# Is a semi automatic rifle an assault rifle? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 14, 2016, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375 "2016-06-14T21:08:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/141 "2016-06-16T17:57:02Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > What parameters? Parameters for what? Is walking around with a gun statistically better than NOT walking around with a gun? The “need” criteria. Do you have any evidence to support your claim? ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/142 "2016-06-16T17:57:38Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Hahahaha. You attempted to exclude self-defense from this conversation in post 103 accompanied by a threat of “mocking”. :rolleyes: That must be why you chose to refer to people who use “Because I can because of my rights” as too stupid or afraid to give other/better reasons YOU believe to be acceptable. While you’re entitled to your opinion, you do not control what other people can say. We The People have a right of self-defense and a freedom to speak out. > > The 2nd Amendment of the U.S. Bill of (Individual) Rights is about an individual’s right to bear arms for self-defense. If you’re attempting to keep self-defense (aka “Because I can because of my rights”) out of the conversation, you’ll need to abolish the 2nd Amendment. And you simply do not have the votes to abolish the 2nd Amendment. thanks for reposting that, I like rereading stuff. I don’t consider “To defend my home” to be the same reason as “Because I can” And if someone who has dozens of semi-automatic weapons and 30K ammo in their house uses “To defend my home” as their reason for having that many, I will laugh. At them. For being overly paranoid. But, as I said, I wouldn’t try to stop them from legally owning those weapons. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/143 "2016-06-16T17:59:35Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > The “need” criteria. Do you have any evidence to support your claim? Sorry, I’m not sure what you mean here. Not being snarky or anything, but I don’t know, really. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/144 "2016-06-16T18:02:12Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Sorry, I’m not sure what you mean here. Not being snarky or anything, but I don’t know, really. Do you have any evidence to support this claim: > [@Slash1972](#): > > I say the probability of a meteor strike on your house is the same as you **needing your gun** to defend yourself in a public place. The follow up invitation about defining your parameters refers in part to the “need” criteria. I’ve bolded it above. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/145 "2016-06-16T18:08:20Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > Do you have any evidence to support this claim: > The follow up invitation about defining your parameters refers in part to the “need” criteria. I’ve bolded it above. If I had to quote my post to ensure of my meaning I would bold this part: I say the probability of a meteor strike on your house is the same as you **needing your gun to defend yourself in a public place** I define “needing your gun to defend yourself in a public place” as being in a public place and needing your gun to defend yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/146 "2016-06-16T18:09:38Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > If I had to quote my post to ensure of my meaning I would bold this part: > > I say the probability of a meteor strike on your house is the same as you **needing your gun to defend yourself in a public place** > > I define “needing your gun to defend yourself in a public place” as being in a public place and needing your gun to defend yourself. So do you have any evidence? ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/147 "2016-06-16T18:17:10Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Besides the fact that I’m not talking about keeping a gun at home, I hold statistics of home invasion from a web page of people who sell home invasion insurance in low regard. I guess I’m missing your point … almost all guns are kept in the home … The statistics are certainly misleading, however that 1 in 5 chance _over a lifetime_ may well be accurate. I’m sure 99.99% of these never result in violence of any kind. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/148 "2016-06-16T18:23:34Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > So do you have any evidence? From here: [The epidemiology of self-defense gun use: Evidence from the National Crime Victimization Surveys 2007–2011](http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0091743515001188) > [@](#): > > Compared to other protective actions, the National Crime Victimization Surveys provide little evidence that SDGU is uniquely beneficial in reducing the likelihood of injury or property loss There is also the video I linked to earlier. That’s a start, I could probably find more if you need me to. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/149 "2016-06-16T18:26:25Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > From here: > > [The epidemiology of self-defense gun use: Evidence from the National Crime Victimization Surveys 2007–2011](http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0091743515001188) > > There is also the video I linked to earlier. > > That’s a start, I could probably find more if you need me to. I do need more. First, what part of the linked article are you referring to? Second, this isn’t evidence of your claim… Because you made the claim that the probability of a meteor strike on your house is the same as you needing your gun to defend yourself in a public place. There is no discussion of meteor strikes in the link. Do you have any evidence for your claim? And third, the link talks about incidents of SDGU occurring, not a need for defensive use. There could be a need for defensive use without an occurrence. This is why I asked you to lay out your parameters around “need”. ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/150 "2016-06-16T18:26:33Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > It sort of simulates a full-auto-ish rate of fire, but it doesn’t make your gun an actual full-auto “machine gun” in the eyes of the law. Bump-fire .It simulates it so much that I’m not comfortable with it. It basically makes the gun bounce back and forth from backward pressure on your trigger finger to forward pressure on your shoulder at the the fastest rate gas operation of an AR-15 can make happen. Here’s another video. [Yee-Ha!](https://youtu.be/U7DTjSla-O8?t=132) :dubious: Q: What bear would you take down with this? What Elk? What deer? What human being needs 50 shots center mass in less than 30 seconds in order to stop being a threat to you? [So Rarely do I Ever quote Ronald Reagan](http://www.azquotes.com/picture-quotes/quote-i-do-not-believe-in-taking-away-the-right-of-the-citizen-for-sporting-for-hunting-and-ronald-reagan-57-76-62.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/151 "2016-06-16T18:29:13Z")
> [@watchwolf49](#): > > I guess I’m missing your point … almost all guns are kept in the home … My point started when someone stated “Mass shootings: are such infrequent events that you are about as likely to be hit (but not necessarily killed) by lightning as you are to be killed in a mass shooting” My question was if they are so rare, why do we need to carry guns around to protect ourselves from them? That led to probabilities of crime and probabilities of needing a gun to defend yourself while outside. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/152 "2016-06-16T18:30:26Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > …And if someone who has dozens of semi-automatic weapons and 30K ammo in their house uses “To defend my home” as their reason for having that many, I will laugh. At them. For being overly paranoid. But, as I said, I wouldn’t try to stop them from legally owning those weapons. (post shortened) You can’t stop them from legally owning those weapons. Why you laugh is up to you. However, I don’t believe your laughing/mocking will convince anyone to change their minds. Logic and reason might. If presented correctly. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/153 "2016-06-16T18:32:23Z")
> [@bump](#): > > At the time, there was a TINY standing army, and a whole lot of militias- typically local militias under the aegis of whatever state or territory they were part of. Think the Minutemen at Lexington/Concord- **local guys with their own rifles** who defended their settlements against hostile Indians, and when push came to shove, vs. the British Army. This remained the model up past the Civil War- most units were state regiments composed of companies from various localities. > > The point of the 2nd Amendment was to ensure that the government couldn’t do away with the local militias by revoking the right to keep and bear arms. In other words, since the men provided their own weapons, a right to keep and bear them, kept the local militias in business. Why, you may ask, did they care about the local militias? Because having local militias meant that any sort of tyranny from a central government could be resisted by the people, much like they’d recently done vs. Britain. > > In today’s world, you may argue that the National Guard fills that role, and in some senses, it does. But it fundamentally does NOT provide that armed check against central tyranny, being armed BY the central government, and tightly integrated into its military. Hence the thinking that an individual right to keep and bear arms provides for a potential armed resistance against central tyranny that the NG does not provide. It’s a little bit out there, I realize, but that’s the thinking. And before someone says “Well, civilians armed with AR-15s can’t fight the US Army”, I’ll point out that the Viet Cong and Iraqi insurgents did so quite effectively with very similar levels of technology. > > The real question then, comes down to whether or not a certain level of insurance against tyrannical government is a better choice than some level of gun-related violence. Bolding mine. This point seems to be constantly overlooked by the “militia=National Guard” crowd. If a muster of the militia meant people getting handed rifles out of a state armory and then turning them back in when they were done, a militia would be zero deterrent against potential tyranny, because the armories would be the first thing a despotic government would lock down. And while standing armies were in first place for being held in suspicion by English-speaking people in the 18th century, second place went to “select” militias- people vetted for loyalty to the current regime and given special permission to have arms denied the rest of the populace, to help maintain order. That’s today’s National Guard more or less. > [@Slash1972](#): > > thanks for reposting that, I like rereading stuff. > > I don’t consider “To defend my home” to be the same reason as “Because I can” > > And if someone who has dozens of semi-automatic weapons and 30K ammo in their house uses “To defend my home” as their reason for having that many, I will laugh. At them. For being overly paranoid. But, as I said, I wouldn’t try to stop them from legally owning those weapons. Someone who has dozens of firearms has them because they’re an aficianado, not because a few guns wouldn’t suffice. And while 1000 rounds sounds like a lot, it’s a pretty typical amount of ammo to keep for each caliber of gun you own; it goes fast during range practice. 30K is on the upper end I’ll admit. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/154 "2016-06-16T18:33:43Z")
> [@Count\_Blucher](#): > > Bump-fire .It simulates it so much that I’m not comfortable with it. It basically makes the gun bounce back and forth from backward pressure on your trigger finger to forward pressure on your shoulder at the the fastest rate gas operation of an AR-15 can make happen. These bump fire devices are already illegal in CA. [CA PC 12020](http://law.justia.com/codes/california/2005/pen/12020-12040.html): > [@](#): > > (23) As used in this section, a “multiburst trigger activator” > means one of the following devices: > (A) A device designed or redesigned to be attached to a > semiautomatic firearm which allows the firearm to discharge two or > more shots in a burst by activating the device. > (B) A manual or power-driven trigger activating device constructed > and designed so that when attached to a semiautomatic firearm it > increases the rate of fire of that firearm. Simple possession of one even not connected to a firearm would be a felony. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/155 "2016-06-16T18:36:30Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > And while 1000 rounds sounds like a lot, it’s a pretty typical amount of ammo to keep for each caliber of gun you own; it goes fast during range practice. 30K is on the upper end I’ll admit. And ammo lasts for pretty much ever. If they find a good price, people will buy a lot. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/156 "2016-06-16T18:36:42Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > There could be a need for defensive use without an occurrence. This makes no sense. What about this: From here: [NRA News Program promo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBGvJfQPPeI) “The odds of you and me needing a gun to protect our lives is not that much better than Colion the Incredible putting these cards back in the exact order” while flashing a sign with an extremely low probability on it. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/157 "2016-06-16T18:40:32Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > (post shortened) > > You can’t stop them from legally owning those weapons. > > Why you laugh is up to you. However, I don’t believe your laughing/mocking will convince anyone to change their minds. Logic and reason might. If presented correctly. I’m not trying to stop them from legally owning those weapons. I’m not trying to stop someone from burning the US Flag as an exercise of their 1st Amendment rights either. But I do think they are morons and laugh at them, so there’s that. Logic and reason cannot be used against “Because I can” Nor do I want to actually try anyway. I get more enjoyment out of laughing at paranoid people and their stockpile of guns needed to “Defend against the government and tyranny” ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/158 "2016-06-16T18:43:14Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > And ammo lasts for pretty much ever. If they find a good price, people will buy a lot. Well, honey lasts a long time too, but I wouldn’t buy 30K jars of the stuff if it was on sale. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/159 "2016-06-16T18:45:53Z")
n/m ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375/160 "2016-06-16T18:54:29Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > My point started when someone stated “Mass shootings: are such infrequent events that you are about as likely to be hit (but not necessarily killed) by lightning as you are to be killed in a mass shooting” > > My question was if they are so rare, why do we need to carry guns around to protect ourselves from them? > > That led to probabilities of crime and probabilities of needing a gun to defend yourself while outside. It’s been pointed out it depends on the situation. The probabilities would range over quite a large margin, from almost zero sitting in Carnegie Hall to near certainty hanging on a street corner in the bad part of town flashing $100 bills. [NOAA reports](http://www.lightningsafety.noaa.gov/fatalities.shtml) 31 deaths per year from lightning strikes … that does seem to back up the claim you’re arguing against. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-a-semi-automatic-rifle-an-assault-rifle/757375.md?page=9)