# Is a decent cable news network too much to ask?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171
**Category:** The BBQ Pit
**Created:** [February 3, 2005, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171 "2005-02-03T14:48:11Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/1 "2005-02-03T14:48:11Z")
So it’s Thursday morning and I have the day off. I get up, walk downstairs, make breakfast, and turn on the TV. Nothing’s on, so I turn it to Fox news.
Some newscaster (and I use the term loosly) is talking about how the State of the Union was so moving last night that it made his whole family weep. “There wasn’t a dry eye in my house”, I think he said. Disgusted with the obvious bias, I turn it to CNN.
They’re running a story about how some obscure Lt. Colonel in the midwest said that “war is fun” when he gave a speech to his local rotary club or whoever. “Well. _that’s_ a tempest in a teapot”, I think, and turn it back to Fox.
_click_ Fox:“Some scholars are already comparing the President’s speech to the Gettysburg Adress.” _click_ CNN: “Will the President’s plan to privatize social security kill your grandmother?” _click_ Fox: “The pope has been in ill health recently. When he recovers, should he saint George W. Bush?” _click_ CNN: “Dr. J.J. Jingleheimershmitz is here to discuss how President Bush pours the blood of Iraqi children over his cheerios every morning. Doctor?”
Ug. Sometimes it’s tough to be a moderate. But then I get the bright idea of turning it to MSNBC. They tend to be relatively unbiased. Unbiased, because they’re running a story on “What to get your man for Valentines Day. Later in the hour, can a new invention from Japan really make your dog talk?” Unbiased, but still crap.
So my humble plea: Can we _please_ get a decent cable news channel.?
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### Author:  [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/2 "2005-02-03T15:18:02Z")
You’re on the money when it comes to MSNBC. When they’re actually doing news, it tends to be reasonably straightforward. But half the time when I tune in, they’re doing “Headliners and Legends,” which threatens to turn them into a clone of the E! network, or “Imus in the Morning” (Imus can be entertaining, but it’s not really very good television, I’m afraid). The weekends are particularly awful.
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### Author:  [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/3 "2005-02-03T15:24:00Z")
I find MSNBC to be fairly even-handed. If FOX indeed compared it to the Gettysburg Address they are even more partisan than I thought. I don’t recall Lincoln using the parents of a dead soldier as political pawns in his speech.
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### Author:  [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/4 "2005-02-03T15:55:44Z")
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#):
>
> _click_ Fox:“Some scholars are already comparing the President’s speech to the Gettysburg Adress.” _click_ CNN: “Will the President’s plan to privatize social security kill your grandmother?” _click_ Fox: “The pope has been in ill health recently. When he recovers, should he saint George W. Bush?” _click_ CNN: “Dr. J.J. Jingleheimershmitz is here to discuss how President Bush pours the blood of Iraqi children over his cheerios every morning. Doctor?”
If you’re really asserting that CNN is that tough on Bush, i submit that you either haven’t actually been watching CNN for the last few years, or that you haven’t understood it.
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### Author:  [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/5 "2005-02-03T16:13:26Z")
**Bob** , **mhendo** , please understand that my OP is mostly hyperbole. The weeping newcaster and the Lt. Colonel are true, the rest is completely made up. Fox leans far to the right, and after Fox gained dominance in the ratings, CNN has started to lean more and more to the left.
And no, **mhendo** , CNN did not actually say that Bush pours the blood of Iraqi children on his cheerios. Come on man, lighten up, liberals are supposed to have a sense of humor. Which is why I have to grudgingly admit that I get a lot of my news from _The Daily Show with Jon Stewart_.
It’s the pretense of impartiality I don’t like, and both Fox and CNN are guilty of it.
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### Author:  [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/6 "2005-02-03T16:15:20Z")
You got me. The quotes you made up from FOX were entirely believeable to me. I thought they were real quotes.
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### Author:  [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/7 "2005-02-03T16:21:30Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#):
>
> You got me. The quotes you made up from FOX were entirely believeable to me. I thought they were real quotes.
_::Chuckle::_
Oh Jesus, it’s worse than I thought. Has their bias reached such epic proportions that you actually believed they were pondering if the Pope would saint Dubya?
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### Author:  [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/8 "2005-02-03T16:25:20Z")
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#):
>
> **Bob** , **mhendo** , please understand that my OP is mostly hyperbole. The weeping newcaster and the Lt. Colonel are true, the rest is completely made up. Fox leans far to the right, and after Fox gained dominance in the ratings, CNN has started to lean more and more to the left.
>
> And no, **mhendo** , CNN did not actually say that Bush pours the blood of Iraqi children on his cheerios. Come on man, lighten up, liberals are supposed to have a sense of humor. Which is why I have to grudgingly admit that I get a lot of my news from _The Daily Show with Jon Stewart_.
>
> It’s the pretense of impartiality I don’t like, and both Fox and CNN are guilty of it.
I was quite aware that you were using hyperbole. But even now that you’re being serious, you’re still wrong, in my opinion.
CNN has not “started to lean more and more to the left.” In fact, over the past few years CNN has, if anything, become considerably more conservative than it once was. Sure, it’s still not as rabidly and obviously partisan as FOX, but “CNN” and “left-wing” just don’t belong in the same sentence.
I agree with you about the “pretense of impartiality” issue; i just think you’re incorrect in your characterization of CNN.
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### Author:  [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/9 "2005-02-03T16:35:20Z")
A very funny OP. Made me laugh out loud. 😃
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### Author:  [@Mr.Babbington](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Babbington)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/10 "2005-02-03T16:43:01Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#):
>
> I don’t recall Lincoln using the parents of a dead soldier as political pawns in his speech.
I hate Fox, can’t stand Bush. I don’t want to pick nits, or hijack the thread, but Lincoln did use the actual dead soldiers as political pawns in his speech. Sure, it was elegant, but the dead soldiers were pawns. No matter how just or noble the war, the soldiers are always political pawns.
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### Author:  [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/11 "2005-02-03T17:01:02Z")
> [@Mr. Babbington](#):
>
> I hate Fox, can’t stand Bush. I don’t want to pick nits, or hijack the thread, but Lincoln did use the actual dead soldiers as political pawns in his speech. Sure, it was elegant, but the dead soldiers were pawns. No matter how just or noble the war, the soldiers are always political pawns.
You’re dead on. Consider the use made of dead soldiers in this speech:
> [@Abraham Lincoln](#):
>
> Fourscore and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent a new nation, conceived in liberty and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal.
>
> Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation or any nation so conceived and so dedicated can long endure. We are met on a great battlefield of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of it as a final resting place for those who died here that the nation might live. This we may, in all propriety do. But in a larger sense, we cannot dedicate, we cannot consecrate, we cannot hallow this ground. The brave men, living and dead who struggled here have hallowed it far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here.
>
> It is rather for us the living, we here be dedicated to the great task remaining before us–that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they here gave the last full measure of devotion–that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain, that this nation shall have a new birth of freedom, and that government of the people, by the people, for the people shall not perish from the earth."
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### Author:  [@Aro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aro)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/12 "2005-02-03T17:06:14Z")
The funniest thing to me is that there _really_ are people out there who thing that CNN is leftist.
That very idea cracks me up every time.
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### Author:  [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/13 "2005-02-03T17:09:00Z")
There hasn’t been a wartime president that hasn’t mentioned the valor of the fallen soldiers in a speech. But did Lincoln ever put the parents of killed Union soldiers on display? It was cheap of Bush to do this, and worse for the parents of the soldier to whore themselves out like that.
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### Author:  [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/14 "2005-02-03T17:17:38Z")
> [@mhendo](#):
>
> I agree with you about the “pretense of impartiality” issue; i just think you’re incorrect in your characterization of CNN.
Well, we’re all entitled to our opinions.
CNN is more subtle than FOX, but the bias is still obvious if you’re a moderate. As an example, CNN is on my TV now, and the anchor just said, (actual quote) “in last night’s debate, pardon me, in last nights address…” Very subtle, but still there. You get the feeling that the producers and whoever writes the copy for the teleprompter haven’t gotten over the fact that John Kerry lost the election. You don’t honestly think a highly paid newsguy can’t read a teleprompter? On CNN, this kind of thing happens far too often for me to not think that there is some kind of bias.
It’s a systemic bias, also indicated by how the previous segment sub-posted a statistic highlating the fact that blacks die younger than whites in a story about social security. Is that really germaine to the story? No, of course it isn’t. So why play the race card?
**Lib** , thanks. I was going more for laughs than a serious discussion.
**Early** , ragging on MSNBC reminded me of something. I remember when Saddam was captured and MSNBC built a plywood replica of his spiderhole. Watching the reporter read the story from inside the spider hole was hilarious. They’re the only one of the three that doesn’t show an obvious bias, but good lord, are they ever inept. My high school media class could have done a better job than that. _::chuckle::_
**Aro** , open your eyes. _Every_ source of media has a political slant. This is why newspapers have op-ed pages. I’ll admit CNN is not nearly as bad as FOX (“fair and ballanced” my ass), but you have to be blind not to see the way CNN leans.
Damn, am I the only moderate left in this country?
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### Author:  [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/15 "2005-02-03T17:25:51Z")
> [@mhendo](#):
>
> .
>
> CNN has not “started to lean more and more to the left.” In fact, over the past few years CNN has, if anything, become considerably more conservative than it once was. Sure, it’s still not as rabidly and obviously partisan as FOX, but “CNN” and “left-wing” just don’t belong in the same sentence.
FTR, I agree with your observation. CNN is hardly the radical leftist organization that the right paints them to be. No way would I call it “left-wing.” Not by any stretch of the imagination.
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### Author:  [@Aro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aro)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/16 "2005-02-03T17:30:16Z")
> [@](#):
>
> **Aro** , open your eyes. Every source of media has a political slant. This is why newspapers have op-ed pages. I’ll admit CNN is not nearly as bad as FOX (“fair and ballanced” my ass), but you have to be blind not to see the way CNN leans.
I certainly do see the way it leans, and it is firmly to the right of centre.
All you Americans can bicker and argue over the petty and miniscule differences between your news outlets ( and your political parties ), but the true difference is so tiny it barely registers to anyone outside your boundaries. CNN is right wing just as Clinton was right wing. You just have no external perspective in which to view the situation as it really is.
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### Author:  [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/17 "2005-02-03T17:30:26Z")
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#):
>
> CNN is more subtle than FOX, but the bias is still obvious if you’re a moderate. As an example, CNN is on my TV now, and the anchor just said, (actual quote) “in last night’s debate, pardon me, in last nights address…” Very subtle, but still there. You get the feeling that the producers and whoever writes the copy for the teleprompter haven’t gotten over the fact that John Kerry lost the election. You don’t honestly think a highly paid newsguy can’t read a teleprompter? On CNN, this kind of thing happens far too often for me to not think that there is some kind of bias.
Ah, see now i understand where your confusion lies. You’re having trouble discerning the difference between “favoring Democrats over Republicans” with “leaning to the left.” Not the same thing.
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#):
>
> It’s a systemic bias, also indicated by how the previous segment sub-posted a statistic highlating the fact that blacks die younger than whites in a story about social security. Is that really germaine to the story? No, of course it isn’t. So why play the race card?
Why is it not “germaine”? A key aspect to the debate over social security is the relative length of time that people pay into the system, versus the amount of time they receive benefits. The debate is also, on a more general level, about who does and does not benefit from the system as it currently stands. If black people are, on average, dying sooner after retirement age than white people, why isn’t this relevant to the issue? I’m not saying it’s the most important thing, but to call it irrelevant seems to me to misunderstand the nature of the debate over social security.
> [@A Monkey With a Gun](#):
>
> Damn, am I the only moderate left in this country?
Yes, you poor dear, it’s just you and your gun (and your bananas) fighting a lone battle against the forces of extremism.
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### Author:  [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/18 "2005-02-03T17:48:55Z")
> [@Mr. Babbington](#):
>
> I don’t want to pick nits, or hijack the thread, but Lincoln did use the actual dead soldiers as political pawns in his speech. Sure, it was elegant, but the dead soldiers were pawns. No matter how just or noble the war, the soldiers are always political pawns.
Lincoln mentioned dead soldiers in a speech dedicating a **battlefield cemetary**???
How dare he play politics by talking about dead people at a cemetary!
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### Author:  [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/19 "2005-02-03T17:57:00Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#):
>
> There hasn’t been a wartime president that hasn’t mentioned the valor of the fallen soldiers in a speech. But did Lincoln ever put the parents of killed Union soldiers on display? It was cheap of Bush to do this, and worse for the parents of the soldier to whore themselves out like that.
It’s a bit strange to hear you denounce this, considering one of your heroes was a master of the form.
From Bill Clinton’s 1995 SOTU:
> [@](#):
>
> I want to finish up here by pointing out some folks that are up with the First Lady that represent what I’m trying to talk about. Citizens. I have no idea what their party affiliation is or who they voted for in the last election, but they represent what we ought to be doing.
>
> …Cpl. Gregory Depestre went to Haiti as part of his adopted country’s force to help secure democracy in his native land. And I might add we must be the only country in the world that could have gone to Haiti and taken Haitian-Americans there who could speak the language and talk to the people, and he was one of them and we’re proud of him.
From his 1998 SOTU:
> [@](#):
>
> I wish all of you could have seen our troops in Tuzla. They’re very proud of what they are doing in Bosnia, and we’re all very proud of them. One of those – one of those brave soldiers is sitting with the first lady tonight: Army Sergeant Michael Tolbert. His father was a decorated Vietnam vet. After college in Colorado, he joined the Army. Last year he led an infantry unit that stopped a mob of extremists from taking over a radio station that is a voice of democracy and tolerance in Bosnia. Thank you very much, Sergeant, for what you represent.
From his 1999 SOTU:
> [@](#):
>
> America will continue to contain [Iraqi President] Saddam [Hussein] and we will work for the day when Iraq has a government worthy of its people. Now, last month, in our action over Iraq, our troops were superb. Their mission was so flawlessly executed, that we risk taking for granted the bravery and skill it required. Captain Jeff Taliaferro, a 10-year Air Force veteran of the Air Force, flew a B-1B bomber over Iraq as we attacked Saddam’s war machine. He is here with us tonight. I would like to ask you to honor him and all the 33,000 men and women of Operation Desert Fox.
From his 2000 SOTU:
> [@](#):
>
> When Slobodan Milosevic unleashed his terror on Kosovo, Captain John Cherrey was one of the brave airmen who turned the tide. And when another American plane was shot down over Serbia, he flew into the teeth of enemy air defenses to bring his fellow pilot home. Thanks to our Armed Forces’ skill and bravery, we prevailed in Kosovo without losing a single American in combat. (Applause.) I want to introduce Captain Cherrey to you. We honor Captain Cherrey, and we promise you, Captain, we’ll finish the job you began. Stand up so we can see you. (Applause.)
We also know that Clinton wasn’t afraid to show a grieving family member, if it would help his case. Also from the 2000 SOTU:
> [@](#):
>
> Now, we have all seen what happens when guns fall into the wrong hands. Daniel Mauser was only 15 years old when he was gunned down at Columbine. He was an amazing kid – a straight-A student, a good skier. Like all parents who lose their children, his father Tom has borne unimaginable grief. Somehow he has found the strength to honor his son by transforming his grief into action. Earlier this month, he took a leave of absence from his job to fight for tougher gun safety laws. I pray that his courage and wisdom will at long last move this Congress to make common-sense gun legislation the very next order of business. (Applause.)
>
> Tom Mauser, stand up. We thank you for being here tonight. (Applause.) Tom. Thank you, Tom. (Applause.)
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### Author:  [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)
#### Post date: [February 3, 2005, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-decent-cable-news-network-too-much-to-ask/288171/20 "2005-02-03T18:02:02Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#):
>
> It was cheap of Bush to do this, and worse for the parents of the soldier to whore themselves out like that.
Fuck you, shitstain. Mr. and Mrs. Norwood are actual human beings who can make for themselves the choices they want to as regards their son.
Tell you what. You can reach them. Specifically, you can write to the:
Sgt. Byron Wayne Norwood Memorial Fund
c/o Texas Association of Counties
P.O. Box 2131
Austin, TX 78768
Go ahead. Write. Tell them they were “stooges.” Tell them they were “worse than cheap.” You are a worthless piece of garbage.
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