# Is a cardinal allowed to vote for himself to be the next Pope? NT **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 27, 2013, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-cardinal-allowed-to-vote-for-himself-to-be-the-next-pope-nt/651570 "2013-02-27T23:25:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2013, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-cardinal-allowed-to-vote-for-himself-to-be-the-next-pope-nt/651570/21 "2013-02-28T17:58:40Z")
> [@Pleonast](#): > > When was the last time the newly elected Pope was not previously a Cardinal? Been a while: [1378](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Urban_VI). Apparently it only happened because a mob was threatening to burn down St. Peter’s if they didn’t pick a Roman. ETA: ninja’d. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2013, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-cardinal-allowed-to-vote-for-himself-to-be-the-next-pope-nt/651570/22 "2013-02-28T18:20:41Z")
> [@moriah](#): > > Voting for oneself can have a embarrassing result, even with secret balloting. > > If in the early rounds of voting a huge majority of cardinals got one vote, it would be obvious they were voting for themselves. > > If in the last round of voting the 2/3 majority was surpassed with 100% of the votes going to ‘the winner,’ then everyone would know you voted for yourself. > > Awkwarrrrrrrd. It’s not reported in that manner. As I understand it, the only report is “Yes: a majority for X”, or “No: no majority.” I’m not clear on how the nominations work, but I don’t think it’s just a free-for-all vote, the candidates are identified and discussed, and you can’t vote for anyone not on the list. So certainly it would be assumed that one vote came from the person who nominated you. ---
**Author:** ![OldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/3bc359/32.png) [@OldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2013, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-cardinal-allowed-to-vote-for-himself-to-be-the-next-pope-nt/651570/23 "2013-02-28T18:44:31Z")
> [@yellowjacketcoder](#): > > Last pope not a cardinal was Pope Urban VI in 1378. > > Last pope not a priest was Pope Leo X in 1513. You can be a cardinal and not be a priest? I seem to recall from Becket that when he was going to be ordained as Archbishop they had to raise him from a deacon(?) to a priest first. Now I realize that is a movie and an Archbishop is not the Pope, but somehow I thought the same would be true, You could be voted in as Pope, but you’d then have to be ordained a priest before you could actually become pope. You might of course mean Leo X wasn’t previously a priest. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2013, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-cardinal-allowed-to-vote-for-himself-to-be-the-next-pope-nt/651570/24 "2013-02-28T18:59:33Z")
As I recall my vague but nitpicking grade school discussions - you do have to be a priest to be a bishop, but cardinals could be anybody. There just is no great openings or career paths for non-priest cardinals, so they have almost exclusively been priests in the last few centuries. IIRC from what I read, the results are announced. It’s like a political convention to elect a party leader (really, you Americans should try that sort of convntion) - but nobody drops out. the popular ones go into the conclave with a herd of supporters who are part of their faction. Then a candidate may rise in votes during balloting as more people ar drawn to one favorite or another, only to start dropping as the fickle realize that there is enough opposition to that candidate that they cannot hope for a win. Then someone else, or a candidate who is acceptable to all the factions or perceived as able to win, may start to rise instead… and then fall in turn. ---
**Author:** ![yellowjacketcoder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/4bbf92/32.png) [@yellowjacketcoder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yellowjacketcoder)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2013, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-cardinal-allowed-to-vote-for-himself-to-be-the-next-pope-nt/651570/25 "2013-02-28T19:00:32Z")
> [@OldGuy](#): > > You can be a cardinal and not be a priest? I seem to recall from Becket that when he was going to be ordained as Archbishop they had to raise him from a deacon(?) to a priest first. Now I realize that is a movie and an Archbishop is not the Pope, but somehow I thought the same would be true, You could be voted in as Pope, but you’d then have to be ordained a priest before you could actually become pope. You might of course mean Leo X wasn’t previously a priest. I noticed that too. I got the names off [this site](http://wdtprs.com/blog/2013/02/interesting-papal-trivia/) and looked the dates up on wikipedia. To be fair, wiki gives those two the same appellations. Looking deeper, it seems Leo X was a “cardinal-deacon”, and never given Holy Orders until elected Pope. Looking furter, cardinal is not an ordained position (it is just usually given to bishops, who DO have to be ordained). It’s more of an administrative role than an ecclesiastical one. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2013, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-cardinal-allowed-to-vote-for-himself-to-be-the-next-pope-nt/651570/26 "2013-02-28T19:02:21Z")
> [@OldGuy](#): > > You can be a cardinal and not be a priest? I seem to recall from Becket that when he was going to be ordained as Archbishop they had to raise him from a deacon(?) to a priest first. Now I realize that is a movie and an Archbishop is not the Pope, but somehow I thought the same would be true, You could be voted in as Pope, but you’d then have to be ordained a priest before you could actually become pope. You might of course mean Leo X wasn’t previously a priest. There were lay-cardinals up until 1917\*. Technically it was 1899 when the last one died but until 1917 it was possible for the Pope to make a lay person a cardinal. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-cardinal-allowed-to-vote-for-himself-to-be-the-next-pope-nt/651570.md?page=1)