# Is a semi automatic rifle an assault rifle? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 14, 2016, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375 "2016-06-14T21:08:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2016, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/241 "2016-06-21T22:04:21Z")
> [@Boo\_Boo\_Foo](#): > > I’m not so sure about that. From what I’ve read, there are certain zip codes in the country which are real problem zip codes, they’re “demographic poverty zones” where gun violence and homicide rates are off the dial, relative to the rest of the country. And by extension those key zip codes (about 20 of them is the number I’ve heard suggested) bump up America’s overall stats regarding violent crime and homicide rates. And it appears it’s consistent, year after year. > > While it’s unfair to cherry pick figures just to suit your agenda, it’s not totally out of line to suggest if you pull those 20 key zip codes out of the mix? What’s left behind brings the US back in line with a lot of other developed countries. Put another way, if you’re not living in those 20 key hot spot zip codes, the probability of being involved in violent crime or homicide is much much lower. It’s certainly true that crime is concentrated in particular areas, but that wasn’t my point. My post was about the method used in the homicide (and a little bit about the motive), not the location. Here are some numbers (from [UNODC](http://www.unodc.org/gsh/en/data.html), for what it’s worth) Homicide rate (2012, last year data is available): USA = 4.7 Canada = 1.6 Australia = 1.1 UK = 1.0 The same source says that ~60% of American homicides use a firearm. If you could eliminate guns and none of those murderers resorted to an alternative method, we’d still have a higher homicide rate than those other countries we’re so often compared to. It’s not just guns. Americans stab and beat each other to death at rates much higher than our British cousins. As for your “20 zip codes” theory: USA’s homicide rate is triple Canada’s. If you wanted to bring us down to Canadian levels of homicide, you’re talking about eliminating more than 8,000 of 2014’s 13,472 homicides ([FBI UCR reports](https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2014/crime-in-the-u.s.-2014/offenses-known-to-law-enforcement/expanded-offense)). There’s no frickin’ way that there were 8,000 homicides in just 20 zip codes. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/242 "2016-06-22T00:27:11Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Those one or two peices would change pretty much ANY semi-automatic rifle into a machine gun. there is nothing different about an AR-15 compared to any other semiautomatic rifle. So by your reasoning what you are really saying is that we ought to ban all semi-automatic firearms. :rolleyes: If you’re talking about guns which are designed as assault rifles: auto-load, have very little kick–and can fire low-caliber ammo at sufficient force to punch holes in a body large enough to drop a tangerine through? Yeah,\* all \*of those should be banned from sale to private individuals. Not available for a million dollars. Not available to private mercenary firms. Not available to police officers. Just plain off the market. Is that clear enough? ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/243 "2016-06-22T01:12:44Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > The fact of the matter is that none of the gun controlled measures that are usually trotted out after a mass shooting can really do much to prevent the next mass shooting. You have to make a more meta argument about gun control in general. I have heard that the pink pistols are seeing a huge surge in membership after the Orlando shooting. Apparently the gay community thinks that guns are an effective weapons against guns. Funny how New York City and Washington DC have incredibly tight gun control. Apparently the ruling class types think that gun control works well enough to be desirable anywhere important people concentrate. It’s the rest of us out in the provinces who are being suckered into trying to prepare for a possible Hollywood actioner shootout. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/244 "2016-06-22T01:16:42Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I noticed this in a couple of recent articles in the NYT and on Vox. There was a real concerted effort to connect the Orlando shooting back into “AR-15” even though he used an MCX. They’re like a dog with a bone. The MCX just hit shelves last year. Most folks don’t even know what an MCX is now, and two weeks ago the ones who did largely only did because they were keeping up with the leading edge of firearms tech. Journalists compared it to an AR-15 because at first reports said it was an AR-15. There’s very little information about the Sig Sauer MCX online. ---
**Author:** ![Boo\_Boo\_Foo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e274bd/32.png) [@Boo\_Boo\_Foo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boo_Boo_Foo)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/245 "2016-06-22T01:19:32Z")
Stop being so disingenuous. Regarding a Sig Sauer MCX and a typical AR-15, they are similar enough that you can run a mil spec upper on it. The Sig is a very cool rifle, but other than its unique piston system and lack of buffer assembly, its an AR. Its like arguing that a Sig 1911 is not a 1911 cause its not a Colt. Picking nits is only interesting to pro gun guys in this situation. ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/246 "2016-06-22T02:26:52Z")
> [@Boo\_Boo\_Foo](#): > > Stop being so disingenuous. > > Regarding a Sig Sauer MCX and a typical AR-15, they are similar enough that you can run a mil spec upper on it. The Sig is a very cool rifle, but other than its unique piston system and lack of buffer assembly, its an AR. Its like arguing that a Sig 1911 is not a 1911 cause its not a Colt. Picking nits is only interesting to pro gun guys in this situation. **foolsguinea** is right, the MXC isn’t a clone … if you want to argue is differences are only cosmetic, okay, but that’s not disingenuous. Pro gun guys _are_ interested, and they’re fun to shoot. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/247 "2016-06-22T03:40:59Z")
> [@watchwolf49](#): > > **foolsguinea** is right, the MXC isn’t a clone … if you want to argue is differences are only cosmetic, okay, but that’s not disingenuous. Pro gun guys _are_ interested, and they’re fun to shoot. It really shouldn’t matter, as the end result is the same, but on the other hand the media engages in magical thinking and believes that the AR-15 is something unique when it is not. I’m not sure which I prefer they do. Similarly, [this rifle](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AK-47#/media/File:AK-47_type_II_Part_DM-ST-89-01131.jpg) and [this rifle](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vz._58#/media/File:Sa_58-JH01.jpg) are completely different. Same caliber, same capacity, same basic function, and the second one was almost certainly inspired, but is a mechanically very different and fancier rifle. As are [these](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragunov_sniper_rifle#/media/File:SVD_Dragunov.jpg) [two](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PSL_(rifle)#/media/File:Psl_sniper_rifle.jpeg) “sniper” rifles (the former is more expensive, but a few years ago every person was selling the other one as a “Dragunov.” ---
**Author:** ![Ranger\_Jeff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranger_jeff/32/2065_2.png) [@Ranger\_Jeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranger_Jeff)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/248 "2016-06-22T06:14:04Z")
Apparently, the AR-15 is now the current evil semi-automatic that the Uzi used to be. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/249 "2016-06-22T06:17:39Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > … can fire low-caliber ammo at sufficient force to punch holes in a body large enough to drop a tangerine through … I want one (or two), but … what is it? ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/250 "2016-06-22T12:48:14Z")
> [@Ranger\_Jeff](#): > > Apparently, the AR-15 is now the current evil semi-automatic that the Uzi used to be. The Bushmaster gets no respect. ---
**Author:** ![Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d9b06d/32.png) [@Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boozahol_Squid_P.I)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/251 "2016-06-22T13:20:55Z")
> [@Boo\_Boo\_Foo](#): > > And my theory is this, Australian’s are so “joined at the hip” into American TV culture these days they’ve subconsciously reached a mindset we’re now the 51st, 52nd, 53rd, 54th, 55th, and 56th states of the Union. I hate to break it to you, but the USA is never going to let _all_ the states of Australia in as US states. Hee hee… Queensland… ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/252 "2016-06-22T13:34:08Z")
We’ll let Australia in as a State … are you kidding … they’re only getting _two_ senate seats … and they should count that as blessing, Canada isn’t getting any … > [@Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](#): > > [snip] … Hee hee… Queensland… Georgia, Carolina, Maryland … ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/253 "2016-06-22T14:41:59Z")
> [@watchwolf49](#): > > The Bushmaster gets no respect. It used to be all the rage, but now it’s like last year’s prom queen. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/254 "2016-06-22T18:24:06Z")
> [@Boo\_Boo\_Foo](#): > > Stop being so disingenuous. > > Regarding a Sig Sauer MCX and a typical AR-15, they are similar enough that you can run a mil spec upper on it. The Sig is a very cool rifle, but other than its unique piston system and lack of buffer assembly, its an AR. Its like arguing that a Sig 1911 is not a 1911 cause its not a Colt. Picking nits is only interesting to pro gun guys in this situation. I’m not really disagreeing with you. I’m willing to be precise just to avoid being accused of being ignorant. But I agree the whinging in certain quarters that it “wasn’t really an AR-15” is a bit of misdirection. It’s a gun which looks and acts like an AR-15. Different piston system, a little quieter, but to most observers they are the same thing. And it belongs in unsupervised, private hands on the streets of Orlando to the same degree as any other auto-loading, “one shot one kill” rifle, which in my opinion is not at all. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/255 "2016-06-22T18:31:21Z")
> [@Ranger\_Jeff](#): > > Apparently, the AR-15 is now the current evil semi-automatic that the Uzi used to be. Uzis were scary because they’re compact, full-auto, and–honestly, kind of hard to control. AR-15’s are scary because they fire with an absurd amount of force for most applications, and are for that reason usually not fired in an urban environment, even by SWAT officers who carry them into hostage situations. If you really need a sniper rifle that can go through a window, \*and \*you have cleared the neighborhood, \*and \*the negotiator fails to defuse a dangerous situation, then you might have a reason to fire one. Why some random individual is allowed to carry one around as he pleases is a good question. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/256 "2016-06-22T18:36:32Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > Uzis were scary because they’re compact, full-auto, and–honestly, kind of hard to control. AR-15’s are scary because they fire with an absurd amount of force for most applications, and are for that reason usually not fired in an urban environment, even by SWAT officers who carry them into hostage situations. If you really need a sniper rifle that can go through a window, \*and \*you have cleared the neighborhood, \*and \*the negotiator fails to defuse a dangerous situation, then you might have a reason to fire one. > > Why some random individual is allowed to carry one around as he pleases is a good question. Actually, there are pistols more powerful than the AR. Pretty much any .30 caliber cartridge is 2-3 (or more) times as powerful. And it’s no sniper rifle. At least in stock form. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/257 "2016-06-22T19:30:56Z")
You do realize that whenever you talk down a semi-auto rifle by claiming that there are other guns just as powerful, all you’re doing is making it clear we have to confiscate those other guns as well? ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/258 "2016-06-22T19:47:58Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > :rolleyes: > > If you’re talking about guns which are designed as assault rifles: auto-load, have very little kick–and can fire low-caliber ammo at sufficient force to punch holes in a body large enough to drop a tangerine through? Yeah,\* all \*of those should be banned from sale to private individuals. Not available for a million dollars. Not available to private mercenary firms. Not available to police officers. Just plain off the market. > > Is that clear enough? Wow, you wallow in your ignorance and roll your eyes at me? Wow!!! You’re still wrong on the facts but just for argument’s sake, why are you focusing on assault weapons when it seems like you are talking about semiautomatic weapons? Its it because you are ignorant? ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/259 "2016-06-22T19:48:02Z")
Shotguns only maim, not kill, so they’re A LOT safer … ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2016, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/260 "2016-06-22T20:01:22Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > You do realize that whenever you talk down a semi-auto rifle by claiming that there are other guns just as powerful, all you’re doing is making it clear we have to confiscate those other guns as well? “we”? are you and your pals going to confiscate something from someone? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375.md?page=14)