# Is a movie that films overseas for a scene "cultural appropriation"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** movies\ **Created:** [November 27, 2020, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599 "2020-11-27T15:10:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/41 "2020-11-30T02:49:39Z")
> [@cytop](#): > > Just as dumb as the Mission Impossible plots… Good point. Any discussion of M:I film franchise has to begin by justifying the notion of Jim Phelps not being the protagonist. Since this is, by definition, not possible, there’s no point in considering the films as discussable. It’s like making a film version of _How the Grinch Stole Christmas_ and having the Grinch be the barber who cuts the guy who actually steals Christmas’s hair. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/42 "2020-11-30T02:57:40Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Any tourist town I’ve been in, people are ambivalent toward tourists. Is that not your experience? It’s exacerbated during the pandemic, but it’s always a tension. It’s not a tension that ever gets reflected in promotional materials, of course. _”If they’d just send their money and stay home themselves, they wouldn’t be so bad…”_ ---
**Author:** ![Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulf_the_Unwashed)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/43 "2020-11-30T03:10:16Z")
I was vacationing in a vacationy spot in Maine a few years back. Parked in a driveway was a car with a Maine license plate that read GO HOME. I thought that message was… Rather clear. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/44 "2020-11-30T03:39:13Z")
> [@Brayne\_Ded](#): > > For me too. It’s one thing to have an “exotic” setting. Whatever exotic means. I take it to mean a place that you have not been to. To give an example, some people think Japan is exotic. However, I lived there, and it can be just as workaday as anywhere else in the world. > > What irks me is cultural misrepresentation, which is one of Hollywood’s main achievements. To give an example, Disney’s recent attempt at _Mulan_ . I’m glad you mentioned the Japanese. In my opinion their appropriation of European culture for video games exported back to the West was a good thing. The early Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy games are some of my favorites, but they certainly don’t realistically represent medieval Europe. None the less, I have no issue with Square and Enix doing what they did. I think it’s likely that video games may have died out in the 1980s had they not been “appropriated” by Nintendo and Sega during that time period. So in my book I have no issue with this sort of thing. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/45 "2020-11-30T04:00:33Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > And this is maybe not so much about cultural appropriation as it is about exoticizing and fetishizing other folks’ homes. Does it make a difference when the locals are willing participants in the exoticizing? We’re talking about Dubai here and they’ve made a concerted effort to present themselves to the world as a tourist destination with their shopping, recreation, and ostentatious construction projects. The United Arab Emirates actively encourages Hollywood to film movies over there. I don’t see this so much as exploitation as I see it as a cultural exchange. At the very least, I think we can both agree that filming a movie in Dubai is quite a bit different from the slides of misery tourism that was inflicted on you. And was Dubai exoticized or fetishized in the Mission Impossible movie? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/46 "2020-11-30T04:09:24Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > Does it make a difference when the locals are willing participants in the exoticizing? We’re talking about Dubai here and they’ve made a concerted effort to present themselves to the world as a tourist destination with their shopping, recreation, and ostentatious construction projects. This is an interesting point, because it gets back to what I was saying earlier about how you can’t characterize a whole nation (or city) in this way. Plenty of Dubai locals aren’t willing participants in any economic activity: [there’s significant slavery in the city](https://www.news.com.au/travel/destinations/middle-east/dubai-migrant-workers-the-hidden-slaves-behind-glamour-city/news-story/b3997ed5b013870424e84d78a561946c). I have trouble believing that most enslaved folks in Dubai are happy with the city’s tourist-friendly facade; they might prefer that media provide a more accurate view of the human rights violations they face. But that, of course, wouldn’t provide escapist entertainment. And it wouldn’t line the pockets of Dubai’s elite. So there’s little incentive for that sort of accurate depiction of the city. > [@](#): > > And was Dubai exoticized or fetishized in the Mission Impossible movie? I haven’t seen the latest movie and remember pretty much nothing about earlier movies in the franchise, so I’m discussing generalities and not particulars. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/47 "2020-11-30T04:36:48Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > This is an interesting point, because it gets back to what I was saying earlier about how you can’t characterize a whole nation (or city) in this way. Plenty of Dubai locals aren’t willing participants in any economic activity: [there’s significant slavery in the city](https://www.news.com.au/travel/destinations/middle-east/dubai-migrant-workers-the-hidden-slaves-behind-glamour-city/news-story/b3997ed5b013870424e84d78a561946c). You’re right that the UAE treats its foreign workers terribly, and I agree with you in regards to calling it slavery, but I didn’t bring it up because it doesn’t have anything to do with whether or not filming in Dubai is a form of cultural appropriation or exoticizing. (And that’s even before getting into whether or not those slave laborers are locals or not. I lived in Munich for three years but I never considered myself a local.) Even if some people aren’t willing participants, that still doesn’t make filming an action scene on the Burj Khalifa a form of appropriation or exoticization. Especially when the UAE is actively encouraging production crews to film in their country. It is unfortunate that cultural appropriation is most often thought of in a negative light these days. It can be negative, yes. But very often critics of appropriation view non-western cultures as victims with little to no agency. And for places like the UAE, China, and Japan this just isn’t the case. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/48 "2020-11-30T11:04:00Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I actually see that he’s got another film coming out soon, adding Timothée Chalamet to his usual cast of characters. It’s set in France. The French don’t complain when people appropriate their culture - they complain when people _don’t._ ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/49 "2020-11-30T12:12:56Z")
Cultural appropriation would be if the studio doesn’t make a motion picture at all and instead tells their hackneyed story using smoke signals or giant petroglyphs. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/50 "2020-11-30T12:21:57Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > You’re right that the UAE treats its foreign workers terribly, and I agree with you in regards to calling it slavery, but I didn’t bring it up because it doesn’t have anything to do with whether or not filming in Dubai is a form of cultural appropriation or exoticizing. It’s relevant because of the counterargument “but the locals WANT it to happen.” It’s always more complicated than that, and that’s not a good counterargument. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/51 "2020-11-30T12:22:25Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > > > And this is maybe not so much about cultural appropriation as it is about exoticizing and fetishizing other folks’ homes. > > Does it make a difference when the locals are willing participants in the exoticizing? We’re talking about Dubai here and they’ve made a concerted effort to present themselves to the world as a tourist destination with their shopping, recreation, and ostentatious construction projects. The United Arab Emirates actively encourages Hollywood to film movies over there. I don’t see this so much as exploitation as I see it as a cultural exchange. At the very least, I think we can both agree that filming a movie in Dubai is quite a bit different from the slides of misery tourism that was inflicted on you. > > And was Dubai exoticized or fetishized in the Mission Impossible movie? I don’t think it’s “cultural appropriation” if all you are doing is filming a gunfight on the outside of the Burj Dubai or jumping a racecar between two skyscrapers. ---
**Author:** ![Brayne\_Ded](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Brayne\_Ded](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brayne_Ded)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/52 "2020-11-30T12:35:03Z")
Video games don’t really represent anything realistically, and cinematic depictions of anything medieval tend not to be realistic. Anyway, where is the dividing line between cultural appropriation and cultural exchange (the latter in the literal and not the euphemistic sense)? For example, Europe had a big thing about chinoiserie in the 18C, and what we see of its nowadays can be rather amusing since we have a far more complete picture of the countries concerned. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/53 "2020-11-30T12:39:58Z")
Most likely, it is a welcome shot in the arm for the local economy. Often, it showcases areas that would find more tourist trade a very welcome thing. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/54 "2020-11-30T13:34:34Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > It’s set in France. The French don’t complain when people appropriate their culture - they complain when people _don’t._ There have certainly been complaints about the Netflix show “Emily in Paris”. > **[“Embarrassing”: Netflix’s ‘Emily in Paris’ Blasted by French Critics](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/general-news/embarrassing-netflixs-emily-in-paris-blasted-by-french-critics-4071283/)** > > The City of Light is pretty dark on Netflix’s new series Emily in Paris, with Parisians up in arms over the romantic comedy that stars Lily Collins as an American naif overcoming al… ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/55 "2020-11-30T13:49:41Z")
> [@Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](#): > > I was vacationing in a vacationy spot in Maine a few years back. Parked in a driveway was a car with a Maine license plate that read GO HOME. I thought that message was… Rather clear. This kind of anti-tourist stuff really gets my goat. So you live somewhere nice, lucky you. Do you own the place? Do you have to be such an arsehole to visitors? Don’t you ever go on holiday? I’ve lived in London (tourists get swallowed up by the throng) and worked in Bath (where I habitually felt like the only person there who _wasn’t_ a tourist), and tourists never bugged me. I liked seeing people enjoy themselves in ‘my town’. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/56 "2020-11-30T13:54:18Z")
To the OP, I don’t like the way everything gets branded as ‘cultural appropriation’ these days. Taken to the enth degree, it means writers can never write about anything outside their immediate environment, and actors can’t take on characters which don’t reflect their own direct experience. It’s the death of artistic experiment. Provided dominant societies treat other cultures with respect, I generally don’t see the issue. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/57 "2020-11-30T14:15:45Z")
> [@Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](#): > > I was vacationing in a vacationy spot in Maine a few years back. Parked in a driveway was a car with a Maine license plate that read GO HOME Guess that’s not the car they take on their weekends in Montreal or Boston. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/58 "2020-11-30T15:05:24Z")
> [@SanVito](#): > > Taken to the enth degree, it means writers can never write about anything outside their immediate environment, and actors can’t take on characters which don’t reflect their own direct experience. It’s the death of artistic experiment. But that’s the current gestalt, isn’t it? All art has to be autobiographical. Look at contemporary popular singers - all they ever sing about is themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/59 "2020-11-30T16:03:42Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I don’t think it’s “cultural appropriation” if all you are doing is filming a gunfight on the outside of the Burj Dubai or jumping a racecar between two skyscrapers. I don’t think so either. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599/60 "2020-11-30T16:08:38Z")
as Shatner said, a lot of these ticked off people need to seriously get a life. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-movie-that-films-overseas-for-a-scene-cultural-appropriation/926599.md?page=4)