# Is A Nightmare On Elm Street unfairly hated because of the sequels? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 23, 2012, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-nightmare-on-elm-street-unfairly-hated-because-of-the-sequels/626017 "2012-06-23T03:09:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-nightmare-on-elm-street-unfairly-hated-because-of-the-sequels/626017/21 "2012-06-23T16:19:33Z")
> [@grude](#): > > I could SWEAR it was at least heavily implied he both molested and killed the kids, his threats to Nancy are full of sexual menace. Nope. Craven wanted to make him a pedophile, but the studio said no. So all he ever was was a child murderer. > **[A Nightmare on Elm Street](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Nightmare_on_Elm_Street#Loss_of_innocence)** > > A Nightmare on Elm Street is a 1984 American supernatural slasher film written and directed by Wes Craven and produced by Robert Shaye. It is the first installment in the A Nightmare on Elm Street franchise and stars Heather Langenkamp, John Saxon, Ronee Blakley, Robert Englund as Freddy Krueger, and Johnny Depp in his film debut. The film's plot concerns a group of teenagers who are targeted by Krueger, an undead child killer who murders teenagers through their dreams, as retribution again Cr... ---
**Author:** ![oreally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ab992/32.png) [@oreally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oreally)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2012, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-nightmare-on-elm-street-unfairly-hated-because-of-the-sequels/626017/22 "2012-06-23T19:03:43Z")
> [@grude](#): > > The original ANOES was a very smart and imaginative horror film, the reality bending plot was original and cool. Effects are good, and the realistic female protagonist who is not sexualized a nice touch. > > So why is it so hated and laughed at? Mostly by people who haven’t actually watched it, just the campy sequels or cultural osmosis. I mostly agree on the orig and I’m not even a horror flick fan. Saw #2 and #3, both incredibly bad and realized now they were just acting like all other “the villian never dies” flicks. Lame, boring. Didn’t know it was “so hated” etc but again when the topic comes up I typically tune out anyway. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2012, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-nightmare-on-elm-street-unfairly-hated-because-of-the-sequels/626017/23 "2012-06-24T22:20:30Z")
Even the sequels aren’t really that bad. Two (Freddy’s Revenge) gets a lot of grief for doing something different and some supposedly homoerotic imagery, but it’s not nearly as bad as people like to say. Overall it’s quite an aberration from the rest of the series, and thus easily skippable, but not something you need to pretend doesn’t exist like Highlander 2. Three (Dream Warriors) rightfully is considered perhaps the best of the series, though I wouldn’t argue with those who still think one is the best. It’s here where Freddy really goes from “slasher in your dreams” to all the creative stuff he’s typically thought of for doing. He had a few one liners in the past, but here’s where he really starts showing his wit as well. Interesting he really gets fully developed in the third, because similarly, it wasn’t until the third F13 where Jason really took his iconic form with the hockey mask. Maybe the third time really is the charm. Four (Dream Master) wasn’t as good as three, but still not bad. Cheesy 80’s montage training scene aside, it stands up pretty well. Five (Dream Child) a huge drop from four, probably the worst of the numbered NOES movies, but still something you could watch without ripping your eyes out. Freddy’s Dead: The Final Nightmare is a total abomination, not even worth watching unless you want to laugh at the sight of a young Breckin Meyer or a 5 second cameo by Johnny Depp (one of the stars of the first movie). The less said about Roseanne and Tom Arnold’s cameo, the better. Apparently this one’s not even canon, based on Springwood still being a relatively normal town later on in FvJ. New Nightmare, pretty good, but I don’t really consider it part of the series any more than I consider the remake part of the series. Freddy vs Jason, I loved it, but it’s not even scary in the least bit, more of a fun homage to the two franchises. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Torque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2012, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-nightmare-on-elm-street-unfairly-hated-because-of-the-sequels/626017/24 "2012-06-25T14:40:25Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > Even the sequels aren’t really that bad. > > Two (Freddy’s Revenge) gets a lot of grief for doing something different and some supposedly homoerotic imagery, but it’s not nearly as bad as people like to say. Overall it’s quite an aberration from the rest of the series, and thus easily skippable, but not something you need to pretend doesn’t exist like Highlander 2. > > Three (Dream Warriors) rightfully is considered perhaps the best of the series, though I wouldn’t argue with those who still think one is the best. It’s here where Freddy really goes from “slasher in your dreams” to all the creative stuff he’s typically thought of for doing. He had a few one liners in the past, but here’s where he really starts showing his wit as well. Interesting he really gets fully developed in the third, because similarly, it wasn’t until the third F13 where Jason really took his iconic form with the hockey mask. Maybe the third time really is the charm. > > Four (Dream Master) wasn’t as good as three, but still not bad. Cheesy 80’s montage training scene aside, it stands up pretty well. > > Five (Dream Child) a huge drop from four, probably the worst of the numbered NOES movies, but still something you could watch without ripping your eyes out. > > Freddy’s Dead: The Final Nightmare is a total abomination, not even worth watching unless you want to laugh at the sight of a young Breckin Meyer or a 5 second cameo by Johnny Depp (one of the stars of the first movie). The less said about Roseanne and Tom Arnold’s cameo, the better. Apparently this one’s not even canon, based on Springwood still being a relatively normal town later on in FvJ. > > New Nightmare, pretty good, but I don’t really consider it part of the series any more than I consider the remake part of the series. > > Freddy vs Jason, I loved it, but it’s not even scary in the least bit, more of a fun homage to the two franchises. A decent summary, but I feel I should add a couple of notes: Part 2 isn’t merely “supposedly” homoerotic; it’s downright blatant. Cites: the androgynously-named protagonist “Jessie” and his girlish scream, the various close-ups of Jessie in his underwear doing “yankin’ the crank” dance moves and butt-bumping his dresser drawers shut, the fact that the movie features _two_ bare male asses and no breasts, the close relationship Jessie has with his buddy Grady and an alleged girlfriend we almost never see, Jessie accidentally running into his PE teacher at a gay bar shortly before said teacher is tied up with jumpropes and has his bare ass whipped with towels by Freddy…I could go on. Also, the director seemed to have a fundamental misunderstanding of what it is that scares people; apparently we’re supposed to be terrified of a malfunctioning thermostat, a dog wearing an old man mask, and an escaped parakeet. Most of the movie is bloodless; even Freddy’s rampage through the pool party shows no blood that I can recall. And yet, despite all these faults, it’s still not the worst of the sequels! I’m not as big a fan of Part 3 as others, because that’s where Freddy’s lame jokes and what I call “theme deaths” really began to take hold. In truth, Freddy’s first bad joke was in part 2, but by part 3 just about everything that came out of his mouth was a bad pun. Still, it was better than what followed, which is kinda like being the best baseball player in Tibet. Part 4 was fair, but seriously dumb in parts. Part 5 was a major misfire, featuring lots of pregnancy angst and mommy issues. And isn’t that what we all go to horror movies for? And Part 6, holy crap, what a turd. I can’t believe director Rachel Talalay is still allowed to work in Hollywood after that. If you know anyone who expresses a desire to see Part 6, just kill them; they clearly have no regard for their own sanity or well-being. **New Nightmare** was actually interesting, and I liked it even more than Part 3 for its creative storytelling. Freddy didn’t do much killing, but at least the menace was back, and there were no lame puns. **Freddy vs. Jason** wasn’t supposed to be anything more than just fun, I reckon, and it was. Now, as for the reboot – I think they really screwed up when they introduced a plotline of “what if Freddy was really innocent, and they killed him without justification, and now he’s out for revenge?”. They resolved that later, but it muddied the character for a significant portion of the movie. In the end, the movie just seemed sort of lacking, for reasons I can’t really put my finger on; maybe it was just that Freddy wasn’t menacing enough. Maybe the kids weren’t interesting enough to make us care about them. I dunno. Anyway, that’s my spin. ---
**Author:** ![JMH125](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ee59a6/32.png) [@JMH125](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JMH125)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2012, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-nightmare-on-elm-street-unfairly-hated-because-of-the-sequels/626017/25 "2012-06-25T17:24:13Z")
> [@grude](#): > > The original ANOES was a very smart and imaginative horror film, the reality bending plot was original and cool. Effects are good, and the realistic female protagonist who is not sexualized a nice touch. > > So why is it so hated and laughed at? Mostly by people who haven’t actually watched it, just the campy sequels or cultural osmosis. umm…i don’t think the original is laughed or hated at all. i think it is highly respected in the horror genre from practically everyone. ---
**Author:** ![JMH125](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ee59a6/32.png) [@JMH125](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JMH125)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2012, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-nightmare-on-elm-street-unfairly-hated-because-of-the-sequels/626017/26 "2012-06-25T17:29:42Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > Even the sequels aren’t really that bad. > > Two (Freddy’s Revenge) gets a lot of grief for doing something different and some supposedly homoerotic imagery, but it’s not nearly as bad as people like to say. Overall it’s quite an aberration from the rest of the series, and thus easily skippable, but not something you need to pretend doesn’t exist like Highlander 2. > > Three (Dream Warriors) rightfully is considered perhaps the best of the series, though I wouldn’t argue with those who still think one is the best. It’s here where Freddy really goes from “slasher in your dreams” to all the creative stuff he’s typically thought of for doing. He had a few one liners in the past, but here’s where he really starts showing his wit as well. Interesting he really gets fully developed in the third, because similarly, it wasn’t until the third F13 where Jason really took his iconic form with the hockey mask. Maybe the third time really is the charm. I saw part 2 recently and it’s not as bad as i remember it being. the homoerotic imagery was…surprising. i had forgotten about that. Part 3 really upped the ante with some cool sfx, far better than what the first one had, and an interesting plot and some characters you liked. I still get squeamish thinking about the guy moving around like a marionette with his bloody veins as strings…yech. ---
**Author:** ![Gerald\_II](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Gerald\_II](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gerald_II)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2012, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-nightmare-on-elm-street-unfairly-hated-because-of-the-sequels/626017/27 "2012-06-25T20:03:22Z")
In order of when I saw the films. **Nightmare On Elm Street 3: Dream Warriors** Probably the best of the series because the nightmare imagery is even more spectacular and you get a little bit of Freddy’s background. **Nightmare On Elm Street 2: Freddy’s Revenge** I like this film. It wasn’t as imaginative as the original and did away with killing-teenagers-in-their-dreams. But I thought it was a cool novelty to see Freddy in the real world and I liked that he was more of a silent killer in this film, opposed to the wise cracking caricature in the subsequent films. **Nightmare On Elm Street** Considering it was the first one, I find this to be the most stylish and innovative of the series. The intro was unique, and the score was amazing. The ending is especially good and yet depressing. **The Rest** This is when Freddy became a comedy character, the cast were all cliches and it wasn’t even scary anymore. The cast usually consisted of not so great actors and/or horrible cliche’s. **Wes Craven’s New Nightmare** Heard great things but it was a big let down. Freddy looked intimidating here, the angle was great, but it wasn’t scary. Not even a little. I can see why people might not like the Elm Street franchise. Depending on what part of the franchise you grew up with, you probably see the character as either classic horror villain, or a cornball character. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-nightmare-on-elm-street-unfairly-hated-because-of-the-sequels/626017.md?page=1)