residents. Interesting, so a Commissioner of the ACC is basically saying he will abet LA in their boycott. And what will Arizona do with that electricity then? Store it in a warehouse? Since electricity is fungible and palced onto a larger grid, it is really only a financial transaction that has the electricity going from Arizona to LA. Its not like there is a direct pipeline for electrons from Arizona into Los Angeles, energy is placed on the grid, energy is taken off the grid. It is a bit more complicated than that, but not too much. No lights would go out. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/4 "2010-05-19T21:34:49Z")
I believe the point of the Commissioner of the ACC is not that he wants to have power shut off to the city, its that the economies of the California and Arizona are very entwined and that economic boycotts are not the way to try and change policy. To say your going to boycott Arizona yet still buy your power from them seems disingenuous. ETA: Much like saying you’re not going to respond to threats, after you just got through threatening them. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/5 "2010-05-19T21:37:11Z")
In a similar vein, I understand Seattle has decided to bar city contracts with Arizona businesses… except for the one they already have for their traffic-control system. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/6 "2010-05-19T21:38:34Z")
Kind of like you and your spouse planning to separate and divorce, yet still having sex 2-3 times a week. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/7 "2010-05-19T21:41:16Z")
I am waiting for Arizona to also try to mess with the water supplies in the Colorado river as well. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/8 "2010-05-19T21:51:41Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > I am waiting for Arizona to also try to mess with the water supplies in the Colorado river as well. They could send them illegal aliens rather than water. Each one of those has to contain at least 15 gallons. Don’t drink the water! ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/9 "2010-05-19T21:57:20Z")
> [@Wilbo523](#): > > I believe the point of the Commissioner of the ACC is not that he wants to have power shut off to the city, its that the economies of the California and Arizona are very entwined and that economic boycotts are not the way to try and change policy. To say your going to boycott Arizona yet still buy your power from them seems disingenuous. > > ETA: Much like saying you’re not going to respond to threats, after you just got through threatening them. Well, LA may very well take their energy contracts elsewhere, its hardly going to matter. We’ll see what LA does with respect to the electricity contracts they have with Arizona companies. The Commissioner’s letter is grandstanding nonsense, as for the City of Los Angeles, we’ll see, I suppose. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/10 "2010-05-20T02:28:51Z")
I wonder if there’s any penalty for Arizona breaking the contract. I wonder if this letter counts as a declaration of intent to do so. ---
**Author:** ![Dallas\_Jones](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dallas_jones/32/3277_2.png) [@Dallas\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dallas_Jones)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/11 "2010-05-20T02:41:46Z")
Don’t forget to boycott Arizona Tea. Well, it’s bottled in New York, but it’'s got Arizona in the _name_ so it’s teh evil. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/12 "2010-05-20T02:52:41Z")
Of course it is really a boycott. The point of a boycott (or similar sanctions) is to put pressure on your opponent at a minimum of inconvenience to yourself, not cut off your own nose to spite their face. Having said that, I do think that L.A.'s threat of a boycott is a rather silly and unnecessary response to Arizona’s execrable, and widely condemned, new law (which is, surely, going to be quickly blocked, and then overturned in the courts, anyway). ---
**Author:** ![Zephyurs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/dfb087/32.png) [@Zephyurs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zephyurs)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/13 "2010-05-20T03:11:22Z")
The greater the proportion of LA’s power AZ provides, the more impotent the threat. In fact, since LA dwarfs AZ in population and power use, I am pretty sure that whatever the values, the proportion of LA’s total power the ACC provides is much lower than the proportion of ACC’s power that LA buys. IOW, AZ has no leverage. Of course, that doesn’t change the fact that LA itself is just grandstanding, driven more by internal politics than any real meaningful attempt to effect change. (I’d say it’s a 10 to 1 ratio.) ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/14 "2010-05-20T03:53:57Z")
[Here’s LA’s response](http://www.ladwpnews.com/go/doc/1475/555479/), where they point out that despite the plants being in AZ, they’re partially owned by the city of Los Angles. ---
**Author:** ![EvilTOJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee59a6/32.png) [@EvilTOJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EvilTOJ)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 8:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/15 "2010-05-20T08:37:39Z")
Even if they did do a full on boycott of buying power, they’d still end up buying it. Power generation comes from a variety of power plants, and it’s bought and sold like shares of stock. If LA doesn’t buy it, the price will go down, and some other state/county/city will buy it, who will then sell it to LA. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 8:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/16 "2010-05-20T08:57:02Z")
> [@EvilTOJ](#): > > Even if they did do a full on boycott of buying power, they’d still end up buying it. Power generation comes from a variety of power plants, and it’s bought and sold like shares of stock. If LA doesn’t buy it, the price will go down, and some other state/county/city will buy it, who will then sell it to LA. Which would mean that Arizona would lose money, which is exactly what they want. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 9:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/17 "2010-05-20T09:43:29Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Which would mean that Arizona would lose money, which is exactly what they want. Or raise the price. Summer’s coming. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-boycott-really-a-boycott-if-you-only-stop-buying-non-essentials/540051/18 "2010-05-20T13:09:09Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > widely condemned, new law Interesting definition of widely condemned: 60% of Americans support the law in Arizona.